2015 NFL Veteran Cuts Thread

Deus Irae said:

Top 5 needs, no particular order:

DT
OL
WR
TE
OPR

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I for one would add CB In that mix. I really believe the Arrington/Ryan/Dennard troika needs an upgrade. Was just watching a replay of Devontae Adams look like Terrell Owens against us on NFL Network.

Deus Irae said:

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Bush = perfect fit.

I think we can not ignore the fact that Edelman has had a few concussions in the past and there exists a real possibility that he could miss time if his bell gets rung next season.

Do we really think amendola and lafell can carry us if Edelman is out?

Or are we putting our eggs in the " Dobson suddenly figures it all out" basket?

Competition at the wr spot only makes us better.

Ochmed Jones said:

I think we can not ignore the fact that Edelman has had a few concussions in the past and there exists a real possibility that he could miss time if his bell gets rung next season.

Do we really think amendola and lafell can carry us if Edelman is out?

Or are we putting our eggs in the " Dobson suddenly figures it all out" basket?

Competition at the wr spot only makes us better.

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I agree. The position of WR still needs to see some improvement.

2014 was 2014, and while they did a very nice job at the position (although WR3 could have been upgraded, Amendola showed up in the postseason very nicely) last year, we still need the additional depth and competition for the upcoming season.

Like you said, should one of Edelman/LaFell/Gronk (TE) have become injured, things would have looked MUCH differently.

patsinthesnow said:

Our OL currently has two starting guards that can be upgraded and no depth at guard as well. A rookie could come in day 1 and win a starting job at those positions. Edelman/Lafell aren't getting dethroned anytime soon.

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I think we could realistically claim that a rookie at postion____X can theoretically step in and contribute day one at many positions on the team. I definitely believe that they'll be taking a high round draft pick at IOL for sure, possibly even round one. Hopefully that guy can become the "new" version of Bryan Stork, and Stork himself will continue to improve as well.

I don't think the concern is necessarily about Edelman/LaFell getting "dethroned" any time soon, but more about the possibility of getting by should one get injured. I also believe that we need to improve upon the WR3 spot, especially if one or both of Amendola/Vereen will be moving on somewhere else. There's still the lack of a viable downfield threat that can help to open things up underneath as well. There's lots of reasons to include WR as a position of need in my opinion.

supafly said:

I think we could realistically claim that a rookie at postion____X can theoretically step in and contribute day one at many positions on the team. I definitely believe that they'll be taking a high round draft pick at IOL for sure, possibly even round one. Hopefully that guy can become the "new" version of Bryan Stork, and Stork himself will continue to improve as well.

I don't think the concern is necessarily about Edelman/LaFell getting "dethroned" any time soon, but more about the possibility of getting by should one get injured. I also believe that we need to improve upon the WR3 spot, especially if one or both of Amendola/Vereen will be moving on somewhere else. There's still the lack of a viable downfield threat that can help to open things up underneath as well. There's lots of reasons to include WR as a position of need in my opinion.

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While I agree that theoretically there are many positions that a rookie being picked 32 or later might contribute in as a rookie, I personally find it unreasonable to expect a rookie to be a major contributor, except at OG.

And I'm fine with rookies taking a year or two to make significant contributions. We have a fine team, with depth at almost all positions. We'll see who we lose in the next week, but I suspect that almost anyone we lose will be replaced by a veteran free agent.

Ideally, we will go into the draft without a real "need". However, it does seem very likely that Belichick will want to add an OG, even if the player needs a year to develop.

Also, while it is "possible" that an OG is drafted in the first round, later is much more likely. Belichick is starting a center he drafted in the 4th. Why should he suddenly thinks that he needs to use a first for a guard? I certainly would NOT object to an OG at 32 or even a move up to get one.

mgteich said:

While I agree that theoretically there are many positions that a rookie being picked 32 or later might contribute in as a rookie, I personally find it unreasonable to expect a rookie to be a major contributor, except at OG.

And I'm fine with rookies taking a year or two to make significant contributions. We have a fine team, with depth at almost all positions. We'll see who we lose in the next week, but I suspect that almost anyone we lose will be replaced by a veteran free agent.

Ideally, we will go into the draft without a real "need". However, it does seem very likely that Belichick will want to add an OG, even if the player needs a year to develop.

