Vincent Jackson on the trade block?

upstater1 said:

Why do people deliberately misinterpret stuff on this board? It makes posting next to impossible. Someone says D is the biggest need but Jackson would be a big upgrade. Someone responds that WR is for fantasy fanboys and that D is the biggest need. It's silly. OK bring in Brian Orakpo and JJ Watt. satisfied?

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Http://online.wsj.com/articles/j-j-watts-low-watt-effect-1413759473

Personally, I think the biggest mistake you can make in football whether as a fan or as a pundit is to be rigid in your thinking -look at everything as right or wrong and to rely on your belief that you personally have all the answers.. or the only answer.

Unfortunately a lot of fans and pundits do just this.

upstater1 said:

No doubt we'd all love an impact defender over a WR.

But if you really think the Patriots are set, check out who we play next. Alshon Jeffrey and Brandon Marshall are both better than our #1 Lafell. And yes we have Edelman and Gronkowski. The Bears though throw to Martellus Bennett and Matt Forte so they'll attack you there too.

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To be fair, Alshon Jeffery is better than most teams' #1. That's the value of hitting a home run on a drafted WR; they're getting Brandon Marshall production for Aaron Dobson money. Our WRs aren't good, but this probably isn't the right measuring stick by which to conclude that.

Offense is the best defense and if we aren't going to trade for an impact defensive player, adding Vjax would be huge.

Well, while talking about WR trades. For the crowd who said the Pats should have taken Cordarrelle Paterson in the first round last year, I am sure the Vikes would happily trade him for a first rounder. Maybe that should be the trade the Pats should make.

upstater1 said:

Why do people deliberately misinterpret stuff on this board? It makes posting next to impossible. Someone says D is the biggest need but Jackson would be a big upgrade. Someone responds that WR is for fantasy fanboys and that D is the biggest need. It's silly. OK bring in Brian Orakpo and JJ Watt. satisfied?

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Orakpo would even be cheap, because he's got a torn pec and is working on a 1 year deal. He's perfect: a cheap defensive player on a short contract. That's a RayClay trade just waiting to happen!

No thanks on impact and costly defenders.

Not because we don't need them, but I don't trust Patricia to use him the right way anyways. It'll be a waste of resources IMO.

Trade for a RB or OL to improve our running game and to help protect Brady, which in turn helps our passing game.

condon84 said:

No thanks on impact and costly defenders.

Not because we don't need them, but I don't trust Patricia to use him the right way anyways. It'll be a waste of resources IMO.

Trade for a RB or OL to improve our running game and to help protect Brady, which in turn helps our passing game.

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It's easy to say you don't trust Patricia to use them, but what has he had to play with? Chandler Jones is the closest front 7 player we have to an impact defender and outside of facing mobile QBs is generally employed rushing the passer, maybe matching him up would be the only way to get more of an impact out of him.

Revis has been matched up man to man for the majority of 5 of 7 games this season, maybe even more, he's doing his job.

Talib was matched up in most games last year.

DMC is allowed to roam free and does his job.

What impact players is he misusing? What impact players have we been given?

The problem isn't misuse, it's lack of. Haynesworth was an absolute dud and before him I can't think of who else Patrica would have had as an "impact player" Adalius Thomas? He completely vanished as a player after one great year, and I'm not even sure that was Patricia back then.

The way I see it, outside of a specific game, or 2 or 3 games a year, he uses most players in the position they're best fit to succeed in, it's the lack of impact players given to him. BB doesn't seem to like the flashy 1 trick pony pass rushers, even if they can take over a game, but he prefers the guys who can play every position and be a gamebreaker at none.

It helps survive injuries, but Von Miller isn't going to be lining up for us on Sunday.

condon84 said:

No thanks on impact and costly defenders.

Not because we don't need them, but I don't trust Patricia to use him the right way anyways. It'll be a waste of resources IMO.

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So we have an all time great HC but you think he's too stupid to hire a good DC ?

To be fair, even if it's only a 1 year rental, a 3rd rounder for an impact player like VJAX might be worth it for us. When it gets to playoff time, the points will be that much harder to get against the good defenses, and having another good player to run out there alongside Gronk, Lafell and Edelman will make it that much harder for defenses to lock us down.

condon84 said:

No thanks on impact and costly defenders.

