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Idle thoughts - The "I told you we need VJax" edition


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patfanken

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I am kicking myself in the ass this afternoon because I was gong to do a pre-gasme thread in which I was going to predict the Pats would score more than 30, improve their run defense by half and win this game by more than 2 TD's. Now if I hadn't been so lazy, I could be patting myself on the back for the rest of the day.....and well into tomorrow. ; ) OK! Here we go.

1. The the biggest key to this game was the OL. For the fourth game in a row the OL has incrementally improved. And in this game the first OL not only didn't allow a sack, they didn't allow a hit, and I would be willing to guess the number of "hurries" could be counted on one hand.

It' might be no coincidence that this is the first week in the past month that they haven't faced one of the better DL's in the league, but the most important thing is that they are improving and can only get better. It also didn't hurt that the RB's averaged 4.5ypc today. Nice Job, Googs.

2. Brady was simply OUTSTANDING. I swear to god when he broke out of the pocket to extend that Pass play to Gronk on the GL, it was as fast as I've ever seen him run :eek: He now has 14 TD's and no picks in the last 4 games. And he's making a LOT of talking heads look very, very, VERY foolish. Hard to believe his amazing 85% completion rate would have been that much better if he hadn't been the victim of 3 bad drops. Even more incredible was his 12 yd/completion number. It's fair to say, therat the dink and dunk era is officailly over. (though we migh see a return next week)

3. I got all bent out of shape this morning railing at those calling for us to trade Vincent Jackson, or anyone else looking for a WR to add to this group. We are averaging over FORTY points per game over the last month. Adding Jerry Rice himself, wouldn't improve on that number by much. I have never understood why some fans think that #1 WR's will solve ALL of a team's problems. Right now the Pats have more "good" WR's than they need. Adding some 31 year old, high priced WR who has never worked in a system anything close to the one they run here makes no sense at all......but still the call continues.

4. Brandon LaFell has far exceeded my expectations. Orignally I hoped he'd be an adequate 3rd option with some size in the red zone. Instead he's turned into Brandon La Beast over the last 3 games. He's NOT an elite WR's, but the 2 elite WR's who WERE on the field today didn't match his production COMBINED.

5. The front 7 did a much better job defending the run this week cutting the rush yardage by close to half. It still wasn't great, but consider this. When the Pats lost Kelly, Wilfolk, and Mayo last season it took SEVERAL games before the run defense solidified. BTW- it solidified enough that in last season's playoffs they ended up being tied for first in run D (88ypg) I expect it will continue to improve.

6. It wasn't consistent pressure but 4 sacks is a good number. Better than the 2 I would have been OK with.

7. It looked like Patricia was very creative in designing some rush and pass blitzes. He's going to have to continue doing so over the next few weeks since the Pats are so bereft of great individual pass rushers. Now instead of a couple of guys with grea individual sack totals, it will be more a "sack by committee approach.he ru

Again its important to look at history. In every year from 2001 - 2007 the Pats were among the leaders in team sacks, YET, it wasn't until 2007 did they manage to have a single individual have double digit sacks (Vrabel 12). While its great to have great individual pass rushers, you don't NEED them. The athletes we have have are good enough to create the pressure we need by scheme rather than individual skill.

Like I said, Im not saying I wouldn't like Ware and Miller on my team, but like we saw today, you can create pressure through good scheming. Its not ideal, but it can be done.

8. Dom Easley looked better today. He had a half sack and several pressures. Moore also got some extended play and had a forced fumble as well as as a half sack. I like this kid the way I liked Buchanon. He can give you a speed rush, but can be a liability against the run. He really needs a year in an NFL weight room, but the snaps he's getting because of Jones' injury will be invaluable down the road.

9. Browner improved, but he's not there yet. I expect better from him as the year goes on. You can see he CAN be effective against big WR's a Clearly it would be a mistake to have him on any so called quick slot types. It should be big guys like Jefferies, or TE's

BTW - does anyone agree that Browner's PI looked a lot less egregious on the replay than it did live. And do any of you agree that on the illegal contact call that cost McCourty his pick, if Revis had made similar contact it wouldn't have been called. I really hope they let both sides play next week.

10. Real nice job ST's groups today. It shouldn't go unnoticed. Nice job, OB

11. Jimmy G looked decent in his brief 3 for 3 stint (I didn't see the sack but it wasn't against the first OL) He continues to develop, but I would caution anyone who thinks that he's even close to being ready to run an NFL offense. Brady wasn't ready his first year, coming from one of the top college programs in the country and running a pro-style offense; E. Illinois isn't even close That being said be just might be the best back up BB ever drafted even if I don't want to have to have him win a game this year.

12. JGray wasn't perfect, but as good as we could have expected. When he picked his hole and committed he was very effective. When he hesitated like he did on the GL, he wasn't. SO ulitimately it was a great first game for Jonas, great production, but a number of teachable moments. Some one should tell him he's not Shane Vareeen ;) He does't have the quickness to patiently wait for holes to appear.

