Should Butler have got the MVP?

50-yard-line said:

Brady. Not close - and I'm someone who wishes QBs got less of the glory than they always do.

107 PR, 330 yards, 37-for-50, 4 tds to 4 different receivers - and all that against the Legion of Boom. Unprecedented against that team. And in the dark spots of the second half, when more than half the people in the game thread had surrendered (yeah, I know, that's not really a high bar there), Brady put the team on his back and carried them home. It was a performance for the ages by a quarterback the likes of whom we'll probably never see again.

This might have been the greatest moment of Tom Brady's career, and I think we all know where that career ranks.

(But Butler deserved the truck - and what he really deserves is to get a shot to build a great career of his own. Kid's got game.)

Click to expand...

I agree Butler deserved the truck and Brady deserved the MVP

You don't deserve the MVP for 1 play at the end of the game over someone who was the MVP for the other 59 minutes and 50 seconds of the game.

Brady won that hands down, it wasn't even close. His 4th quarter performance was historic, never been done before and was against the most elite defense in the league over the last 3 years, a defense that some were comparing to the 85 Bears..

That game will be highlighted and that 4th quarter talked about 50 years from now with people going over Brady's legendary performance.

Great play by the young kid Butler, Most Valuable Play for sure but not Most Valuable Player.

Butler did a lot more than 1 play. He was the dominant defensive player in the game for the 2nd half. He broke up the 35 yard attempt to Kearse late in the 3rd quarter that would have put the game out of reach. He defended the big 3rd down pass to Lockette where they both fell down. He defended the slant to Kearse on the final drive, as well as Kearse's miracle catch which was a brilliant Butler effort except for an unlucky bounce. Then he tops it off with one of the greatest db feats of all time, on the 1 yd line!

When the QB plays as well as Brady did you have to give it to him, but to characterize Butler's day as 1 great play is missing the story of the 2nd half for the Pats D.

scroll down to the last section of this article and look at the pics of Butler in action:
http://mmqb.si.com/2015/02/24/malco...ts-nfl-vicksburg-mississippi-hometown-parade/

Ken Canin said:

The MVP for the Super Bowl was presumably between Brady, Edelman, Gronk and Butler, with Brady winning it.

But I still don't think this was a great game for Brady except for the 4th quarter. I don't think you can give the MVP to a QB who gives up two picks like that. In fact, a good portion of his long passes were picks. I'm sick of people choosing the best plays of a QB and forgetting picks - one key reason I thought Dilfer was undervalued even though he had zero post-season turnovers in his SB win.

Edelman was spectacular, and Gronk too. Vereen was critical as well.

Still, I think the MVP should have gone to Butler for two very simple reasons:

1. Without Butler's interception, the Patriots would have almost certainly lost the game.

2. I don't think any other player would have made that play. I've still never seen any play like that. It's a huge gamble by the cornerback, and I think most corners are conditioned not to take such a gamble. And the explosiveness off the line was unreal.

Now, if you want to give the MVP to Brady for being the MVP of the *season*, well, that's reasonable. But for the game itself, I feel like what Butler did was unprecedented. (I asked in another thread if anyone had seen an interception as athletically and timing-wise as shocking, nobody had.)

Click to expand...

They don't give MVP for one play. Unless Butler could also be almost perfect in scoring 14 coming from behind, it's just a great play and a nice story.

He sniffed the play out because the patriots had run it, and beat him on it, on practice. It wasn't any huge gamble, he went after the man he was supposed to cover.

Another corner who sniffed out the play and had the advantage of big browner standing up the pick and Lockette running a less than crisp route. Again, great play. Brady was easily the MVP. There's no play to make without the flawless drives for 14 points in the quarter.

I've seen lots of players jump routes. Usually, it' a play where another dback covers their gamble, but on a one yard pass where you know who your assignment is, what is he gambling? You either make a play or it's a touchdown.

No. Edelman maybe

ctpatsfan77 said:

OTOH, I'd give better than even odds that if they opened the voting lines after the SB ended, Butler would have won, ahem, running away.

Click to expand...

You're saying he would have jumped in front?

Warning: I'll point that Brady screwed up a bit. Don't read if you don't like it.

Your two comparisons are interesting. Brady's 10 point comeback record and the first interception of the season for Butler *AND* any of the season from the 1 yard line, were setup when the players made three significant mistakes, so big they had to leave the field (Brady's whole offense lost possession, and Butler was taken out immediately after giving up the deep throw). Those players avenged their mistakes with a win by doing something nobody did before, which must feel great.

On an different metric, the only mistake Edelman was involved with was when Brady missed him for a TD. Even then, Edelman requested the same play, and it worked in the 4th quarter for a score. And he caught long first downs for us in those important drives.

