Super Bowl: Pats vs the defending champs

breakin said:

The narrative with the Seahawks this year was that they struggled defensively early in the season but righted the ship and finished really strong. On the face of it that is true, but when you look at it closely you see what could be the real struggle.

The period where they struggled included games against the Packers, Broncos, Chargers and Cowboys. The period of dominance they had was against a who's who list of bad QB's/Offenses.

Dont get me wrong, they are definately a good Defense, probly the best in the league. I just dont agree with some ideas that they rank among the best of all time.

Their Offense will have much more trouble with our Defense than the other way around. Doug Baldwin and Jermaine Kearse just dont scare me. We see it time and time again when we go into a game and everyone is talking about some player on offense that can take over the game, these 2 weeks that player will be Marshawn Lynch. Bill Belichick will take that away like he always does, he wont let Marshawn Lynch beat him, if the Seahawks beat them somewhere else so be it, but it wont be Lynch.

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hmmm...in that regards reminds me of another playoff team we faced recently...

the colts

The pressure is on Seattle.

Who better to stop the defending Super Bowl champions from scoring a two-peat than the Patriots? No other team in the NFL. We're the underdogs here.

Coaching? We're bringing the Coach who replaced their coach on our team 15 years ago and won 3 Super Bowls shortly after and hasn't given up the job since.

We're bringing a corner who we took from their Super Bowl winning team last year. Our other corner? The media's unanimous choice for #1 corner in the game. Both of them were not Patriots last year. A desperate team even went out of their way to wish he came back against league rules.

Our main TE is the media's unanimous choice for #1 TE in the game.

Our versatile WR is a former quarterback who can catch, run, throw, return, and even play a bit of defense, usually top 5 in the NFL in catches or yards.

Our newest WR is able to get open deep, fight for the ball, and hang on to the catch in crucial games like anybody Tom Brady ever played with in his long career.

Our skill players are fearless and don't think twice about coming back, even when down by 28 points throughout a playoff game.

Our Quarterback is #1 in history in the playoffs who won the majority of the 5 Super Bowls he visited. Of the 6 Super Bowl visits, this team could be the best of them all, as it's already in the top 2.

Our Special Teams are great, and our 2 Pro Bowlers this year are one away from the number of the different NFC players chosen (3).

We are the underdogs. Don't forget who the reigning Super Bowl Champions are. But we can sure feel confident we have a chance.

I said at the start of the season no one was beating the seahawks and unfortunately I still believe that. They may not be the best offensive team but Lynch and Wilson running around is going to cause major problems. I know Luck can move around but the pats still could not catch him.

Obviously their defense scares me as well. They have two great corners and they will be going after Brady all game. I expect the game to be close but I think the pats will end up losing by about 7 points.

ensoul said:

I said at the start of the season no one was beating the seahawks and unfortunately I still believe that. They may not be the best offensive team but Lynch and Wilson running around is going to cause major problems. I know Luck can move around but the pats still could not catch him.

Obviously their defense scares me as well. They have two great corners and they will be going after Brady all game. I expect the game to be close but I think the pats will end up losing by about 7 points.

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One corner has a torn ligament in his arm and one safety has a dislocated shoulder. They might play, but they're going to be at 50% and correct me if I'm wrong, but you need your arms to play those skill positions, you can't be a decoy.

And the last time we played this team, Belichick shut Lynch down, and that was when the Seahawks had actual receiving threats. Now they have undrafted sophomores. I don't think Revis is losing any sleep with having to cover Doug Baldwin.

The Pats are winning this game.

ensoul said:

I said at the start of the season no one was beating the seahawks and unfortunately I still believe that. They may not be the best offensive team but Lynch and Wilson running around is going to cause major problems. I know Luck can move around but the pats still could not catch him.

Obviously their defense scares me as well. They have two great corners and they will be going after Brady all game. I expect the game to be close but I think the pats will end up losing by about 7 points.

