Patriots Rank #1 in pass defense

Beating DEN or GB is all I care about---you can pad your stats against the Vikes and Raider and everything looks great. I could see Arodg dropping 50 against this "no. 1 pass D" Guys like Chandler Jones tend to disappear against good teams.

We're #4 according to this http://www.nfl.com/stats/team which ranks by

Although I guess if you rank it by the 'Rate' (QBR?) we have the lowest allowed, therefore #1

bostonia3333 said:

Beating DEN or GB is all I care about---you can pad your stats against the Vikes and Raider and everything looks great. I could see Arodg dropping 50 against this "no. 1 pass D" Guys like Chandler Jones tend to disappear against good teams.

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You think the packers will score 50 on us?

KontradictioN said:

To the people a couple of years ago that were screaming "points!!!!!" in thread after thread when discussing the defense: This is what a good pass defense looks like.

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Do you feel YPG or PPG is a better measurement of a defense?

TommyBrady12 said:

Do you feel YPG or PPG is a better measurement of a defense?

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My measurement for a defense:

1. PPG
2. Turnovers
3. YPG
4. Opposing quarterback rating

All of those should be taken into account when rating a defense.

TommyBrady12 said:

You think the packers will score 50 on us?

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Don't feed the trolls.

KontradictioN said:

My measurement for a defense:

1. PPG
2. Turnovers
3. YPG
4. Opposing quarterback rating

All of those should be taken into account when rating a defense.

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I think yards per attempt and yards per carry are more useful than total YPG. A team can throw the ball a lot, especially when way behind, and rack up some yards, but if their yards per attempt is low then they will be very inefficient and moving the ball. The Pats rank among the league leaders in this category through 2 games, allowing under 5 YPA (332 yards in 68 attempts). In 2013 we allowed an average of 7 YPA; 7.7 YPA in 2012 and 8 YPA in 2011 were similarly near the bottom of the league.

mayoclinic said:

I think yards per attempt and yards per carry are more useful than total YPG. A team can throw the ball a lot, especially when way behind, and rack up some yards, but if their yards per attempt is low then they will be very inefficient and moving the ball. The Pats rank among the league leaders in this category through 2 games, allowing under 5 YPA (332 yards in 68 attempts). In 2013 we allowed an average of 7 YPA; 7.7 YPA in 2012 and 8 YPA in 2011 were similarly near the bottom of the league.

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Although it's not the way I've personally rated defenses, I don't have a problem with that. My general problem was with cherry picking the statistical catagories to make the defense seem better than it was when all of them should be taken into account. Those four are just what I personally look at (in that order) when rating a defense.

mayoclinic said:

I think yards per attempt and yards per carry are more useful than total YPG. A team can throw the ball a lot, especially when way behind, and rack up some yards, but if their yards per attempt is low then they will be very inefficient and moving the ball. The Pats rank among the league leaders in this category through 2 games, allowing under 5 YPA (332 yards in 68 attempts). In 2013 we allowed an average of 7 YPA; 7.7 YPA in 2012 and 8 YPA in 2011 were similarly near the bottom of the league.

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An obscure stat that is a really good gauge of a defense's effectiveness is the amount of negative pass plays. Add up incompletions, sacks and ints. When the other team has a high number of those, your D is usually playing very well.

KontradictioN said:

Although it's not the way I've personally rated defenses, I don't have a problem with that. My general problem was with cherry picking the statistical catagories to make the defense seem better than it was when all of them should be taken into account. Those four are just what I personally look at (in that order) when rating a defense.

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The reason I like those stats is that they give you a sense of how hard the defense is making the offense work for yards. Make the other team work for their yardage (low YPA), limit the big plays, and win the turnover battle, and you will generally have a low-scoring defense and a winning record.

I think our defense will get better and better and should be top 5 barring injuries. I know BB likes to confuse QBs in the secondary, but the key is the pass rush. I'm confident with Collins back we will be able to create some pressure and perhaps BB might blitz a bit more with Revis Island (I know he's not a blitzer).

