Vollmer's Future

AndyJohnson said:

I'm not sure how we know what Cannon will be paid, did the contract details (for real) come out?
We have Solder, Vollmer, Cannon and Fleming now, so unless Solder is being jettisoned I wouldn't expect a T to be drafted early. Drafting one in rounds 4-7 is always a good idea, regardless of need.

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I think they envision Fleming as an OG. I think they'll give him every opportunity to compete and win the starting RG job his offseason.

mgteich said:

Yes, this provides injury protection for the patriots.

What do you expect?

By October 31, 2015, Cannon will have $4.750M. I agree that the bonus was spread.
So, I would say that Cannon gets $3.750M for 2016 if he stays.

Let us do it you way and spread the bonus.

2015
$1.550 plus $1.600M = only $3.150M

2016
$1.6M bonus WHETHER HE PLAYS OR NOT
$3.750M
total = $5.375M

I find it more reasonable think of this as $4.75M in 2015 and $3.75M in 2016 (if the team decides to keep him).
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If Cannon plays both years, he will get $8.50M plus incentives (or $4.25ZM per year)
If Cannon plays one year, he will get $4.75M plus incentives
Do you disagree?

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I do. He gets at most 7.4 including incentives. And he did not just cash a 3.2 mill check.

AndyJohnson said:

I do. He gets at most 7.4 including incentives. And he did not just cash a 3.2 mill check.

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YOU say that Cannon's compensation is $7.4M INCLUDING INCENTIVES, at most. You simply want to exclude the signing bonus.

Let's consider the contract without even a workout bonus.

$3.2M bonus (in three payments as pointed out by aj)
$1.2M 2015 salary
$3.4M 2016 salary
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$7.8M
The total is not $7.5M after incentives; it is $7.8M before them.

IN ADDITION, there are easy to reach workout bonuses, weight bonus and game bonuses. The only questionable incentive is the game time incentive of $250K which is a bit more then the $200K of workout bonuses not included in the totals.

You can estimate what you think Cannon will receive. It will north of $8M and probably close to $8.5M if he plays both years. It will be closer to $4.8M if only play in 2015.

http://overthecap.com/player/marcus-cannon/1228

Cannon does not have workout bonus. He does have a weight bonus which is considered LTBE because it is under his control. Since Cannon will play in every game this season his 46-man active roster bonus is also considered LTBE. Therefore, one could easily make the case that Cannon will earn $8.5m in 2 years

When???

Deus Irae said:

Cannon was better than Solder.

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Plus don't you think there is a reason the coaching staff has decided to stick with him at LT as opposed to Volmer or Cannon???

Ivan said:

I think Vollmet has been their most reliable OL all season.

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I disagree, Connolly and Stork top my list. Volmer does have the added benefit of having experience at LT.

RxJock1120 said:

When???

Plus don't you think there is a reason the coaching staff has decided to stick with him at LT as opposed to Volmer or Cannon???

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That particular discussion post was specifically about yesterday's game.

Solder is definitely the one to go between the two. Half the time a cardboard cut out would be better than Solder. At least you could potentially slip going up against a cardboard cut out.

I have updated Vollmer's cap page.
http://www.patscap.com/vollmer.html#vollmer

Ivan said:

I think Vollmet has been their most reliable OL all season.

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"I think Vollmet has been their most reliable OL all season."

I copied your comment twice to make sure that we are discussing the entire season.

I think that over the entire season, you may be correct. However. I try too

First, I think Stork has been the most reliable since the CIN game.

Fleming is originally a Tackle right? Did he play guard in college?
Because recent experiments filling a tackle in the interior o-line didn't show good results. I hope they draft a guard and sign a starter left tackle or vice versa.

I know Solder has been awful this season but in 4 years this is his only down year, maybe he is playing through some injury, or is missing Mankins on his side, but I think the main problems in the o-line are called by the names of Connoly and Wendell.

Seriously, Wendell has been a good soldier, but he has to go.

kennyb said:

6m per year new cash for vollmer. Total cap hits in each year of 6m plus 2.1m approximately of sb amortization.

Total cap hits of 8m in each of next two years up from 4 this year.

Solder seems too inconsistent for a 7.5m one year contract.

Could see one getting cut.

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Vollmer is the best OL. I don't see him going anywhere.

Sure, let's get rid of our most dependable lineman and roll the dice on a complete unknown. Brady doesn't have too many years left anyway.

Brady6 said:

I think they envision Fleming as an OG. I think they'll give him every opportunity to compete and win the starting RG job his offseason.

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patsderoer said:

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I appreciate the information but I don't make determinations on players based on a gif for one play.

rochrist said:

Vollmer is the best OL. I don't see him going anywhere.

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I agree and I'm not even sure why it's being discussed. Vollmer signed a contract in 2013 for less than market value for an all pro RT. He has been solid all year coming back from a major injury. Why the F would we cut him and weaken what is already the weakest part of the team.

mgteich said:

"I think Vollmet has been their most reliable OL all season."

I copied your comment twice to make sure that we are discussing the entire season.

I think that over the entire season, you may be correct. However. I try too

First, I think Stork has been the most reliable since the CIN game.

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Then you haven't watched the games. Stork has played well especially for a rookie but he has not been the most reliable, I mean he missed time during the stretch you are referring to and everything.

Brady6 said:

I think they envision Fleming as an OG. I think they'll give him every opportunity to compete and win the starting RG job his offseason.

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I think the coaching staff have very high hopes for Fleming. I mean. They taken basically every step that they can for getting him on the field. They tried to start him at guard early. They played an extreme amount of snaps with him at the extra blocking TE/6 OL position. This is stuff that you don't do unless you really want to get this guy on the field. I really don't think they would take all these steps to get Fleming on the field if they thought he was a mediocre at best guy.

Marinlik said:

I think the coaching staff have very high hopes for Fleming. I mean. They taken basically every step that they can for getting him on the field. They tried to start him at guard early. They played an extreme amount of snaps with him at the extra blocking TE/6 OL position. This is stuff that you don't do unless you really want to get this guy on the field. I really don't think they would take all these steps to get Fleming on the field if they thought he was a mediocre at best guy.

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I like Fleming I had him as a late second or third round pick on my mock prior to the draft. He was one of my favorite picks of the draft.

Brady6 said:

I agree and I'm not even sure why it's being discussed. Vollmer signed a contract in 2013 for less than market value for an all pro RT. He has been solid all year coming back from a major injury. Why the F would we cut him and weaken what is already the weakest part of the team.

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Of course, you don't have any idea why this is being discussed. You have shown, over, and over, and over again that you don't understand contract and cap management In this case, you seem to think that what we should pay Vollmer going forward should be based on your analysis that Vollmer's 2013 and 2104 compensation was below market.

The team has a decision to make with regard very single player. For almost all, the decisions are easy one.

The team need to decided whether Vollmer is worth $6M for his 2015 services. They will have that decision again in the next off-season.

The team needs to decide how much Solder is worth.

The team needs to decide how much Connolly is worth.

The team has already decided how much Cannon is worth, with most on this board strongly disagreeing with the evaluation of the team that Cannon is worth more than $4M per year.