Contracts to deal with

Free agency will show the fair market value for a 33 year old NT

chasa said:

fair option for both sides?

I think Vince probably feels the patriots paying him the 9 million is fair.

I don't see the big guy renegotiating, so he will most likely be cut. I really wish he had retired after the superbowl win, because a team WILL pay him 6-7 million for a couple of years, where I feel like the highest the pats can afford to go is 4.5, and pride isn't going to let him take 4.5 after being denied 9, when he can potentially pull in 7.

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If Wilfork is worth 6-7 million on the open market, why should you want him to retire? I wish that we can re-sign him, but if he is worth 6-7M on the open market, then I wish him well as he moves on.

So be it...

Cantabrigian said:

http://overthecap.com/manning-vs-brady-debate-broncos-manning-2015/

Why a good qb cap matters! Greedy manning cost his teams.

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So, you think that Manning teams have been unable to win because they have been unable to pay for top players. We repeat this nonsense every year, and every year Manning's teams seem to be in the playoffs. In 2014, didn't everyone say that Denver couldn't sign top free agents because of Manning cap hit? Didn't we say that DEN would be in cap hell if they did? Well, DEN is still alive and kicking and is still one of the three favorites to go to the AFC championship.

Yes, we are very lucky that Brady chooses to pay for half-pay. IMHO, it is unreasonable to think that others would or should follow his example.

mgteich said:

If Wilfork is worth 6-7 million on the open market, why should you want him to retire? I wish that we can re-sign him, but if he is worth 6-7M on the open market, then I wish him well as he moves on.

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It's purely as a patriot fan, I'd love for him to have played his whole career with one team, And I know outsiders, and like 4 post from this forum, will say things such as "Kraft is cheap, and BB is a terrible GM" because they lets a DT on the wrong side of 30 walk instead of paying him nearly 10 million dollars for one year.

Cantabrigian said:

http://overthecap.com/manning-vs-brady-debate-broncos-manning-2015/

Why a good qb cap matters! Playoff manning cost his teams.

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Fixed that for you.

Vince has at least another season left in the tank, he played very well for someone of his size coming after a major surgery. With a whole off season to rest and solidify the recovery I can definitely see him back, at least I wish that. We need him, maybe we will draft his replacement this year but it won't be easy to find one.

It's difficult but if I had to choose between Vince and Mayo I would keep Vince.

chasa said:

It's purely as a patriot fan, I'd love for him to have played his whole career with one team, And I know outsiders, and like 4 post from this forum, will say things such as "Kraft is cheap, and BB is a terrible GM" because they lets a DT on the wrong side of 30 walk instead of paying him nearly 10 million dollars for one year.

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Obviously, Kraft and Belichick are not cheap.

Even as a patriot fan, I wish players well who have been great players. I can understand that players want to continue playing even if the patriots cannot pay enough for their services.

Of course, we haven't a clue whether the team is even willing to pay $5M for Wilfork's services.

does anyone off hand know how much he earned last year. Looks like he earned most of the NLTBE bonuses. I'm guessing the cap hit wasn't that much lower than he was projected to earn.

That being said. Its more than likely he's gone. I wish him nothing but the best if he is gone.
the next two weeks are going to be tough. keeping Revis and McCourty seems to be an imperative.

varjao said:

It's difficult but if I had to choose between Vince and Mayo I would keep Vince.

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That isn't a tough one for me. Vince by several lengths. And widths.

varjao said:

Vince has at least another season left in the tank, he played very well for someone of his size coming after a major surgery. With a whole off season to rest and solidify the recovery I can definitely see him back, at least I wish that. We need him, maybe we will draft his replacement this year but it won't be easy to find one.

It's difficult but if I had to choose between Vince and Mayo I would keep Vince.

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Mayo at $6.25M or a bit less, with options for 2016 and 2017

Wilfork at $8.5M, likely for one year

If I had to choose, I would choose Mayo. He is younger and is potentially a top player for 2015-2017.
==

BTW, even this comparison is unfair. If a decision is to be made before March 10th, cutting mayo would save ZERO 2015 cap money and only $1.75M long-term, since $4.5M of Mayo's 2015 salary is guaranteed for injury.

