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Vikings RB Adrian Peterson indicted for child abuse; deactivated for Pats game at Minnesota


Weak.

Hernandez was going to be charged with murder. Since he wasn't really a flight risk, and since he was a very high profile rich guy, the authorities made sure they did every single thing by the book.

I know it's not popular to be anything but a total homer in this forum, but the Patriots were not as "decisive" and "immediate" as some would like to believe.

If the latter is true, how would the Patriots have known the former? Doing things by the book doesn't include informing the employer of an impending charge.

Moreover: http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...ady-to-cut-aaron-hernandez-in-event-of-arrest

In other words, they had already decided, days before the arrest occurred, that an arrest would lead to his release. They were willing to give him the benefit of the doubt until then, which seems perfectly fair.
 
Apparently, we have moved to a country where private organizations have taken the place of the legislature, police and courts. And the mob decides what actions should be taken. IMHO, this is very, very wrong. At best the NFL and/or teams should suspend with pay, pending court action, and then have clear penalties that DO NOT require their own police force.

I'm in mostly full agreement, but I would actually argue that the mob doesn't decide what action should be taken (after all, "the mob" should dictate policies of the legislature, police, and courts in a true democracy), but rather corporate profit motive does.

The only point of departure is a small but important nuance. That is that most NFL teams receive massive public subsidies in the form of stadium financing, and the NFL league office is tax-exempt which is itself a backdoor form of public subsidy. This adds a layer of complication to the issue.

Frankly, my response would be to recognize sports as a public good and socialize the NFL and have all 32 teams owned like the Packers are, with profits shared reinvested in the team and/or shared with the locality, which would end the role of corporate policing altogether. Probably not a popular idea on this board, though.

But for the most part, I'm in agreement.
 
TEAM
When should the team suspend a player? Since he has not been proven guilty, a team should suspend with pay until there is a guilty plea.

The players sign an ambiguous morals clause. The players have accepted this. So, they can certainly be fired for being arrested, or for having violated the morals of the team.

I guess each team can have its own standards of when they will exact punishment in addition to those given by the police and court system. Obviously, we can turn the other way when a player uses drugs or is involved illegally with those who are. Each team can decide whether a player who has served a sentence should be cut. Of course, another team can sign such a player.
The team is the employer. They do not all have to have the same view on who they want to employ.

After the appeal, I suspect that Rice will be playing for someone in the NFL, this year or next.
I'm not sure. This topic is such a hot button teams may just avoid him and sign a different RB.


Apparently, we have moved to a country where private organizations have taken the place of the legislature, police and courts. And the mob decides what actions should be taken. IMHO, this is very, very wrong. At best the NFL and/or teams should suspend with pay, pending court action, and then have clear penalties that DO NOT require their own police force.

You are mixing criminal penalties with actions by an employer.
The NFL is not going to put Peterson in jail. They are not in anyway taking the place of the court. What they are doing is making an employment decision.
I think it is very difficult to have a clearcut menu of penalties for violations because each case has its own circumstances.
 
BTW, is anyone keeping count of how many illegitimate kids Peterson has? I know one died last year at the hands of his Babymomma's BF. The one he beat with a switch is two, the one he beat on the head is three. I believe the current count is seven, if you believe TMZ (and why wouldn't you, they seem to be more reliable source than the NFL or its Commish).

http://www.tmz.com/2013/10/16/erica-syion-adrian-peterson-baby-mama-children-count-tmz-live/

Of course, this article was from last October, so the actual count might be higher by now.

I'm officially calling for him to get his job back, because if he doesn't, the job of supporting his illegitimate litter is going to land on us, the taxpayers.

Seriously, how many times can you fall into the same trap/commit the same mistake?
 
  • Agree
Reactions: PP2
BTW, is anyone keeping count of how many illegitimate kids Peterson has?

I'm not sure how we could hope to accomplish this when AP himself cannot. But the last count I saw was 7.
 
The team is the employer. They do not all have to have the same view on who they want to employ.


I'm not sure. This topic is such a hot button teams may just avoid him and sign a different RB.




You are mixing criminal penalties with actions by an employer.
The NFL is not going to put Peterson in jail. They are not in anyway taking the place of the court. What they are doing is making an employment decision.
I think it is very difficult to have a clearcut menu of penalties for violations because each case has its own circumstances.
The NFL is NOT the employer. It is an entity, partially funded by public monies, who has decided to set rules to punish criminal offenses.

Teams can indeed have its own policies. However, a team is NOT free to have any set of rules it wishes. For example, if Hernandez been exonerated, the patriots would likely have lost a very large lawsuit. Owners are free to take those risks.

I strongly disagree with your idea that the NFL should exact major financial punishments on players with no clearly defined rules. I am not at all comfortable with the NFL and its teams deciding what actions outside the workplace are punishable by major financial penalties, without clear rules.
======================

We are discussing financial consideration. SURELY, it is not the business of the NFL or the teams to be our arbiters of morality, and the punisher of improper action. We have legislatures and courts for that function.

