Let's honour Manning on the TD record...

PATSNUTme said:

I got tied of listening to the verbal bubble bath last night, so I shut if off at half. They kept throwing out the stats like "most TD's against a coach - BB" Gee, BB is the longest tenured coach and most years they play each other twice, so I guess that might happen.

They forgot the 11-12 playoff record and the 1-2 Super Bowl record. TFB has a playoff record of 18-8 and a SB record of 3-2.

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Most INT against a team- New England - 30 INT
Most L against one team - New England - 14 L
Worst W% vs AFC team - New England - 0.384 W%
6th worst QB rating vs a team - New England - 87.2
2nd worst INT/Game vs AFC team - New England - 1.4 per game
3rd worst INT/Att vs AFC team - New England - 3.6 %
Worst blown lead, (also worst in Denver Broncos history) - 24 points, @ New England, Nov. 24, 2013

I could go on...

The competition committee's meetings must be like tootsie pop commercials. "How many rule changes does it take for Manning to win?"

I got nothing for forehead. I only celebrate patriot success tbh. But props to him, with all those pro bowl receivers throughout his career I aint shocked.

rochrist said:

Eh. Elway suffered some epic meltdowns in Super Bowls before they rebuilt the team around a running game.

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Not to mention completely ignoring the limitations of the salary cap

I am one of the rare NE fans that has no problem with Manning, it is the other fluke bag Manning that annoys me. Peyton broke the record and that says something, irrespective of his playoff losses and picks he threw along the way.

The media love him and all that but for me that is all taken with a grain of salt cause the media sucks (except patsfans.com which is awesome)...all other media are giving him a sponge bath and it is kinda creepy really. Take away all that garbage and he is an admirable dude.

Congrats Manning and I hope to see more Manning face later this year as you exit Foxboro...

*insert mention of sexual assault here*

I am just happy Manning broke the TD record true to his usual Manning form.

By this I mean passing 3 times from the 1 yard line on first and goal.

RobAllan said:

No question? Even with Unitas missing the cut by only a year (last year 1973,) I'm not sure I wouldn't want a Marino or Elway before Manning. (Even, perhaps, Steve Young. Although I would want to give a list more thought before throwing him in.) YMMV, but there is question. And if you remove the "past 40 years" stipulation he's even further down the depth chart relative to Brady.

I'm not saying he isn't an all-time great QB. Since Brady/Manning are the best 2 CURRENTLY, we keep trying to make it seem like they're close. But Brady deserves more respect than that convenience, I think.

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For all his prodigious talents, Elway was basically a 1:1 TD/Int guy until the Terrell Davis years. That's unacceptable, even in his era. True, he had to carry some pretty weak teams, and those teams always got destroyed when they played the big boys of the NFC. Marino was never the student that Manning was and fell off dramatically as he aged. Brady and Manning, that is obviously open for debate, but I don't think Marino or Elway have any legitimate claim to being in Manning's company.

Yes, congrats to Manning and all. But still, summation records, like this one, are not very impressive to me. This reminds me a bit of the 50,000 yards thing Brady just hit. I'm more a fan of percentage-based records. To me, this passing TD stat is partially a reflection of a player who started early, played late, was rarely injured and preferred to throw in the red zone. Clearly you also have to be good to set the record but it isn't just being good alone that gets you the sheer volume. This seems consistent with the 2 previous record holders, Favre and Marino. I imagine there is a percentage-based stat that quantifies something I'd find a bit more impressive. I remember it was mentioned that Manning has almost a 3 passing TD per game average. I find that a bit more interesting but the press just loves this TD stat.

Gronkandez said:

Unfortunately, to win Superbowls you need a balanced team and Manning has always been on pass happy teams loaded on offense but no so much on defense.

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This ignores the fact that the Colts has the #1 defense (points allowed) or #3 defense (yards allowed) in the entire NFL in 2007, were pretty decent on several other occasions, and got hot and carried him in 2006.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/clt/2007.htm

Average Colts D ranking*, 2001-2011: 16.1
Average Patriots D ranking*, 2001-2011: 16.6
* yards allowed from scrimmage, with Brady/Manning as starter


Year by year (ranked by yards allowed):

2001
Patriots D 24th
Colts D 29th

2002
Patriots D 23rd
Colts D 8th

2003
Patriots D 7th
Colts D 11th

2004
Patriots D 9th
Colts D 29th

2005
Patriots D 26th
Colts D 11th

2006
Patriots D 6th
Colts D 21st

2007
Patriots D 4th
Colts D 3rd

2008
Patriots - no Brady
Colts D -11th

2009
Patriots D 11th
Colts D 18th

2010
Patriots D 25th
Colts D 20th

2011
Patriots D 31st
Colts D - no Manning


Patriots defensive ranking for the 10 seasons Brady played, 2001-2011: 16.6 average
Colts defensive ranking for the 10 seasons Manning played, 2001-2011: 16.1 average

rochrist said:

What worries me is that, given how far Seattle has fallen off, I don't see anyone in the NFC who is a lock to take Denver down. Clearly it isn't SF. The Eagles? I don't think so. Who's left over there? The Saints can't beat Detroit for God's sake. GB? Maybe...but I wouldn't be willing to bet on it. I don't think they have anything like the defense you'd need. All that is assuming Denver makes it to the SB of course. But if they do, I'm afraid Peyton might get his second ring. It seems like it's all on the Pats, Baltimore or San Diego to stop them.