Points per game has always seemed to be the best stat. The total of hurries, sacks and interceptions tells the tale of a pass defense. Net turnovers is a good indicator.

The best indicator is the number of games with a positive net points.

That is because the dolphins fix not need to pass ball.

So far so good.

It's only been two games so I'll reserve judgement. All signs point to being a good pass defense. Still want to make sure they can stop the run consistently. The Raiders were a top 10 pass defense a few years back. However those numbers were skewed because they were 32nd against the run. The game plan was to run every chance they got because teams knew that was the way to beat them. I doubt they were top 10 in pass defense realistically.

In no way do I think we are in that category but I'm going to let their play speak for itself over the first half of the season. It was unfamiliar territory last Sunday watching the pass defense look dominant. Very hard to contain my excitement for the next game. We've seen the offense kill it for so long that most of us got used to it in a ho hum fashion. To see this defense do what it did Sunday was something we haven't seen in awhile. Exciting times indeed.

Im really not getting the dolphins game argument. Tannenhill still threw it 32 times and they ran it 38. So it's not like they abandon the pass for the run.

His avg attempt was 5.6(5.0 if you count the sack) in the game and his TDs were a 4 yard pass to Miller with Nink covering and a ball that was tipped and took a lucky bounce. Says to me the pass d was playing good enough.

Play around with this chart in the passing defense section. 2012. The Patriots sucked by any measure.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2012/opp.htm

I like Net Yards Per Pass Attempt. Stay under 6.0 and you have a solid to excellent pass defense.

Another category I'd put in there would be 3rd down defense. The Pats have been terrible at that and I think that is about to change in a big way. No more screaming at the tv is a good thing.

I didn't care if it was 3rd and 20, I'd hold my breath and wonder how they were going to give up the 1st down.

Nice start but still way too early to really evaluate them, by the halfway mark we should have a really good idea about both the pass defense and the team overall. Ultimately I really don't care about yards that much, what i care about is 3rd downs, red zone, and turnovers. I believed they would lead the league in interceptions because they should be playing from ahead and they have ballhawks in their secondary for the first time in a long long time. Revis numbers have always been down because people won't throw near him, but he showed what will happen last week if they decide to, and i really like both McCourty and Ryan when the ball is in the air, both have shown they can create the turnovers and hopefully that only improves this season.

goheels22002 said:

Play around with this chart in the passing defense section. 2012. The Patriots sucked by any measure.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2012/opp.htm

I like Net Yards Per Pass Attempt. Stay under 6.0 and you have a solid to excellent pass defense.

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AS I said in another post the yards aren't that important, it's situational football that matters. A few years ago they may have had the worst situational pass defense i have ever seen, they would allow 3rd and long to be completed every time and sucked in the red zone, how that team ever made it to the Super Bowl is still beyond me, Belichick, Brady, and duct tape imo.

I see yards put up in garbage time all the time that are part of the yards against numbers but are really irrelevant when it comes down to it.

TommyBrady12 said:

Do you feel YPG or PPG is a better measurement of a defense?

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This wasn't really directed at me but I personally wouldn't feel comfortable with only using one or the other....or even really trying to put one over the other. I mean I guess in the end they decide the game based on "points", but to give a good evaluation of a defense I think you need both of these, as well as other stats. Turnovers forced, Third down conversion rates, Red Zone conversion rates, Negative pass plays (the obscure stat mentioned above), Opposing QB rating, etc.

There is so much context that goes into a football game, especially since players typically only play either offense or defense. A defense can help make an offense look good (say by returning a interception to the opponent's 1 yard line), or can hurt/skew an offense's game-plan by giving up a lot of points early. Likewise, if an offense really sputters and can't sustain drives, you're keeping the defense on the field and potentially putting them at a disadvantage.

That doesn't really answer your question of whether YPG or PPG is a "better" indication, but I guess at the end of the day points are the most important statistic. It's easier to overlook giving up a lot of yards than it is to giving up a lot of points, because with the former the question always comes: "Well how many points did they score".