Also, while it is "possible" that an OG is drafted in the first round, later is much more likely. Belichick is starting a center he drafted in the 4th. Why should he suddenly thinks that he needs to use a first for a guard? I certainly would NOT object to an OG at 32 or even a move up to get one.

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Yes, I realize the past history of refusing to draft IOL higher in the draft, so that could certainly continue this year as well. I'm simply pointing out the option. I do think if the right guy is there, Belichick may strongly consider taking him. We'll have to see.

I think it'd be difficult to debate your theory that players generally take 1-2 yrs to develop, although there are certainly positions which can help to improve their likelihood of seeing time. After all, we just saw our 10th DB make the game winning play in the SB--even if that's a rare occurrence. As always, injuries/outside factors can often factor into this decision making process.

Ross12 said:

So Bush is a talented 3rd down back who has worked with some of NE's coaches before, but can be injury prone at times, and will likely come cheaper than the team's outgoing FA 3rd down back? And since he was cut by his previous team he won't count against the compensatory pick formula?

Can anyone find a reason why BB would NOT sign him? Sounds like the stars are aligned on this one.

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He does fumble. But seriously he seems like a great fit if he comes cheaply, but he might not be as cheap as all of us seem to think he will be, everyone knows that he had 1500 yards in 2013

Jangles said:

I swear every year you're in the we don't need any more receivers camp.

Amendola was barely better than worthless in the regular season, and the kids on the roster weren't any better.

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Right now we have LaFell, Edelman, Amendola, Dobson, Tyms, Boyce at WR.

Do you think that is a bigger need than Revis?
We have Chung, Wilson, Ebner and Harmon at S. Is WR a bigger need than that?
We do not have a starting LG, and when he was out the OL struggled. Is WR a bigger need than that?
At RB we would be relying on James White or Brandon Bolden in the Vereen role which is 50% of the snaps. IS WR a bigger need than that?
We have no K. Is WR a bigger need than that?

We always need WRs but right now we have greater needs.

supafly said:

Yes, I realize the past history of refusing to draft IOL higher in the draft, so that could certainly continue this year as well. I'm simply pointing out the option. I do think if the right guy is there, Belichick may strongly consider taking him. We'll have to see.

I think it'd be difficult to debate your theory that players generally take 1-2 yrs to develop, although there are certainly positions which can help to improve their likelihood of seeing time. After all, we just saw our 10th DB make the game winning play in the SB--even if that's a rare occurrence. As always, injuries/outside factors can often factor into this decision making process.

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I think that BBs history shows he will draft the player, not the position. He has drafted T,G,TE,DT,DE,ILB,OLB,CB,RB in the first round and WR often in the second.
It would seem that the only reason S or C are the missing positions (other than QB for obvious reasons) is that the right guy wasn't there.

As far as the development theory, I agree with you that if you look at BBs 1st round picks a very high percentage contribute a lot as rookies, and many later picks do as well, including UDFAs.

I think that about 95% of Patriot fans consider Revis to be their to priority and McCourty second.

mgteich said:

You imply that if Amendola is cut that Belichick might rely on Dobson, and a mid-late round rookie to fill the three wide receiver spots. I strongly disagree. Belichick would likely bring in 2-3 wide receivers to compete with Dobson and Tyms.

I also disagree with the idea that our three receivers are so good (and never injured) that they give us the best offense in the NFL.

I think that we need depth. We also need someone to actually run the patterns in the 3 WR set. Not having an effective #3 WR essentially limits us to a 2 WR - 2 TE set. The patriots have had problems finding receivers who understand the offense. Dobson and Tyms are not going to magically become dependable. If Amendola isn't coming back, there will be lots of competition.

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supafly said:

I think we could realistically claim that a rookie at postion____X can theoretically step in and contribute day one at many positions on the team. I definitely believe that they'll be taking a high round draft pick at IOL for sure, possibly even round one. Hopefully that guy can become the "new" version of Bryan Stork, and Stork himself will continue to improve as well.

I don't think the concern is necessarily about Edelman/LaFell getting "dethroned" any time soon, but more about the possibility of getting by should one get injured. I also believe that we need to improve upon the WR3 spot, especially if one or both of Amendola/Vereen will be moving on somewhere else. There's still the lack of a viable downfield threat that can help to open things up underneath as well. There's lots of reasons to include WR as a position of need in my opinion.