The thing is, had Edelman made mistakes, too, we might not have been able to recover.

Oh, Edelman also took out their starting cornerback.

Edelman is at another level. When Belichick hinted to Welker that Edelman might be able to take over the punt / kick returns after returning a TD, here's what happened:
Welker: "if he's that good, he can have it"
Belichick: "that's not very competitive!"

What Butler did on the last play, is exactly what Edelman did all game long. Edelman was in the entire game just like Tom Brady plus made up for some Brady's mistakes, such as tackling and knocking a guy out of the club for interception Brady, catching footballs and gaining yards after the catch, and being in the right places to score.

Edelman and Brady would be good candidates, Butler not so much.

To answer the question.

"No."

Butler should get a game ball, a whole bunch of opportunities to cut commercials, the benefit of the doubt when it comes to making the roster next season and hopefully the confidence to build a great career in the NFL.

When the excitement dies down, people will look on those two drives that Brady led in the fourth quarter as among the greatest moments in Super Bowl history. He methodically moved his team down the field twice against one of the best Defenses ever to take the field in February, putting pass after pass into a one or two foot window where only his guy could catch it with, as I recall, only one incompletion.

And, the jury is out on whether the question itself is posed by a troll who joined the Forum a couple of weeks before the SB. If I'm proven wrong about that, I'll apologize, but check back with me in six months before you ask me to do so.

The team was the MVP, IMHO.

Not the MVP but I'll name a player who had a very influential play in a season full of them and I haven't seen it mentioned.


Brandon Bolden; in a season full of big hits his block on Cliff Avril knocked him out with a concussion.

Brady threw for over 300 yards on 37/50, 74% completion and 4 touchdowns to 4 different receivers.Seattle simply do not give you those numbers in the playoffs, ask Brees, Rodgers and Manning. Yes he threw 2 picks but he overcame them in the 4th quarter which further strengthened his mvp case. Butler played one half, not enough to be MVP.Had Edelman caught 2 tds, he might have won though.

RayClay said:

I've seen lots of players jump routes.

Click to expand...

You know what?

Name one play in the last five years where a player "jumped a route" in as impossible fashion as Butler did to Wilson/Lockette.

I don't know how to define "impossible" but roughly speaking the play looks impossible at first, second, and third viewing.

I'm not talking about the game situation or pick 6's or anything like that. Just the jump of the route and the interception. You know a short slant with the corner that far off the line is supposed to be impossible to intercept at all: the WR needs to run about 70% of the distance of the corner, and the WR knows where he is going pre-snap.

And if you can't name one jumped route as athletically and skill-wise impressive as Butler's, then stop saying (not just you but all the Butler-detractors) that Butler just "jumped a route" or that it was a "great play" like 20 other "great plays."

I'm not familiar with all the jumped routes in the world but I do know that I've never seen a jumped route like that and asking for two weeks in several threads anyone on this message board to name one, nobody has. So it's not a "jumped route" or a "great play" it's unprecedented or nearly so.

I'm saying "5 years" because that's how far back Game Rewind goes.

Ken Canin said:

You know what?

Name one play in the last five years where a player "jumped a route" in as impossible fashion as Butler did to Wilson/Lockette.

I don't know how to define "impossible" but roughly speaking the play looks impossible at first, second, and third viewing.

I'm not talking about the game situation or pick 6's or anything like that. Just the jump of the route and the interception. You know a short slant with the corner that far off the line is supposed to be impossible to intercept at all: the WR needs to run about 70% of the distance of the corner, and the WR knows where he is going pre-snap.

And if you can't name one jumped route as athletically and skill-wise impressive as Butler's, then stop saying (not just you but all the Butler-detractors) that Butler just "jumped a route" or that it was a "great play" like 20 other "great plays."

I'm not familiar with all the jumped routes in the world but I do know that I've never seen a jumped route like that and asking for two weeks in several threads anyone on this message board to name one, nobody has. So it's not a "jumped route" or a "great play" it's unprecedented or nearly so.

I'm saying "5 years" because that's how far back Game Rewind goes.

Click to expand...

He knew what the play was. He made a great play. He is not superman or God, as you seem to imply. Other cornerbacks who recognized the play could have done the same thing given the sloppiness of the execution.

I don't know why "it was a great play" is insufficient for you. He practiced against the play, he sniffed it out, he made a great play.

Ken Canin said:

You know what?

Name one play in the last five years where a player "jumped a route" in as impossible fashion as Butler did to Wilson/Lockette.

I don't know how to define "impossible" but roughly speaking the play looks impossible at first, second, and third viewing.

