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There have been several post game threads already, so because I will try not to repeat what's been said, this one should be a short edition......relatively (;) )

1. I can't say it too many times how impressive this win was. This is a good Bills team, especially on defense, coming off a huge road win against a good team, and playing in an electric environment, very similar to the one they saw in KC. :eek: And that's not even considering the injuries.

2. C'mon. Admit it. Didn't your heart sink, or cringe when you realized that for most of the game the OG's for the Pats were going to be Kline and Devey.....along with popular punching bag, Ryan Wendell at C. At that point even 20 points seemed like a pipe dream, let alone 37, with a lot left on the table. I know I did.

3. A few weeks ago many wondered if the current OL coach was competent. Well today's game should have answered that question permanently. Not only did he get 2 backups ready to play what is unquestionably one of the top 3 DLines in the league, he had to make another early game adjustment when he lost Connolly for the game. That's good coaching.....especially against a top DL with perhaps the best DT combination in the leay gue in KWilliams and Dareus.

4. Hughes DID beat Solder on one speed rush for a hit on Brady, but clearly on the sack on the PAP, there was a missed assignment that caused Solder to step inside. Hughes was on Hooman's inside shoulder, so either Solder complete blew his assignment, or Hooman was supposed to hit him before going out. Solder is likely to get killed this week, but given there were 37 pass attempts.....erring on 2 or 3 isn't horrible.
.
5. If you want to criticize the OL, the run blocking truly sucked and the Pats couldn't get even one RB to average even 3 yds/carry. That area needs to be looked at regardless who who is carrying the ball.

6. I know that everyone will comment on Revis essentially shutting down the great Sammy Watkins (2 for 27, and really only one that mattered), but it should be noted that Revis WASN'T in man coverage the entire time. I noticed that on several occasions he looked like he was in man coverage and dropped off into a zone. I was fine with that, because I believe in the importance of sometimes looking like one thing and then being in another. Kudos to the DC

7. I was totally irate at half time with the officials. It was clear to me that Gronk had control of the ball and that play NEVER should have been overturned. Plus there were several clear holds on Wilfolk and Ninko that were missed, and the one the sent me over the edge was negating a great pass to Lafell, by calling a hold on Cannon. The only reason Cannon might have had to hold Hughes was because Hughes was a full step off side. So in essence he was rewarded for his cheating on the snap.

But like with most things in the NFL, we got our share of calls in the 2nd half. There was one PI that was really weak, and one hold that could have been ignored. However I would point out to my Buffalo fan friends that the pick call was correct, even though there wasn't much contact. Don't forget that picking is illegal. Its not the NBA. You are not supposed to run pick plays in the NFL. What "supposed" to happen is that if 2 WR's in running their routes happen to force DB's to run into eachother, then too bad. Woods was clearly there to pick Dennard, and that was the right call.

To my Patriot fan friends, don't be outraged on the 2pt extra point, like I was at first. While it is true the ball NEVER crossed the plane, it didn't have to. When the receiver caught the ball, his FEET were in the endzone. IIRC, that is the only time where the ball doesn't have to cross the plane.

8. To this point of the season, the injury gods were relatively kind to the Pats, with only minor injuries keeping players out. However, we better start getting used to not seeing Ridely and Mayo for the rest of this season. I would be very surprised if we see either again, and its a crying shame. Next man up. Its time to see how good or bad Robert White truly is, because he is the next man up. On defense the job will be much harder to fill, since Mayo not only made plays, he often erased any mistakes made by others. Lets see who makes the leap.

9. Over 360 yds and only 1 of them credited to Tim Wright. It looked to me that he wasn't part of this week's game plan, and it was by design. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that he played less than 1o snaps on the offense. I'm OK with it. It will take time to him truly to be integrated into the offense. He will have his time to shine again.

10. Brian Tyms is another matter. He has CONSISTENTLY shown that he can go up and win contested footballs, both today and all through PS. Aaron Dobson is someone we HOPE will eventually be a deep threat. Brian Tyms is one right NOW!. And its a great aspect to have. One we haven't had since Randy Moss left the building. This will be great down the road if he progresses

11. On the negative side, which is probably a nit pick. Brady's 15 yd pass to Hooman brings out a kind of sore point for me. If you recall the play, Brady had a huge amount of time and looked at Hooman at least 2 times before he finally threw him the ball. Clearly he was wide open for a long time. It was like Brady didn't want to go to him and only in desperation reluctantly made the pass. It is my belief that Brady does this too often, ignoring wide open RB's and secondary receivers to his own detriment. Often teams know this and will ignore the receivers that Brady continually ignores.