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Free agency is simple from the Pats' point of view. Resign/Franchise McCourty and extend Revis. After those moves, we will probably have to do some restructuring/make some cuts to get under the cap. Then we can sign:

a receiving RB (Bush, Vereen, Spiller, etc)
Gostkowski
Connolly

and hopefully have room for our draft picks.

We can't afford a WR3 in FA, except for the usual vet. min camp bodies. That leaves the draft:

The WRs that will be available at 32 are bad value. Even 64 to an extent.

What resources are you looking to spend on this 3rd WR?
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Note: Despite having the worst WR3 in all of football from weeks 1-12 (Amendola's production to snapcount was about deadlast in the NFL) we still had the best offense in the NFL. How is that a "need" exactly?

Slagathor said:

I for one would add CB In that mix. I really believe the Arrington/Ryan/Dennard troika needs an upgrade. Was just watching a replay of Devontae Adams look like Terrell Owens against us on NFL Network.

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Ya go spend money on a #4 and #5 CB that could be used on more pressing needs.

Humor me on who you have in mind and what type of money they would be coming to the Pats for.

Zuma said:

Reggie Bush would make a great Vereen replacement...and cheaper

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Bush was a thousand yard rushed two years ago. I can't see Vereen ever being that. Not sure how cheap he'd come, though.

JMC00 said:

Ya go spend money on a #4 and #5 CB that could be used on more pressing needs.

Humor me on who you have in mind and what type of money they would be coming to the Pats for.

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Another Corner back on the best and most likely deepest group in the league when we have zip at other crucial areas.

The off season - more entertaining than the regular season.

Bruins29 said:

I cant believe this post. As if BM isnt a big enough head case

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He's a locker room leader and is not even close to a "head case." He has BPD, for which he receives treatment. After he started receiving treatment, all antics ceased.

As for Bush, he'll be 30 in March and he's made of glass. He also fumbles a lot. He'll probably command a similar price to Vereen, and while I'm not a huge Vereen fan, the choice between the two is fairly obvious.

primetime said:

He's a locker room leader and is not even close to a "head case." He has BPD, for which he receives treatment. After he started receiving treatment, all antics ceased.

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Great, lets take this as a numbered exercise.

1. the odds that JM will want him back are.....

2. Add in the odds we can afford him. Is he completely restructuring.

3. And, is it prudent to spend money there (that kind anyway) when we have no kicker, no Revis, possibly no elite FS, possibly no excellent Left Tackle, no 3rd down back, actually maybe not even a #1 RB, severe help needed at the OL...etc

4. Also, who would he take snaps from? Lafell?

That is great that he has worked out his issues but it dosent mean that his personality is a match for the Pats.

Deus Irae said:

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What are you implying with this? Lol I'm not sure if you agree or you're making fun...

Bruins29 said:

Great, lets take this as a numbered exercise.

1. the odds that JM will want him back are.....

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Given that he'd immediately be the best WR on the team...

2. Add in the odds we can afford him. Is he completely restructuring.

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This is assuming he's cut, at which point he would be a free agent. You know, since we're discussing this in the "veteran cuts" thread.

3. And, is it prudent to spend money there (that kind anyway) when we have no kicker, no Revis, possibly no elite FS, possibly no excellent Left Tackle, no 3rd down back, actually maybe not even a #1 RB, severe help needed at the OL...etc

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Yes, the team needs help at WR. Spending to sign a WR in no way precludes them from bringing back Revis, McCourty, Vereen, or Gostkowski... the Patriots have plenty of cap space, and Solder isn't a free agent, so I'm not sure what the left tackle thing is about.

4. Also, who would he take snaps from? Lafell?

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It doesn't matter, he'd immediately be the best WR on the team. LaFell is a fine player but he's no Brandon Marshall.

That is great that he has worked out his issues. Did his psychiatrist tell you he is much better? Or his team mates?

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http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2014/10...-the-leader-you-want-but-hes-the-one-you-got/

For the most part, Marshall has been a model citizen and player since coming to Chicago with many red flags. He has built up the respect of his teammates, become a league spokesperson for mental health awareness — a diagnoses of which probably saved Marshall’s football career — and has gone from suspended domestic abuser to a one-time go-to for Roger Goodell to try to solve the league’s domestic violence problem.

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