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Who of Doug Baldwin, Jermaine Kearse & Luke Willson scares you? The Patriots match up incredibly well against the Seahawks pass catchers. Why shouldn't Seattle be afraid of the Patriots? If they can't run the ball (stopping Lynch is an absolute must for the Patriots), do you expect those players to make enough plays against a Secondary that just embarrassed a young QB with an unbelievable array of skills?

I respect the hell out of Seattle. I think they're an excellent side and they should go into the game as favorites (given they're the champs) but hell, we've got Tom Brady, Darrelle Revis, Jamie Collins, Devin McCourty and Rob Gronkowski. They too, should be worried about stopping New England.

ausbacker said:

Who of Doug Baldwin, Jervon Kearse & Luke Willson scares you?

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absolutely nothing as long as the pats defenders stay with their assignments to the end of the play......Wilson is the master of making something of a broken play........because it takes advantage of players losing their assignments after 5 seconds or so

Seattle played some big time QB's this season... I mean they had Kap twice, some guy Lundy Mundy or Bundy was it? Not sure but that guy is one heck of a QB, oh the guy from STL Hill was it?

If I'm Belichick, I'm taking every news clipping I can find about this Seattle defense and sticking it in a collage. I'm finding every video of analysts calling this the best defense since the 2000 Ravens or 86 Bears, and making a montage of it. Then i'm placing both items inside the locker of every member of this Pats defense. I want this D coming out for blood, ready to prove that Seattle isn't the only great defense playing in this Super Bowl.

We're going to have to weather a storm on offense, so to keep us in the game early, I want this D ready to earn it.

upstater1 said:

I've been beating this drum forever I guess, but that 2012 offense was one of the best in NFL history, Welker, Gronk, Hernandez, good running. 3rd most points ever.

Patriots have a better D now, but NOT a better offense.

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While this appears to be true. The dropoff in offense is not as significant as the improvement on defense and I would say the old adage of "defense wins championships" still holds true. I like this team and their chances better than 2011 by far and the offense for their statistical difference with, say 2007, is probably harder to defend.

sb1 said:

Has the Seahawks faced a power back like Blount yet? Haven't looked up the breakdown of their schedule. I know they gave up big rushing games this year.

Should be interesting to see if they have faced a guy like Blount.

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Lacy is a power back. Stewart and Tolbert are both power backs.

The Patriots could be the first team in NFL history to win a SB without getting a sack in the playoffs.

That is not a theory I'd like to see them test out. I want to see pressure on Wilson and lots of it.

The best part of this week is having ALL the Patriots hating media having to talk about them for a whole week.

manxman2601 said:

I don't think people realise what a freak athlete Bobby Wagner is. Jamie Collins broke the combine record for the broad jump with an 11'7" jump but Wagner's was 11'. He also had s 39.5" vertical jump. As for speed, Bobby Wagner ran a 4.46 forty at 241lbs. Whatever problems Gronk poses for Wagner, speed will not be one of them.

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Gronk has 6 inches and 25 pounds on Wagner. At the combine they had almost the same 20 times and Gronk was better in the three cone drill. I suspect Wagner and Chancellor will both spend a lot of time with him.

Seattle had incredibly impressive defensive performance this year.
Not only did they have the best defense, they were best by a lot. The only team to hold opponents under 300 yards, they held them to only 267. Atlanta, on the other end of the scale, was at 398. New England, by comparison, was at 344.
Great pass defense, only team averaging under 200 yards per game at 185.
Great run defense, averaging 81 yards per game.

But they proved beatable in 2014.
Yes, they have a great home field advantage in that stadium. They are going to lose that.

Their offense isn't very explosive. Basically three guys - Russell Wilson, Doug Baldwin, and Marshawn Lynch. Wilson may be good on the move, but he was horrid for the first 57 minutes Sunday against the Green Bay defense. The Patriots can shut down one receiver when they have to. The Pats struggled late to defend the run, but proved they could do it earlier in the season. Seattle doesn't have a top TE or impressive third receiver.