I wish he would use his RB's and alternative receivers more than he does. For example if you watch the play where they say Gronk didn't have control, you will notice that in the OTHER seam, Wright was even more open than Gronk. I know you can't blame him for targeting Gronk, but his life would be easier if he started to include these secondary guys.

12. Even on a short week, the hapless Jets are making this hard to get up for. I hope the team is doing better than I am. They are still an NFL team and if you doubt my concern, the team most think are playing the best ball in the league (SD)are currently up JUST 30-28 on the team most concede to be the worst in the league (Oak)

13. It does my heart good to see Brian Hoyer and the Browns CRUSH the Steelers. Mike Florio will be especially crabby this week. ;)
 
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Great recap as always

I'm just glad to see the OL - who ever has to step up from week to week - recognize the role they each have to play, and play well as a unit. I'll admit I was worried by their play and they deserve some credit for doing the "man up" and all stepping up their games

It's also GREAT to see Brady spreading the ball around. What was it - 10 receivers today? That's pretty tough to stop regardless of whether there's a big name out there.

I know I've always been in the minority of preferring THIS type of offense to one in which we had the vast majority of attempts and completions going solely to Moss/Welker and more recently Edelman, but I'm VERY pleased to see Brady reverting to 2003/2004 form in terms of spreading the field.

Of course he needs the pass protection to make that happen, as we've seen.

But it's not a shocker that both the O and the D needed September to gel. I think the NFLPA did their players a disservice when they limited pre-season workouts as I don't think players are as well conditioned or prepared in September. This shows especially on a team like the Patriots with complex schemes.

And overall, while I know Bill fans are complaining about officiating, I think we can all agree the officiating, the Patriots have reason to gripe as well - and officiating has just been bad period for far too long
 
I picked the Bills to win 31-17.

Without the injury to Mayo, this team looks like it's fast approaching top 5 in the league. Brady's will and determination just cannot be overstated. I know there's a large contingent of whack-a-doo fantasy geeks that want Brady out of the picture, but a game like today illustrates just how myopic and out of touch "fantasy" opinions are. THAT was an example of HEART we all saw out there today. Quantify,categorize, insert and list all the numbers you want, you STILL cannot factor in the heart and will and the ultimate importance it plays in molding a WINNING FRANCHISE.
 
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It won't be difficult to get hyped to pummel the Jets. Ever.

Agree on the OL coach, happily agree. Also, Brady did connect with 10 different receivers.
 
I thought they might have a letdown after the Cincy high. I thought the injuries on the interior of the O line would play into Buffalo's ferocious defense. I thought Brady would probably lock in on Gronk and Edelman and the running game would get stuffed. I was right about the running game, the rest?...well, call me Nostradumbass...again.
 
I thought they might have a letdown after the Cincy high. I thought the injuries on the interior of the O line would play into Buffalo's ferocious defense. I thought Brady would probably lock in on Gronk and Edelman and the running game would get stuffed. I was right about the running game, the rest?...well, call me Nostradumbass...again.


I admit, I was running with you step by step re: my feelings going into this game, Joe.
 
Buffalo newspaper today:

BzuRFjyCQAAP5-S.jpg:large
 
Several things:
  • The Pats have a huge advantage in Thursday's game. Odds are the Jets will travel on Wednesday. That means they have two days to prepare while the Pats have three. That is probably the biggest reason why most of these Thursday night games are blowouts with the home team usually coming up on the winning side.
  • The big catch by Watkins right next to the end zone, Revis was playing off man and was back pedaling off the line rather than playing press man. He isn't nearly as effective when he does that.
  • Coach Gooch was unfairly maligned because of a rumor and the fact the o-line was in flux early (not to mention having to replace Scarnnechia). He seems to be a far more competent coach than people gave him credit for.
 
There have been several post game threads already, so because I will try not to repeat what's been said, this one should be a short edition......relatively (;) )

1. I can't say it too many times how impressive this win was. This is a good Bills team, especially on defense, coming off a huge road win against a good team, and playing in an electric environment, very similar to the one they saw in KC. :eek: And that's not even considering the injuries.

2. C'mon. Admit it. Didn't your heart sink, or cringe when you realized that for most of the game the OG's for the Pats were going to be Kline and Devey.....along with popular punching bag, Ryan Wendell at C. At that point even 20 points seemed like a pipe dream, let alone 37, with a lot left on the table. I know I did.

3. A few weeks ago many wondered if the current OL coach was competent. Well today's game should have answered that question permanently. Not only did he get 2 backups ready to play what is unquestionably one of the top 3 DLines in the league, he had to make another early game adjustment when he lost Connolly for the game. That's good coaching.....especially against a top DL with perhaps the best DT combination in the leay gue in KWilliams and Dareus.

