rabidfireweasel
Practice Squad Player
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2011
- Messages
- 199
- Reaction score
- 117
Bear with me before you flame away:
I think BB's love of the short shuttle and three cone, especially with wr's, is way overplayed. I often read he values these over 40 times, which I believe is nonsense. If you look at wr's he drafts (not ufa's or FA's- he will overlook speed on these folks) he wants 40 time combined with 3 cone, with an emphasis on speed.
Jeremy Gallon ran a 4.49. Dobson ran a 4.4. Boyce ran a 4.34. Jeremy Ebert ran a 4.38 at his pro day. Price ran a 4.4. Edelman ran between a 4.45 and and 4.52 depending on who was holding the clock(lone exception I have found) . Chad Jackson was one of the fastest guys at the combine. Bethel Johnson was blazing. Deion Branch ran a 4.4. You will be hard pressed to find a guy Belichick drafts at wr that does not have straight line speed of sub 4.5. That is, seemingly a must. Only after that does he then look to quick cut ability.I have posted this before, but people lose their mind about statistics that don't truly correlate to NFL success during the combine.
In fact, there is remarkably little correlation between short shuttle speed and nfl success for wide wr's. If there was, you would see the players with top times have good nfl success. That is not the case. Note: Sometimes you will see an already top tier prospect heading into the combine who also puts a great shuttle or 3 cone (Cooks and Beckham Jr- this year Cooper) That is a good sign when that happens.
Top Short Shuttle Times from NFL.com
2014 top 5: Brandin Cooks 3.81, Damien Copeland 3.90, Odell Beckham Jr. 3.94, Isaiah Burse 3.94, Bruce Ellington 3.95
2013 top 5: TJ Moe 3.96, Tavon Austin 4.01, Quinton Patton 4.01, Marcus Patton 4.01, Da'Rick Rogers 4.06
2012 top 5: Junior Hemmingway 3.98, Eric Page3.98, Jarius Wright 4.03, Kashif Moore 4.05 and Marvin McNutt 4.07
2011 top 5 Austin Pettis 3.88, Jeffery Maehl 3.94, Dane Sanzenbacher 3.97, Terrence Toliver 4.03 and Cecil Shorts 4.07.
2010 Top 5 Blair White, Scott Long, Emmanuel Sannders, Stephen Roberts and Andre Roberts.
2009 Kevin Ogletree, Kenny McKinley, Tiquan Underwood, Brian Hartline, Johnny Knox.
2008 Arman Shields 3.96, Andre Caldwell,Harry Douglas, Ryan Grice- Mullen, Jaymar Johnson 4.18
2007 Mike Mason, Anthony Gonzallez, Paul Thompson, Chris Davis
The list of 3 cone superstars who weren't elite prospects is equally ugly.
Top 15 3 cone times 2012-2014 from NFL.com
Damian Copeland 6.53
TJ Moe 6.53
Junior Hemingway 6.59
Tevin Reese 6.63
Jeff Janis 6.59
Marquess Wilson 6.65
Josh Boyce 6.68 (Ran a 4.34 40)
Ryan Grant 6.68
Kevin Norwood 6.68
Odell Beckham 6.69
Danny Coale 6.69
Bruce Ellington 6.69
Walt Powell 6.70
Da'Rick Rogers 6.71
Ryan Spadola 6.72
Top 15 3 cone times from 2009-2011- from NFL.com
Jeffrey Maehl 6.42
Scott Long 6.45
Dane Sazenbacher 6.46
Terrence Toliver 6.48
Cecil Shorts 6.50 - ran a 4.35 and a 4.45 on his pro day
Emmanuel Sanders 6.60 (ran a 4.41 40)
Marshall Williams 6.61
Tiquan Underwood 6.62
Vincent brown 6.64
Brian Hartline 6.65
Aldrich Robinson 6.65
Greg Salas 6.65
Mike Thomas 6.65
Julio Jones 6.66 (fear the number of the beast!)