13. Saying Gronk was superb is a kin to having a keen sense of the obvious. But what impressed me the most about Gronk today was his massive blocking skills in the running game. Gronk was excellent driving players off the OL and turning them creating some huge holes. Its NOT just Gronk's receiving skills that make him the most impactful offense player who isn't a QB, its the fact that he could be the best blocking TE as well. Now that THIS area of his game is starting to come around, his impact will really come into play ever more.

14. It should be noted that a lot of the Bears' offensive production came after the game was in true garbage time.

15. One of the things I was going to write about in my pregame thread, was it was my belief that regardless of how the game turned out, win or lose, the Mediots and talking heads will never think its enough. They will ***** and moan that we gave up too many yards or didn't score enough or....something. Well I could be wrong on this one, but I don't think so. But if they are going to whine, they are going to have to be pretty creative about it. :D

OK let the discussion begin
 
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BTtW- there was one other point I forgot to put in.

In case you didn't notice there are THREE teams in the so called dismal AFCE that are above .500 at this point of the season. Are there any other "power" divisions that can say the same.

Edit: Watching the Colts/Steelers game they just mentioned that if the Steelers hold on to win, the EVERY team in the AFCN will be above .500
 
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Point 15: The media is no monolith--the praise is there with the criticism. Just depends on where you tend to focus your attention. The same is true on this board--we are also part of the media... and so many generalize their opposition as if it were insurmountable, when it is hardly more than a wave on a calm day.
 
watch out. there are going to be people coming in here to tell you that you know nothing about football because trading for VJax is the perfect move. Fantasy Football GM's all over the place this year, most of which were complaining that the patriots don't run enough, but still want to keep bringing in WR's.
 
2. JGray wasn't perfect, but as good as we could have expected. When he picked his hole and committed he was very effective. When he hesitated like he did on the GL, he wasn't. SO ulitimately it was a great first game for Jonas, great production, but a number of teachable moments. Some one should tell him he's not Shane Vareeen ;) He does't have the quickness to patiently wait for holes to appear.

Did you get this from TV or were you there today?....Gray went 86 yards on 17 carries. That carry you fault him for is more on the playcall...there was no hole. Brady couldn't even sneak it from inside the one. Gray played a very solid game. I'm guessing you got a little of White's carries mixed up with Gray's. White went 6 carries for 17 yards and I personally thought HE should have never even been in there. A lot of us were openly wondering WHY White was being used and guessed it was because of the blowout nature of the game.

You went to a lot of camp sessions, Ken...so did I.I thought by the end of the sessions we were able to watch that Gray was easily the third best RB ahead of Bolden but behind Vereen and Ridley. White is slow making reads, has what I feel is a terrible sense of vision and gets knocked down on the first hit too easily to be taking snaps in an NFL contest right now. Why they exposed Gray to protect White has me puzzled, but I guess it doesn't make much difference now, does it.
 
I thought Browners presence was great. On the first series there was a run play where he came up and flattened a receiver standing near the pile. I had to rewind it to catch his number. He made a nice tackle on a RB and jammed the TE a couple times.
His penalties are always of the borderline variety. I don't mind if he gets a couple of holding calls each game. I love his physicality.
 
watch out. there are going to be people coming in here to tell you that you know nothing about football because trading for VJax is the perfect move. Fantasy Football GM's all over the place this year, most of which were complaining that the patriots don't run enough, but still want to keep bringing in WR's.

In the playoffs you are not facing the Chicago bears of the world. If we stay as we are we will be fine because we will score points and win games, but it won't be good enough to win the Superbowl. Football is about match ups and as many in you favor the better the odds of you winning.Its not about fantasy football. Ideally a great defense is the best way, but we don't have that
 
watch out. there are going to be people coming in here to tell you that you know nothing about football because trading for VJax is the perfect move. Fantasy Football GM's all over the place this year, most of which were complaining that the patriots don't run enough, but still want to keep bringing in WR's.

Once again there is nothing wrong with wanting them to commit to a consistent run game while also trying to improve the pass game by bringing in a very proven and good outside WR. Which in return could help the run game.

Would I rather see them bring in a DL or LB that is good to great in run support, Yep. But if there are no LB or DL out there available and Tampa's asking price is acceptable to BB for Jackson you make the deal. Because it is making the team better.

There is just no-way you can tell me Edelman-Jackson-LaFell isn't better than Edelman-LaFell-Amendola



Jackson Edelman OL Gronk LaFell

Brady
RB

Why people would be against this is beyond me.
 
You are out of touch with reality, Ken. I refer you to the following threads for correction:

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...es-with-this-team.1112512/page-2#post-3931895

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...hreads/bad-drafting-mediocre-results.1112217/

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/threads/belichick-is-to-blame.1112365/

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...hreads/brady-is-not-done-remember-06.1112420/

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...-of-the-secondary-a-couple-years-ago.1112234/

Our OL is a shambles, they hate the OL coach, Josh McDaniels is a disaster as an OC rivaled only by Matt Patricia as a disaster as a DC, Brady is in decline, Brady deserves better, we have no offensive weapons, the defense can't survive the loss of Mayo and possibly Jones, Revis is a shadow of his former self, Kraft is cheap, and the team has been gutted by BB's poor drafting and personnel decisions. Our season is essentially over, doomed once again by a glut of injuries unmasking lack of depth and poor decision making by the FO and coaching staff.