4. Hughes DID beat Solder on one speed rush for a hit on Brady, but clearly on the sack on the PAP, there was a missed assignment that caused Solder to step inside. Hughes was on Hooman's inside shoulder, so either Solder complete blew his assignment, or Hooman was supposed to hit him before going out. Solder is likely to get killed this week, but given there were 37 pass attempts.....erring on 2 or 3 isn't horrible.
.
5. If you want to criticize the OL, the run blocking truly sucked and the Pats couldn't get even one RB to average even 3 yds/carry. That area needs to be looked at regardless who who is carrying the ball.

6. I know that everyone will comment on Revis essentially shutting down the great Sammy Watkins (2 for 27, and really only one that mattered), but it should be noted that Revis WASN'T in man coverage the entire time. I noticed that on several occasions he looked like he was in man coverage and dropped off into a zone. I was fine with that, because I believe in the importance of sometimes looking like one thing and then being in another. Kudos to the DC

7. I was totally irate at half time with the officials. It was clear to me that Gronk had control of the ball and that play NEVER should have been overturned. Plus there were several clear holds on Wilfolk and Ninko that were missed, and the one the sent me over the edge was negating a great pass to Lafell, by calling a hold on Cannon. The only reason Cannon might have had to hold Hughes was because Hughes was a full step off side. So in essence he was rewarded for his cheating on the snap.

But like with most things in the NFL, we got our share of calls in the 2nd half. There was one PI that was really weak, and one hold that could have been ignored. However I would point out to my Buffalo fan friends that the pick call was correct, even though there wasn't much contact. Don't forget that picking is illegal. Its not the NBA. You are not supposed to run pick plays in the NFL. What "supposed" to happen is that if 2 WR's in running their routes happen to force DB's to run into eachother, then too bad. Woods was clearly there to pick Dennard, and that was the right call.

To my Patriot fan friends, don't be outraged on the 2pt extra point, like I was at first. While it is true the ball NEVER crossed the plane, it didn't have to. When the receiver caught the ball, his FEET were in the endzone. IIRC, that is the only time where the ball doesn't have to cross the plane.

8. To this point of the season, the injury gods were relatively kind to the Pats, with only minor injuries keeping players out. However, we better start getting used to not seeing Ridely and Mayo for the rest of this season. I would be very surprised if we see either again, and its a crying shame. Next man up. Its time to see how good or bad Robert White truly is, because he is the next man up. On defense the job will be much harder to fill, since Mayo not only made plays, he often erased any mistakes made by others. Lets see who makes the leap.

9. Over 360 yds and only 1 of them credited to Tim Wright. It looked to me that he wasn't part of this week's game plan, and it was by design. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that he played less than 1o snaps on the offense. I'm OK with it. It will take time to him truly to be integrated into the offense. He will have his time to shine again.

10. Brian Tyms is another matter. He has CONSISTENTLY shown that he can go up and win contested footballs, both today and all through PS. Aaron Dobson is someone we HOPE will eventually be a deep threat. Brian Tyms is one right NOW!. And its a great aspect to have. One we haven't had since Randy Moss left the building. This will be great down the road if he progresses

11. On the negative side, which is probably a nit pick. Brady's 15 yd pass to Hooman brings out a kind of sore point for me. If you recall the play, Brady had a huge amount of time and looked at Hooman at least 2 times before he finally threw him the ball. Clearly he was wide open for a long time. It was like Brady didn't want to go to him and only in desperation reluctantly made the pass. It is my belief that Brady does this too often, ignoring wide open RB's and secondary receivers to his own detriment. Often teams know this and will ignore the receivers that Brady continually ignores.

I wish he would use his RB's and alternative receivers more than he does. For example if you watch the play where they say Gronk didn't have control, you will notice that in the OTHER seam, Wright was even more open than Gronk. I know you can't blame him for targeting Gronk, but his life would be easier if he started to include these secondary guys.

12. Even on a short week, the hapless Jets are making this hard to get up for. I hope the team is doing better than I am. They are still an NFL team and if you doubt my concern, the team most think are playing the best ball in the league (SD)are currently up JUST 30-28 on the team most concede to be the worst in the league (Oak)

13. It does my heart good to see Brian Hoyer and the Browns CRUSH the Steelers. Mike Florio will be especially crabby this week. ;)
Nice summary Ken. I enjoy reading your posts. :)
 
Great analysis, but can you elaborate on 7c. Are you saying that the ball does not need to cross the plane on 2-point conversions? I've googled this and can't find any corroboration.
 