The Pats weakness on offense has been their offensive line. Didn't look like a problem against the Colts. The Seattle defensive line isn't that much more impressive than anyone they have faced. Seattle's defensive strength is their top secondary - but New England counters that with the diversity of their offense. While Seattle tends to keep Sherman on one side, New England moves receivers all over. They feast on multiple route levels, taking what the defense gives. With Gronkoswki, Edelman, and Vereen they can attack three different levels of the defense on the same play, finding the opening. With Blount, they can tire the defense.

And Seattle's schedule wasn't terribly impressive for a #1 team. They retained their #1 spot by boxing in the ears of a QB-less Arizona team and St. Louis in the final two weeks. They completely shut down San Francisco twice late in the season, in probably their most impressive performances. They beat Green Bay in their home opener, probably their toughest opponent, while New England lost to them at Lambeau.
They lost three games on the road - San Diego, Kansas City, and St Louis, plus Dallas at home.
They beat a .500 team, Carolina, for their first playoff win, and had the miracle over the gimpy Packers.

Very winnable match-up.

TomPatriot said:

Gronk has 6 inches and 25 pounds on Wagner. At the combine they had almost the same 20 times and Gronk was better in the three cone drill. I suspect Wagner and Chancellor will both spend a lot of time with him.

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That wasn't the point I was responding too though. Someone said that Gronk was too fast for Wagner, I was just pointing out that that wasn't the case. What happens at the catch point is another matter but Gronk won't find it easy to run away fro Wagner.

manxman2601 said:

That wasn't the point I was responding too though. Someone said that Gronk was too fast for Wagner, I was just pointing out that that wasn't the case. What happens at the catch point is another matter but Gronk won't find it easy to run away fro Wagner.

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I know and I agree that Wagner is a great athlete who can stay with Gronk. But I think the 40 time is simplistic for this purpose. Gronk runs better routes and is quicker than people think. That's why I cited the 3 cone drill times.

Not much talk of Hightower but I think he's a key in this game, with Collins likely being more active in the passing game and coming in on blitzes I think Hightower staying disciplined, taking away the middle of the field, spying Wilson and getting in on the run...he's gonna be mighty pivotal if the Pats are going to contain both Wilson and Lynch. And honestly, he's part of why I'm cautiously optimistic in this game: our defense is so, so much better than it was two years ago, maturation of Hightower, Collins and Jones, bringing in Browner and Revis, it's such a versatile and athletic unit that matches up well against a mobile QB like Wilson.

Speaking of Chandler , he has to be disciplined while bringing pressure, can't overpersue cause Lynch will torch that left side but it'd be nice to get Wilson on the move as well.

Finally, offensively I think the key will be what Brady does best: spreading the ball around, balancing the run game with pass game, get everyone involved and keep the defense on their toes. Don't go for the home run (INT against Indy was Brady getting greedy), take what the D gives them because the skill positions are full of guys who can get open, Brady just needs keep spreading the ball around. I think the O-line matches up well against Seattle's front 7, Blount is important to keep the D honest but ultimately the offense will score enough points if Brady can stay patient and keep the defense guessing.

All our players are healthy with exception of the riddler and Mayo healthiest team I've seen the Pats display in the playoffs. Feeling pretty good about this game

ArchAngel007 said:

All our players are healthy with exception of the riddler and Mayo healthiest team I've seen the Pats display in the playoffs. Feeling pretty good about this game

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They're starting C was out last week without practicing. It's good he'll have a bunch of rest to get better. But I can't complain; this year's squad is in much better shape health-wise than others.

dales804 said:

They're starting C was out last week without practicing. It's good he'll have a bunch of rest to get better. But I can't complain; this year's squad is in much better shape health-wise than others.

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I hear what you're saying I just think Stork will be out there on 2 weeks if not I believe Wendell can handle Seattle speed guys it's the Ngatas and Knightons of the world that give him fits IMO