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Don't worry: Mark Cuban said Dallas will beat Denver in the SB.

If, IF that happens, I will be pulling against Jerry Jones, as he is far more hateable than Peyton Manning.

woolster22 said:

My favorite is the saints pick. That literally sealed the game. F that commercial sell out five head.

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Mine too, that was a great moment in shadenfrude history

rochrist said:

What worries me is that, given how far Seattle has fallen off, I don't see anyone in the NFC who is a lock to take Denver down. Clearly it isn't SF. The Eagles? I don't think so. Who's left over there? The Saints can't beat Detroit for God's sake. GB? Maybe...but I wouldn't be willing to bet on it. I don't think they have anything like the defense you'd need. All that is assuming Denver makes it to the SB of course. But if they do, I'm afraid Peyton might get his second ring. It seems like it's all on the Pats, Baltimore or San Diego to stop them.

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If denver wins the SB, Payton will be named MVP even if he throws five picks and has a qb rating of 10. He will ride off into the sunset while the media proclaims him the GOAT. You can book it. That would be sickening.

The previous record holder, Favre, is rarely regarded as a top 5 QB (yet alone #1 of all time).

Yet the moment Payton gets the record he's #1 of all time?!

letekro said:

For all his prodigious talents, Elway was basically a 1:1 TD/Int guy until the Terrell Davis years. That's unacceptable, even in his era. True, he had to carry some pretty weak teams, and those teams always got destroyed when they played the big boys of the NFC. Marino was never the student that Manning was and fell off dramatically as he aged. Brady and Manning, that is obviously open for debate, but I don't think Marino or Elway have any legitimate claim to being in Manning's company.

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Obviously, I disagree, since I pretty well already said it. I'd take Elway or Marino on Manning's teams and imagine they'd have a couple Bowls each at least, and probably less embarrassment in playoffs too. Just my opinion, but the point is the claim is certainly up for debate. After more time to think than my initial post, I'd also take Steve Young over Manning. So there's 3 on my list I'd have above him in addition to Brady in the past 40 years. Manning's constant choking and throwing teammates under the bus are both fatal flaws, imho.

The thing that separates Manning from the rest of the top QBs (not counting his tea-bagging of a female trainer at Tennessee) is his incredibly poor playoff record. While most top QBs produce the same or better numbers come playoff time, P6 is much worse. Even his little brother has outperformed him in the playoffs.

In all of his many playoff appearances, P6 has exactly 1 game winning drive and 1 come from behind victory. And those came in the same game in 2006 against the Pats when he had the benefit of not one but two phantom PI calls.

Meanwhile, Tommy LomBrady has has 4 come from behind wins and 7 game winning drives in the playoffs. Hell, I think Mark Sanchez might have more CFB wins and GWD's than old good ol' Omahead. I won't even get into the 8 or 9 one and dones that P6 has, many times as the greatest QB since sliced bread going into the playoffs.

RobAllan said:

Obviously, I disagree, since I pretty well already said it. I'd take Elway or Marino on Manning's teams and imagine they'd have a couple Bowls each at least, and probably less embarrassment in playoffs too. Just my opinion, but the point is the claim is certainly up for debate. After more time to think than my initial post, I'd also take Steve Young over Manning. So there's 3 on my list I'd have above him in addition to Brady in the past 40 years. Manning's constant choking and throwing teammates under the bus are both fatal flaws, imho.

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Elway has a career 59.3 QB rating in Super Bowls. Manning's career SB rating is 81.0. Elway had 3 TDs and 8 ints. Manning 3 TDs and 4 ints.

Manning may be a SB choker, but Elway is the absolute pinnacle of SB choke artists.

rochrist said:

Elway has a career 59.3 QB rating in Super Bowls. Manning's career SB rating is 81.0. Elway had 3 TDs and 8 ints. Manning 3 TDs and 4 ints.

Manning may be a SB choker, but Elway is the absolute pinnacle of SB choke artists.

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some have the nerve to say elway is better than joe montana.

those numbers are putrid.

Gronkowski123 said:

some have the nerve to say elway is better than joe montana.

those numbers are putrid.

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Heh.

Super Bowl, Montana vs. Elway.

Montana 22 for 29, 297 yds, 5 TDs, 0 ints.
Elway 10 for 26, 108 yds, 0 TDs, 2 ints.