Not because we don't need them, but I don't trust Patricia to use him the right way anyways. It'll be a waste of resources IMO.

Trade for a RB or OL to improve our running game and to help protect Brady, which in turn helps our passing game.

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I don't think the Pats would be on this incredible run if they were misusing players

BelichickFan said:

So we have an all time great HC but you think he's too stupid to hire a good DC ?

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Do you think Patricia is a good DC?

condon84 said:

Do you think Patricia is a good DC?

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Honestly, I think Patricia makes the calls for Belichick's defense. I don't think he's a stand alone, independent DC so it's really tough to say.

BelichickFan said:

Honestly, I think Patricia makes the calls for Belichick's defense. I don't think he's a stand alone, independent DC so it's really tough to say.

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Our defense has gotten more inconsistent since Crennel left. Peas' reign wasn't as bad or inconsistent as it is now.

Patricia's defense is inconsistent. Some games they look great, and then you have absolute garbage on some games. That to me is more game planning issues. How they're using players.

The Pats pride themselves on being a game plan specific team and some of those defensive game plans are complete misses.

Not a big fan of Patricia.

If the Pats can grab VJax for a 3rd then sign me up. Even if it's a just a 1 year rental.

Bobs My Uncle said:

If the Pats can grab VJax for a 3rd then sign me up. Even if it's a just a 1 year rental.

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Our #3 won't be too much higher, maybe 10 picks, than the #4 we're getting for Mankins. I would happily trade one year of Mankins for the rest of the year of Jackson + a young Tim Wright with, basically, team options on Jackson for the next two years.

KA- said:

I don't think the Pats would be on this incredible run if they were misusing players

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Our offense for the most part, especially since Patricia has taken over as DC, has carried this team.

BelichickFan said:

Our #3 won't be too much higher, maybe 10 picks, than the #4 we're getting for Mankins. I would happily trade one year of Mankins for the rest of the year of Jackson + a young Tim Wright with, basically, team options on Jackson for the next two years.

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That's a good way of looking at it. It's essentially trading Mankins and his $11M cap hit for Jackson and his $12M cap it, plus Wright. I wouldn't want to take on that much of a cap hit (there's also the $4M in 2015 dead money left from Mankins' contract), but I can understand the allure.

condon84 said:

Our defense has gotten more inconsistent since Crennel left. Peas' reign wasn't as bad or inconsistent as it is now.

Patricia's defense is inconsistent. Some games they look great, and then you have absolute garbage on some games. That to me is more game planning issues. How they're using players.

The Pats pride themselves on being a game plan specific team and some of those defensive game plans are complete misses.

Not a big fan of Patricia.

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It's true that, as the talent on the defense declined, the consistency of the defense declined. How is this news of any kind, and how is it any kind of evidence about the D.C.?

Hell, people around here wanted Pees run out of town on a rail. Since moving on to Baltimore, he's helped win a Super Bowl, had a rebuilding team that's never been lower than 12th in points, and is currently OC of the #1 scoring defense in the NFL.

People on this site, for the most part, have no idea what they are talking about when they criticize coordinators.

Deus Irae said:

It's true that, as the talent on the defense declined, the consistency of the defense declined. How is this news of any kind, and how is it any kind of evidence about the D.C.?

Hell, people around here wanted Pees run out of town on a rail. Since moving on to Baltimore, he's helped win a Super Bowl, had a rebuilding team that's never been lower than 12th in points, and is currently OC of the #1 scoring defense in the NFL.

People on this site, for the most part, have no idea what they are talking about when they criticize coordinators.

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I definitely agree. Hard to cite the misuse of playmakers by the DC as a reason for not liking him when he isn't given any playmakers to misuse.

Again, by playmaker I'm looking at the Von Miller, Aldon Smith, JJ Watt caliber players. A CB can only be so much of a playmaker and McCourty isn't misused, he's avoided by QBs even more than they avoid Revis, hard to make plays like that.

give me lavonte david.

send them a 4th and a 2nd...