Kevin Ogletree 6.67
I think BB's love of the short shuttle and three cone, especially with wr's, is way overplayed. I often read he values these over 40 times, which I believe is nonsense. If you look at wr's he drafts (not ufa's or FA's- he will overlook speed on these folks) he wants 40 time combined with 3 cone, with an emphasis on speed.
Jeremy Gallon ran a 4.49. Dobson ran a 4.4. Boyce ran a 4.34. Jeremy Ebert ran a 4.38 at his pro day. Price ran a 4.4. Edelman ran between a 4.45 and and 4.52 depending on who was holding the clock(lone exception I have found) . Chad Jackson was one of the fastest guys at the combine. Bethel Johnson was blazing. Deion Branch ran a 4.4. You will be hard pressed to find a guy Belichick drafts at wr that does not have straight line speed of sub 4.5. That is, seemingly a must. Only after that does he then look to quick cut ability.I have posted this before, but people lose their mind about statistics that don't truly correlate to NFL success during the combine.
In fact, there is remarkably little correlation between short shuttle speed and nfl success for wide wr's. If there was, you would see the players with top times have good nfl success. That is not the case. Note: Sometimes you will see an already top tier prospect heading into the combine who also puts a great shuttle or 3 cone (Cooks and Beckham Jr- this year Cooper) That is a good sign when that happens.
Top Short Shuttle Times from NFL.com
2014 top 5: Brandin Cooks 3.81, Damien Copeland 3.90, Odell Beckham Jr. 3.94, Isaiah Burse 3.94, Bruce Ellington 3.95
2013 top 5: TJ Moe 3.96, Tavon Austin 4.01, Quinton Patton 4.01, Marcus Patton 4.01, Da'Rick Rogers 4.06
2012 top 5: Junior Hemmingway 3.98, Eric Page3.98, Jarius Wright 4.03, Kashif Moore 4.05 and Marvin McNutt 4.07
2011 top 5 Austin Pettis 3.88, Jeffery Maehl 3.94, Dane Sanzenbacher 3.97, Terrence Toliver 4.03 and Cecil Shorts 4.07.
2010 Top 5 Blair White, Scott Long, Emmanuel Sannders, Stephen Roberts and Andre Roberts.
2009 Kevin Ogletree, Kenny McKinley, Tiquan Underwood, Brian Hartline, Johnny Knox.
2008 Arman Shields 3.96, Andre Caldwell,Harry Douglas, Ryan Grice- Mullen, Jaymar Johnson 4.18
2007 Mike Mason, Anthony Gonzallez, Paul Thompson, Chris Davis
The list of 3 cone superstars who weren't elite prospects is equally ugly.
Top 15 3 cone times 2012-2014 from NFL.com
Damian Copeland 6.53
TJ Moe 6.53
Junior Hemingway 6.59
Tevin Reese 6.63
Jeff Janis 6.59
Marquess Wilson 6.65
Josh Boyce 6.68 (Ran a 4.34 40)
Ryan Grant 6.68
Kevin Norwood 6.68
Odell Beckham 6.69
Danny Coale 6.69
Bruce Ellington 6.69
Walt Powell 6.70
Da'Rick Rogers 6.71
Ryan Spadola 6.72
Top 15 3 cone times from 2009-2011- from NFL.com
Jeffrey Maehl 6.42
Scott Long 6.45
Dane Sazenbacher 6.46
Terrence Toliver 6.48
Cecil Shorts 6.50 - ran a 4.35 and a 4.45 on his pro day
Emmanuel Sanders 6.60 (ran a 4.41 40)
Marshall Williams 6.61
Tiquan Underwood 6.62
Vincent brown 6.64
Brian Hartline 6.65
Aldrich Robinson 6.65
Greg Salas 6.65
Mike Thomas 6.65
Julio Jones 6.66 (fear the number of the beast!)
Kevin Ogletree 6.67