Ban all felons and those convicted of child abuse or spousal abuse if you wish. Personally, I don't think that this is appropriate. Banning them, or depriving them of pay, without any civil conviction is simply wrong.
======================
With regard to Peterson, I guess that the state of MINN who partially paid for the stadium can put moral conditions on its support of the team. Again, I think that this is poor politics and poor policy.
 
The NFL is NOT the employer. It is an entity, partially funded by public monies, who has decided to set rules to punish criminal offenses.
Of course they are the employer.
How is the NFL funded by public monies?
They are not punishing criminal offenses, they are punishing actions that are violation of their collectively bargained code of conduct.
Surely you can see the difference, even though some violations fit both criteria.

Teams can indeed have its own policies. However, a team is NOT free to have any set of rules it wishes. For example, if Hernandez been exonerated, the patriots would likely have lost a very large lawsuit. Owners are free to take those risks.
They are as free to have any rules they wish as any other employer.
Would your employer have fired Michael Vick, Hernandez, Rice, Hardy, Peterson, Stallworth?
That would be their decision and of course they can implement them as they see fit.

I strongly disagree with your idea that the NFL should exact major financial punishments on players with no clearly defined rules. I am not at all comfortable with the NFL and its teams deciding what actions outside the workplace are punishable by major financial penalties, without clear rules.
======================
It was collectively bargained. It's been clear for quite some time that the league will punish actions that harm its reputation. They certainly have every right to do that.


We are discussing financial consideration. SURELY, it is not the business of the NFL or the teams to be our arbiters of morality, and the punisher of improper action. We have legislatures and courts for that function.
This is where you are wrong. Morality is a part of virtually every employment contract in this country.
The league/teams have a right to employ whoever they want. Moral character is certianly an allowable criteria just as the ability to block or tackle is.

Once again, the courts determine LEGAL consequence. The league is not doing that.

Ban all felons and those convicted of child abuse or spousal abuse if you wish. Personally, I don't think that this is appropriate. Banning them, or depriving them of pay, without any civil conviction is simply wrong.
======================
Wouldn't you think that this is the decision of the employer who is paying those players millions of dollars? Why do they pay them millions of dollars? So they can make more millions. Its a business. If an employee costs a company money, they are gone. These players are damaging the ability of the NFL to make money, because CONSUMERS and advertisers are coming out and saying they do not want to support the team and league if those players are part of it.

If Hernandez got off on a technicality and the Patriots resigned him, do you not think that would damage the brand, and cost them money advertisers and fans?
You are arguing they would not have the right to not want that.



With regard to Peterson, I guess that the state of MINN who partially paid for the stadium can put moral conditions on its support of the team. Again, I think that this is poor politics and poor policy.
The state of Minnesota has no power in telling the Vikings what they can do. They can however, like advertisers and fans voice their opinion, and of course the team will take that into account, because public relations are vital to their financial success.

If this was the CEO of a major corporation, do you really think that he would still be employed?
 
I'm officially calling for him to get his job back, because if he doesn't, the job of supporting his illegitimate litter is going to land on us, the taxpayers.

Seriously, how many times can you fall into the same trap/commit the same mistake?
As many times as his mind tells him it doesn't care.
 
Since he has not been proven guilty, a team should suspend with pay until there is a guilty plea.
...
When someone is accused of a crime, what should happen? Should the NFL really exact punishment with no police action at all, or because they didn't like the police action?

Mgteich, this approach might make sense in cases where a player is accused of a criminal act and denies doing it. (Though I'd hate to think of the Patriots being required to pay Aaron Hernandez for the ages he awaits trial behind bars.)

But what about cases like Peterson's, when the behavior is not disputed, only the criminality of it? Or when the behavior is decidedly legal but morally offensive? (Imagine a player who filled a YouTube channel with racist rants.) Criminal liability can't be the only standard of acceptable behavior for a company's most visible employees.
 
It just keeps piling up. Those things are just coming out of the woodwork.

And where is Goodell? Not displaying good leadership here as was mentioned elsewhere.

I'm laying 5 to 1 odds that this new development will also involve Goodell not taking appropriate action.

If that is the case, I am reaffirming my theory that someone or some group wants him out, and badly.
 
The Wilf family are pieces of ****. They talk about doing the "right" thing. They were never interested in doing the "right" thing. They're not doing the "right" thing now. They're deactivating Peterson again because pressure from sponsors and losing business. This is a business decision. If sponsors didn't start suspending their sponsorship they would have let Adrian Peterson play. They never cared about doing the "right" thing and they sure don't care right now. They had a chance to do the "right" thing and they blew it. They're the scum of the earth as far as I'm concerned. Greedy Bastards.

I'm starting to wonder how many more owners lack a moral compass, how many put business and making more money before doing the right thing. Goodell is a scumbag rat. But the owners and their "fraternity" are the real problem.
 