Re: 7(b), I don't believe you are correct. I believe you cannot score a TD or 2pt conversion unless the ball is possessed in the endzone, meaning the player has possession and control of the ball and some part of the ball is in the endzone (which of course starts from the field-side edge of the goal line).

Here's the exact language from the real, actual, 2013 rulebook (i.e. not the "Digest of Rules"):

2013 Rulebook said:
Section 2 Touchdown
TOUCHDOWN PLAYS
Article 1 Touchdown Plays. A touchdown is scored when:
(a) the ball is on, above, or behind the plane of the opponents’ goal line (extended) and is in possession of a runner who has advanced from the field of play into the end zone; or
(b) a ball in possession of an airborne runner is on, above, or behind the plane of the goal line, and some part of the ball passed over or inside the pylon; or
(c) a ball in player possession touches the pylon, provided that, after contact by an opponent, no part of the player’s body, except his hands or feet, struck the ground before the ball touched the pylon; or
(d) any player who is legally inbounds catches or recovers a loose ball (3-2-3) that is on, above, or behind the opponent’s goal line; or
(e) the Referee awards a touchdown to a team that has been denied one by a palpably unfair act.
SUPPLEMENTAL NOTES
(1) The ball is automatically dead when it is in legal possession of a player and is on, above, or behind the opponent’s goal line.
(2) If a player attempts to catch a pass, the ball is not dead, and a touchdown is not scored, until the receiver completes the catch. See Rule 3, Section 2, Article 7.

In all those cases the ball had to break the plane for it to be TD.

And if you read further in the rulebook you'll see the rules for touchdowns govern 2pt conversions.
 
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Good post as we have come to expect on this board...

Seems as though this team is finally playing as a "team", as good as Brady was there were other unsung heroes.. Ninkovich, Wilfork, Chung, Collins, Chandler Jones and Gostowski.

Noticed that Zach Moore was in there and "around the ball"....

Our "D" bent more than I would like, but back to back really strong wins is a very good omen...

To have come into Ralph Wilson and face this "best front 4 in all of football" after an emotional week where this division rival was sold to a local "savior", was a very big win...

STFU all the naysaying idiot local mediots in the press and on the airwaves.. eat humble pie and start talking about sports instead of your insatiable egos...
 
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1. I can't say it too many times how impressive this win was. This is a good Bills team, especially on defense, coming off a huge road win against a good team, and playing in an electric environment, very similar to the one they saw in KC. :eek: And that's not even considering the injuries.

I thought they might have a letdown after the Cincy high. I thought the injuries on the interior of the O line would play into Buffalo's ferocious defense.

THAT was an example of HEART we all saw out there today. Quantify,categorize, insert and list all the numbers you want, you STILL cannot factor in the heart and will and the ultimate importance it plays in molding a WINNING FRANCHISE.

I wrote in one of the threads earlier this week:

My main interest in this game is to see what kind of intensity and focus the Pats display. They showed the ability to respond to adversity, now I want to see consistent effort and focus. They were so charged up against Cincinnati, it would be normal to see something of a letdown. If they can maintain the kind of intensity that they showed last week (as people have noted, reminiscent of the "FU tour" of 2007), that would go a long way towards showing that they have what it takes. The 2009 team is a good example of a team that was on a yo-yo all season, and a poor effort would be a huge red flag.

The Pats passed this test, IMO. The avoided a letdown and showed mental and physical toughness playing on the road in a charged up atmosphere, and with major injury issues. This TEAM is showing that it is not devolving into a repeat of 2009, but probably something more like 2011, with much more talent.

There is no such thing as a "dominant" team in the NFL anymore. The talent gap isn't big enough, and attrition and the challenge of staying mentally and emotionally sharp over a 17 week season is too great. There is only survival of the fittest. The teams that are best able to patch things up and overcome adversity with mental toughness are the ones that go to the playoffs.

The Pats are 4-2 and securely atop the AFC East. They have a short week to plan for the Jets and fill in for injured personnel, then a 10 day mini-bye, then a 2 week home stretch against Chicago and Denver, then a bye week, and then a 7 week sprint to conclude the end of the season. The badly need those 2 break periods to get people healthy and to iron out some of the kinks. I think they are showing signs of developing the mental toughness to do some serious damage, if they can survive the injuries.
 
I wrote in one of the threads earlier this week:



The Pats passed this test, IMO. The avoided a letdown and showed mental and physical toughness playing on the road in a charged up atmosphere, and with major injury issues. This TEAM is showing that it is not devolving into a repeat of 2009, but probably something more like 2011, with much more talent.