Post 6/1/15 unless he reworks his deal.....The Pats have no real leverage before that date....After 6/1/15 his 5.7 mill cap hit can be reduced to 1.2 mill...as opposed to 4.5 mill pre 6/1/15.....As with Willfork, let the market yield its fair price and we will see if we are players.....I don't see us in if it goes beyond 3.5 mill and it probably will, so he will be gone...

signbabybrady said:

I think people for some reason devalue Vince. I get the concerns last off-season due to his injury and I get he isn't getting any younger. But he bounced back this year and played a ridiculous snap count for a DT coming off major injury. We would have been screwed without him this year.

We need Vince. We definitely don't need a 9 mil cap hit so hopefully something can be negotiated and if it can't we might have no choice but to cut him but in no way is it a no brainer. We might have to carry that number if he digs his heals in because the dline still needs him.

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Vince has nothing to complain about.

The Patriots went out of their way, IIRC, in the last regaular season game against Buffalo to get him the required amount of snaps for his NLTBE incentive bonuses.

• He literally was playing too much in that game next to Zach Moore and Joe Vellano because the FO was getting him his money.

The Pats did him a solid.

varjao said:

Vince has at least another season left in the tank, he played very well for someone of his size coming after a major surgery. With a whole off season to rest and solidify the recovery I can definitely see him back, at least I wish that. We need him, maybe we will draft his replacement this year but it won't be easy to find one.

It's difficult but if I had to choose between Vince and Mayo I would keep Vince.

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At this point in time, there is no way I would agree with that choice.

Mayo 100%.

I would like to keep both if Vince is realistic.

you are cutting everybody today

Your misleading headline puts you in line for cushy job at ESPN.

shmessy said:

Vince has nothing to complain about.

The Patriots went out of their way, IIRC, in the last regaular season game against Buffalo to get him the required amount of snaps for his NLTBE incentive bonuses.

• He literally was playing too much in that game next to Zach Moore and Joe Vellano because the FO was getting him his money.

The Pats did him a solid.

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Hopefully that solid goes a long way in 're-negotiations. I agree Vince doesn't have much to complain about at least and unless we cut him.

Pro Football Outsiders had the Pats the worst team in the NFL at stopping the short yardage obvious run down and distance last year.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/four-downs/2015/four-downs-afc-east

In 2014, the Patriots were the worst team in the league in Power Success, allowing opposing offenses to convert 22 of 27 runs (81 percent) in important short-yardage situations (third or fourth down with two yards or less to go and first- or second-and-goal from the two-yard-line or closer). Even the Patriots’ few stops came against the league’s worst running teams. Teams not ranking in the bottom quarter of the league in Football Outsiders' rushing DVOA ratings converted 16 of 17 chances (94 percent) against the Patriots’ run defense.

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Now, in fairness. the Pats played nickle or dime sub packages on 75% of the snaps and the trade-off for better pass coverage is conceding more running plays and inviting teams to run against them. Nevertheless, the Pats could probably be the worst team in the NFL stopping short-yardage running plays without paying Wilfork $9 million or without Wilfork, period.

hwc said:

Pro Football Outsiders had the Pats the worst team in the NFL at stopping the short yardage obvious run down and distance last year.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/four-downs/2015/four-downs-afc-east



Now, in fairness. the Pats played nickle or dime sub packages on 75% of the snaps and the trade-off for better pass coverage is conceding more running plays and inviting teams to run against them. Nevertheless, the Pats could probably be the worst team in the NFL stopping short-yardage running plays without paying Wilfork $9 million or without Wilfork, period.

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The logic of pointing to one man for a team failure, as if that's the only type of play that player was in for...?

Ask Vince to redo his deal, if he refuses cut him and go sign a younger DT like Dan Williams.