Mgteich, this approach might make sense in cases where a player is accused of a criminal act and denies doing it. (Though I'd hate to think of the Patriots being required to pay Aaron Hernandez for the ages he awaits trial behind bars.)

But what about cases like Peterson's, when the behavior is not disputed, only the criminality of it? Or when the behavior is decidedly legal but morally offensive? (Imagine a player who filled a YouTube channel with racist rants.) Criminal liability can't be the only standard of acceptable behavior for a company's most visible employees.

I agree with you that there can be issues that are unacceptable to the NFL, even if not illegal. However, this is a very slippery slope.

With regard to employers (the teams), they can have much more leeway in deciding what is unacceptable to their teams. Certainly the patriots when Myra was alive had very different policies than Oakland, Baltimore or Cincinnati.

Is the NFL to be the arbiter of morality in the US? Read the Texas law. I am not sure that a jury of Peterson's peers in Texas or much of the South would convict.

I see the two cases as very different.

RICE was punished by the league for spousal abuse, after the league had decided to punish players for such actions. How to punish was not specifically set down. Goodell decided on a 2-week suspension, understanding that the courts also were free act. The NFL subsequently decided on a 6-week suspension as a punishment for this behavior. It is not clear the the NFL should change the punishment based on rules that occurred after the event. IMHO, the NFL did even worse, it decided on an indefinite sentence. The appeal process will sort this out, and the courts if necessary. I expect Rice to play again, especially if his wife testifies on his behalf.

PETERSON acted as he was taught, and as many in the South act. I find this attitude toward children to be especially heinous and hope for a long jail sentence. However, I don't think this is in any way the business of the NFL. The team can decide what is best for them. In any case, I certainly expect to see Peterson playing lots more football in the NFL.

BOTTOM LINE
There are many societal issues relating to violence, most clearly including spousal and child abuse. The NFL CAN try to address these issues, but personally, I do not think that the NFL is the right one to do so.

I also find it somewhat strange that folks would decide that they do not believe that players should ever be able to earn a living because of an incident of private behavior, already adjudicated by the courts.
 
Weak.

Hernandez was going to be charged with murder. Since he wasn't really a flight risk, and since he was a very high profile rich guy, the authorities made sure they did every single thing by the book.

I know it's not popular to be anything but a total homer in this forum, but the Patriots were not as "decisive" and "immediate" as some would like to believe.

You could not be further off if you tried (and I'm sure you are trying).

What PP2 wrote is right on the mark:

"In other words, they didn't jump the gun until they received the word that AH was going to be charged with murder, then they cut him right there and then, absorbing a big cap hit.

Don't know how they could have done it any better."

The Patriots had to wait for Hernandez to be arrested in order to avoid a Players Association revolt.

Not only that, but they VOIDED HIS CONTRACT (and also ate the salary cap hit).

The Vikings have done no such thing 6 days after the indictment.

Those are incontrovertible FACTS. Obviously, you intend to ignore those facts in your quest to be a martyr on this '"total homer" forum. Some people like Shank get off to that kind of thing.
 
The Wilf family are pieces of ****. They talk about doing the "right" thing. They were never interested in doing the "right" thing. They're not doing the "right" thing now. They're deactivating Peterson again because pressure from sponsors and losing business. This is a business decision. If sponsors didn't start suspending their sponsorship they would have let Adrian Peterson play. They never cared about doing the "right" thing and they sure don't care right now. They had a chance to do the "right" thing and they blew it. They're the scum of the earth as far as I'm concerned. Greedy Bastards.

I'm starting to wonder how many more owners lack a moral compass, how many put business and making more money before doing the right thing. Goodell is a scumbag rat. But the owners and their "fraternity" are the real problem.

SB39 thinks the Patriots did not act as quickly and decisively with Hernandez...........
 
BTW, is anyone keeping count of how many illegitimate kids Peterson has? I know one died last year at the hands of his Babymomma's BF. The one he beat with a switch is two, the one he beat on the head is three. I believe the current count is seven, if you believe TMZ (and why wouldn't you, they seem to be more reliable source than the NFL or its Commish).

http://www.tmz.com/2013/10/16/erica-syion-adrian-peterson-baby-mama-children-count-tmz-live/

Of course, this article was from last October, so the actual count might be higher by now.

I'm officially calling for him to get his job back, because if he doesn't, the job of supporting his illegitimate litter is going to land on us, the taxpayers.

Seriously, how many times can you fall into the same trap/commit the same mistake?


They can share in his assets. Stuff can always be sold off.
 
SB39 thinks the Patriots did not act as quickly and decisively with Hernandez...........

Didn't Sports Illustrated report that Belichick was threatening Hernandez with release for a domestic disturbance that didnt even result in an arrest?
 
if anyone is being revisionist, it's YOU, SB 39....but then this is your M.O....put yourself on a desert island and then claim you're in the middle of Manhattan at rush hour.
 


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