There is no such thing as a "dominant" team in the NFL anymore. The talent gap isn't big enough, and attrition and the challenge of staying mentally and emotionally sharp over a 17 week season is too great. There is only survival of the fittest. The teams that are best able to patch things up and overcome adversity with mental toughness are the ones that go to the playoffs.

The Pats are 4-2 and securely atop the AFC East. They have a short week to plan for the Jets and fill in for injured personnel, then a 10 day mini-bye, then a 2 week home stretch against Chicago and Denver, then a bye week, and then a 7 week sprint to conclude the end of the season. The badly need those 2 break periods to get people healthy and to iron out some of the kinks. I think they are showing signs of developing the mental toughness to do some serious damage, if they can survive the injuries.

Agree completely, they needed to show toughness and some consistency to really start believing they had righted the ship, and winning the way they did in Buffalo coming off the big Sunday night win was a really encouraging sign. And one of the most encouraging things for me was the way they played in the second half after losing Connolly. They had no real run game and the Bills were winning the battles at the LOS in the first half, and even though the Patriots had gotten 3 off the turnover right before the half I was concerned that the Bills dominance against the run was going to dictate the second half defensively, so when the Patriots were able to come out and go the distance on drive after drive and have their way with that defense I was exceptionally encouraged for their prospects going forward, even without Ridley. If their receivers continue to develop and give them the variety of options they did yesterday then this offense should be exceptional come play-off time, and the fact that they were able to play straight up without overcompensating for protection was also a really encouraging sign for them going forward. They need to go 2-1 the next 3 weeks and then go on a run down the homestretch, which has always been their MO in the past. If so i think we are looking at 11-5 and they will just have to go on the road and show they can win elsewhere in the play-offs. I don't think this is going to be a top seed team and imo even a bye is going to be a longshot this year, instead they will have to do it the hard way and go on a roll in the play-offs, but if they can still be a top 5 defense without Mayo then that is a real possibility.
 
Good stuff, Ken. The note on Googe, which others have made, is particularly apt. A few thoughts:

7. I was totally irate at half time with the officials. It was clear to me that Gronk had control of the ball and that play NEVER should have been overturned. Plus there were several clear holds on Wilfolk and Ninko that were missed, and the one the sent me over the edge was negating a great pass to Lafell, by calling a hold on Cannon. The only reason Cannon might have had to hold Hughes was because Hughes was a full step off side. So in essence he was rewarded for his cheating on the snap.

Agreed on Gronk. Two feet down, and he turned upfield off the second step before the ball was dislodged. That is exactly the line where the catch/drop needs to be called under the current rules, and the striped shirts have no clue. Next year's point-of-emphasis should be getting the fundamentals right. As if the drift of the rules were not a big enough embarrassment, the enforcement on the field and in the front office turn the officiating into a bad joke.

EDIT: Regarding Cannon's holding call, if a OT needs to hold to protect his QB from a DE that jumps offsides, the play should be called unabated to the QB and blown dead, even if the holding penalty doesn't occur until 2-3 seconds into the play. (This is just my thinking, but it's consistent with the intent of the rule and the league's desire to protect QBs.)

9. Over 360 yds and only 1 of them credited to Tim Wright. It looked to me that he wasn't part of this week's game plan, and it was by design. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that he played less than 1o snaps on the offense. I'm OK with it. It will take time to him truly to be integrated into the offense. He will have his time to shine again.

Reiss made what I think was a good observation on this:
http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-...16/patriots-offensive-snaps-16-for-tim-wright
Of Wright's 16 snaps, 12 came in the first half. One theory as to why his snaps weren't higher (he had 19 last week) is that the Bills were matching him in the 2-TE package with nickel personnel and the Patriots might have preferred to throw against the Bills' base personnel.
 
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Good stuff, Ken. The note on Googe, which others have made, is particularly apt. A few thoughts:



Agreed on Gronk. Two feet down, and he turned upfield off the second step before the ball was dislodged. That is exactly the line where the catch/drop needs to be called under the current rules, and the striped shirts have no clue. Next year's point-of-emphasis should be getting the fundamentals right. As if the drift of the rules were not a big enough embarrassment, the enforcement on the field and in the front office turn the officiating into a bad joke.



Reiss made what I think was a good observation on this:
http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-...16/patriots-offensive-snaps-16-for-tim-wright

The ref's are completely clueless on these rules, how they can give AJ Green the TD last Sunday and rule that Gronk didn't catch that ball is beyond me. Much as i love football and the Patriots the way that the game has devolved to depend entirely upon the whims of the refs is disgusting
 
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