I'm not talking about the game situation or pick 6's or anything like that. Just the jump of the route and the interception. You know a short slant with the corner that far off the line is supposed to be impossible to intercept at all: the WR needs to run about 70% of the distance of the corner, and the WR knows where he is going pre-snap.

And if you can't name one jumped route as athletically and skill-wise impressive as Butler's, then stop saying (not just you but all the Butler-detractors) that Butler just "jumped a route" or that it was a "great play" like 20 other "great plays."

I'm not familiar with all the jumped routes in the world but I do know that I've never seen a jumped route like that and asking for two weeks in several threads anyone on this message board to name one, nobody has. So it's not a "jumped route" or a "great play" it's unprecedented or nearly so.

I'm saying "5 years" because that's how far back Game Rewind goes.

Click to expand...

Here's a play from the early 60's. Take away the athleticism and practice and knowing where the ball's going.

Ken Canin said:

You know what?

Name one play in the last five years where a player "jumped a route" in as impossible fashion as Butler did to Wilson/Lockette.

I don't know how to define "impossible" but roughly speaking the play looks impossible at first, second, and third viewing.

I'm not talking about the game situation or pick 6's or anything like that. Just the jump of the route and the interception. You know a short slant with the corner that far off the line is supposed to be impossible to intercept at all: the WR needs to run about 70% of the distance of the corner, and the WR knows where he is going pre-snap.

And if you can't name one jumped route as athletically and skill-wise impressive as Butler's, then stop saying (not just you but all the Butler-detractors) that Butler just "jumped a route" or that it was a "great play" like 20 other "great plays."

I'm not familiar with all the jumped routes in the world but I do know that I've never seen a jumped route like that and asking for two weeks in several threads anyone on this message board to name one, nobody has. So it's not a "jumped route" or a "great play" it's unprecedented or nearly so.

I'm saying "5 years" because that's how far back Game Rewind goes.

Click to expand...

Seems to me that we need to keep two possibly conflicting ideas in our heads at the same time here.

Butler did do more than make one great play (and, it was indeed a "great play," which I define as one that will be talked about for years and taught at every level of the game for multiple reasons, even beyond those you site). But, in addition to that great play, he also made several important plays, none more significant than having the presence of mind to push Kearse out of bounds after his circus catch (he also got away with a deftly executed "trip" at one point when he was beaten on a critical third down).

But, what Brady did on two consecutive drives in the fourth quarter will, once the dust has settled and people are able to look beyond Butler's brilliant play that saved the game, also be talked about for years to come. He led the Pats down the field twice, executing precision pass after precision pass, often into a window no bigger than two or three feet, with, as I recall, only one incompletion. He did this against one of the greatest defenses every to take the field in February, and I don't care how "banged up" it was.

So, the conflicting ideas are that they couldn't have won the game without the accomplishments of Brady or Butler, but Brady deserves to have been MVP for bringing them back from ten down in the fourth quarter and completing more passes than any other QB in the history of the SB. He was miked up for the entire game and it's clear that he held the team together through those dark moments in the third quarter and in face of the challenges of the fourth quarter. I don't even think it's a close call.

As I said elsewhere, Butler deserves a game ball, a chance to cut a few commercials that will pay him far more than his Rookie UDFA salary, whatever boost in salary the CBA allows, the benefit of the doubt when it comes to making the roster next year and, hopefully, a boost to his confidence that will allow him to go from an obscure guy down the depth chart to a great career in the NFL. In other words, I am pulling for Butler and hope that, five years from now, this is viewed as the beginning of Malcolm Butler's NFL prominence and not his "one great moment."

Making a game-winning play at the end of the game does not automatically make you the Most Valuable Player.

Here's a similar comparison. If the Seahawks score, and a Patriots 5th WR, a rookie nobody heard of, returns the kick off for a TD, do they get the MVP? No way.

DELETE ME

"Are you kidding me?!?

What a play!

You're unbelievable man!"

Hero: "Thank you man!"

TFB: "Way to go!"

What this kid cemented for us. For TFB. For BB. For the entire New England Nation!

Hero forever!

13:56 mark. I can watch this forever. Goosebumps!

I have a feeling that Butler won't just fall under the radar. He has some potential to carve out a nice career for himself, which is awesome. He made 3 fantastic plays late in the Super Bowl. He got his hand on every single pass, unfortunately one turned out to be horrible luck.

Kdo5 said:

I have a feeling that Butler won't just fall under the radar. He has some potential to carve out a nice career for himself, which is awesome. He made 3 fantastic plays late in the Super Bowl. He got his hand on every single pass, unfortunately one turned out to be horrible luck.

Click to expand...

I don't think that he will be a player that shined in the super bowl and then dissappeared, like others have. Mainly because I think he has showed potential through the whole season, starting in pre season(and earlier according to our players).