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Logan Mankins Traded


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Yep. And even with Mankins -- we know the Pats wanted Tim Wright. If they hadn't been willing to part with Mankins, maybe they would have given a draft pick instead. And maybe giving up that pick meant they didn't trade for Akeem Ayers. And maybe....

This is something I think about fairly frequently. What if the Pats had taken Muhammad Wilkerson at #28 in 2011, instead of trading the pick to New Orleans? Would they have missed out on Chandler Jones in 2012? Dont'a Hightower? Maybe they would have traded up for Jones and taken Lavonte David instead, or maybe they would have gone in a totally different direction. Maybe they would have traded the #33 pick instead of using it on Ras-I Dowling.

It's easy to get caught up in "what if" scenarios. Overall, I'm pretty happy with how the team has evolved. And one corollary of the "BB the GM" criticism that people forget: had we hit on more of our draft picks, we would be in more of a bind on who to pay and keep, something that is already a difficult process.
 
You know, the Seymour references bring home just how hard it is to pin down the impact of a major trade, even with the benefit of hindsight. What if the Patriots hadn't traded Seymour? Let's try to figure out what would have been different...

First off, what they received was a 1st-round pick, which they used on Nate Solder, and cap savings, which is generally agreed to have gone toward re-signing Vince Wilfork to a long-term deal. If they had chosen to extend Seymour instead of Wilfork, they would have been in need of both a left tackle and a NT/DT, without the benefit of the extra first-round pick.

In that situation, could they have afforded the luxury of trading their own first (#28 overall) to New Orleans -- a trade that ultimately turned into Chandler Jones and Shane Vereen? Likely not. My bet is that the pick would have been an OT, since NT was a very weak position at that point in the draft. (3-4 DE was much stronger, but you just kept Seymour over Wilfork, remember?) Meanwhile 2 highly regarded options remained at OT in Gabe Carimi and Derek Sherrod. Both, in fact, were selected before the end of the first round..and neither lasted to the end of their rookie contracts.

So now you find yourself with Seymour but not Wilfork, Jones, or Vereen, and with an execrable starting LT. Ouch. That trade's sure looking good!

But maybe it was totally different. Maybe you didn't re-sign Seymour OR Wilfork after the season, and poured the money into FA Jordan Gross at LT. Then you hit the jackpot by drafting Muhammad Wilkerson in the 1st to replace Seymour, then Jurrell Casey in the 3rd to replace Wilfork. Amazing! But oops, now you don't have Steven Ridley or Shane Vereen. (Or Chandler Jones later, of course.) So let's pencil in RB Jacquizz Rodgers in the 5th in place of Marcus Cannon, and...

Quick now, what was the impact of trading Richard Seymour?

You're over thinking it. The Seymour trade was terrible because Belichick is arrogant and stupid and doesn't know how to build a team. Simple as that.
 
New England is 8-2 at the moment; Tampa Bay is 2-8. Tell me again how Tampa Bay won the trade?
 
New England is 8-2 at the moment; Tampa Bay is 2-8. Tell me again how Tampa Bay won the trade?

8-2, with an extra 4th rd draft pick, $8M more cap space to play with, and a TE that can stretch defenses and has a knack for the end zone.

We can officially say BB hustled the Bucs on this one.
 
8-2, with an extra 4th rd draft pick, $8M more cap space to play with, and a TE that can stretch defenses and has a knack for the end zone.

We can officially say BB hustled the Bucs on this one.


The Bucs are our extended practice squad.
 
The Bucs are our extended practice squad.


.... a practice squad where we can dump salary cap space and receive extra draft picks?

No, they are not our practice squad. They are our suckers. :D
 
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It's easy to get caught up in "what if" scenarios. Overall, I'm pretty happy with how the team has evolved. And one corollary of the "BB the GM" criticism that people forget: had we hit on more of our draft picks, we would be in more of a bind on who to pay and keep, something that is already a difficult process.

This is very similar to one of the points I like to make to Belichick's critics..

.. change around even a handful of draft picks that Belichick has missed on, and suddenly you aren't looking at an average GM, you are looking at an impossibly successful and inhumanly good GM.

And to your point about the economics of the draft, I found this to be a very interesting article.

http://www.vox.com/2014/5/7/5683448...asic-economics-and-draft-players-irrationally
 
8-2, with an extra 4th rd draft pick, $8M more cap space to play with, and a TE that can stretch defenses and has a knack for the end zone.

We can officially say BB hustled the Bucs on this one.
That 8 mil in cap we saved could go to extending revis which is the priority this offseason. Then mccourty.
 
"yeah but, like.. how many superbowls have they won since the trade. all your strawman arguements don't mean anything if this team doesnt with a world title, plus if they lose a playoff game I get to say stuff like, see mankins would have made that game a win"
 
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