Got it?
 
lol I step away for a couple of hours and come back to see one person "disagreed" 14 of my posts.

Apparently the number 4 offense in the league that just lost two key defensive players, needs to fill those holes with another wide receiver.
 
15. One of the things I was going to write about in my pregame thread, was it was my belief that regardless of how the game turned out, win or lose, the Mediots and talking heads will never think its enough. They will ***** and moan that we gave up too many yards or didn't score enough or....something. Well I could be wrong on this one, but I don't think so. But if they are going to whine, they are going to have to be pretty creative about it. :D

Ask and ye shall receive!

Like the inevitable floating tootsie roll at the pre-school pool party, Borges appears right on schedule in his Building 19 and 1/8 suit to belt out the old, beloved "Eh, the Pats were playing a tomato can" tune.

 
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lol I step away for a couple of hours and come back to see one person "disagreed" 14 of my posts.

Apparently the number 4 offense in the league that just lost two key defensive players, needs to fill those holes with another wide receiver.

No-one is saying not to bring in a worthwhile LB or DL if one is available. What we are saying is don't pass on Vincent Jackson if he is attainable at a price they deem fair if there isn't a LB or DL out there. Because like it or not the WR position could still stand to be upgraded.
 
he is HORRIBLE in person....NOT made for video...stick to plagiarizing print, Punchy
 
lol I step away for a couple of hours and come back to see one person "disagreed" 14 of my posts.
.

Let me advise you that whatever you do never, ever criticize RB Finch saying he won't make the Pats 53. I got over a dozen for that in a pre-season game thread.
 
My biggest take away from today's Pats game and many of the NFL games this weekend is this: DEPTH in the secondary is the only way to survive in today's NFL.......and right now...knock on wood...the Pats have it. Sitting a high caliber DB like Dennard is a luxury that few teams have.....and without adequate depth...your toast. The Bears are just one example of an undermanned secondary getting abused by a team skilled enough to take advantage of a depleted DB corp. Look how Indy crapped their pants today after Davis went down. Look how NE wilted last year when Talib went down.
The march through the playoffs is always a game of attrition and NE should be happy their secondary is deeper than anytime I can remember
 
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My biggest take away from today's Pats game and many of the NFL games this weekend is this: DEPTH in the secondary is the only way to survive in today's NFL.......and right now...knock on wood...the Pats have it. Sitting a high caliber DB like Dennard is a luxury that few teams have.....and without adequate depth...your toast. The Bears are just one example of an undermanned secondary getting abused by a team skilled enough to take advantage of a depleted DB corp. Look how Indy crapped their pants today after Davis went down. Look how NE wilted last year when Talib went down.
The march through the playoffs is always a game of attrition and NE should be happy their secondary is deeper than anytime I can remember

"You can never have too many good DBs". Finally, we have them.
 
Ken, you're rather adamant that LaFell is not an elite WR. It seems to me he could be on his way to becoming one. His style looks a lot like another WR on the field today, Alshon Jeffrey.
 
Ken, you're rather adamant that LaFell is not an elite WR. It seems to me he could be on his way to becoming one. His style looks a lot like another WR on the field today, Alshon Jeffrey.

He looks really good to me. Running sharp routes, quick out of his breaks, catching the ball with hands and very strong after the catch. I'm not sure what else there is he's supposed to do.
 
2. JGray wasn't perfect, but as good as we could have expected. When he picked his hole and committed he was very effective. When he hesitated like he did on the GL, he wasn't. SO ulitimately it was a great first game for Jonas, great production, but a number of teachable moments. Some one should tell him he's not Shane Vareeen ;) He does't have the quickness to patiently wait for holes to appear.

Did you get this from TV or were you there today?....Gray went 86 yards on 17 carries. That carry you fault him for is more on the playcall...there was no hole. Brady couldn't even sneak it from inside the one. Gray played a very solid game. I'm guessing you got a little of White's carries mixed up with Gray's. White went 6 carries for 17 yards and I personally thought HE should have never even been in there. A lot of us were openly wondering WHY White was being used and guessed it was because of the blowout nature of the game.

You went to a lot of camp sessions, Ken...so did I.I thought by the end of the sessions we were able to watch that Gray was easily the third best RB ahead of Bolden but behind Vereen and Ridley. White is slow making reads, has what I feel is a terrible sense of vision and gets knocked down on the first hit too easily to be taking snaps in an NFL contest right now. Why they exposed Gray to protect White has me puzzled, but I guess it doesn't make much difference now, does it.

I didn't make it to camps but given what I did see of him it's not a surprise to see him doing well

That being said I think BB makes a move at the trading deadline to bring in some depth at RB

That won't be because of lack of faith in Gray - just simply the need for added depth later in the season - though hopefully we don't suffer any more injuries.

I have a feeling that BB will be looking to available free agents - I can't help but wonder if BJGE has kept himself in shape and could handle some spot duty if needed. Shadow roster guys often come in handy.
 
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