Discuss the defense

What a difference a week makes. I realize it was Minnesota minus Peterson and Cassel didn't exactly cover himself in glory but after that first drive they really stepped it up defensively and they played much closer to the way we all expected them to play. I watched it live but really haven't had a chance to go back and look at the schemes etc... so hopefully those who played closer attention can weigh in on what the differences were and how the players were used. They clearly had Jones out on the edge more and Hightower probably had the best game of his career, Revis, Ryan and McCourty also had really good games so I will be interested to hear the various takes on what they were doing and why it worked so much better.

They played so well, I actually don't think Cassel played THAT bad despite what his numbers say. There was nothing. No where for him to go. The Patriots D owned that field.

We seemed to settle down a bit as we get used to the 3-4, and we have players a bit more healthy. We seem to have a nine-man front seven, with Collins out at the moment.

4 DT's: Wilfork, Siliga, Easley, Chris Jones (only Easley under 300 lbs at 290)
5 DE & LB's: Ninkovich, HIghtower, Mayo, Collins, Chandler Jones

5 backups: Buchanan, Moore, Vellano, White, Skinner

It would seem with all nine healthy, the backups should get little work. That being said, I still think that we are thin at linebacker. Skinner provide little depth. White is s special team only player (only one rep on defense last year).

So who played DE all night?

i believed the defense was championship caliber, even after week 1. if the coaches but the players ina position to succeed, i dont see why we cant be a great defense as long as our players do their job. the game changer is revis. if revis is revis that changes everything. the jets dont go to two afc championship games without him. he allows you to do a lot of different things. our talent is right there with those jets defenses in 09-10.

Over the first two games it is top 5 in yards allowed and probably 1st in creating turnovers, or close to it.

Turnovers. In the first half at Miami. Sunday in Minnesota. Turnovers at this rate could make things easier for TB and his little friends.

What did you guys think of Skinner? How did he do?

patriot1136 said:

What did you guys think of Skinner? How did he do?

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He is quite possibly the slowest linebacker that I've ever seen. He made Brandon Spikes look like a track star.

At one point it looked like I saw Ebner replace Skinner. Can anyone verify this for me? Thank you.

Also, besides Melvin Ingram, Easley may be the stoutest dt under 300lbs I have seen in years.

farn said:

Turnovers. In the first half at Miami. Sunday in Minnesota. Turnovers at this rate could make things easier for TB and his little friends.

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The thing about turnovers is that you are relying on someone else to make a mistake. That works if your opponents are careless with the ball, but it is not a good way to make a living. The yardage and first down stats from yesterday looked pretty even, but Cassel threw three bad balls and had one unlucky bounce. It is seldom that turnovers can be considered the lifeblood of a defense, unless you can bring the pressure and force them. The Pats have a hard time with that unless their offense is dominating. I'm not taking anything away from their playmakers on D, and they have several of them, but they've got a long way to go yet.

FourierSeries said:

Over the first two games it is top 5 in yards allowed and probably 1st in creating turnovers, or close to it.

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#4 in both passing YPG and total YPG.

QB12 said:

#4 in both passing YPG and total YPG.

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while I agree that Cassel shouldnt have thrown those balls, the defensive players had perfect coverage which was why they can up with the interceptions. Logan ryan was pretty impressive as well IMO.

As far as the defense goes, they finally put players in a position to succeed vs last week IMO..

1. Hightower/Chandler jones as DE playing downhill getting after the QB(and both were pretty dominant doing that)

2. Revis following the opposing teams best receiver around on the field and playing press man coverage.

Nice job by Ryan making Patterson essentially a non-factor. Considering Dennard wasn't on the injury report and might have been a late scratch, it looks like Ryan's extensive playing time might have been unexpected. if that's the case, double kudos.

Secondary play was near perfect. I can count on one hand the gaffes in our secondary, most were Logan Ryan related but he still played good overall and of course he is going to get targeted.

If our front seven plays the way they did today I think we have a top 10 defense because our secondary can cover with the best of them.

Formation wise, I can't wait to go through and watch more closely but I have rewatched a few plays already. I sawWilfork at 3-tech RDT/DE, Jones and Ninkovich at 5-tech DEs with Easley at NT on 3rd down. Ninkovich seemed to be playing 5-tech LDE the entire game.

VrabelJr said:

Ninkovich seemed to be playing 5-tech LDE the entire game.

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If that's correct - and from Reiss' defensive snap count, I suspect it is - then Ninkovich is a god. The guy can do just about anything, and do it well.

patriot1136 said:

What did you guys think of Skinner? How did he do?

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After watching him yesterday Skinner should not be allowed to wear #55.

Doug Kyed charts the defensive pass coverage stats:

LB Deontae Skinner — three catches on three targets for 50 yards
CB Logan Ryan — 3-6, 37 yards, interception, pass breakup
LB Dont’a Hightower — 5-7, 35 yards, pass breakup
LB Jerod Mayo — 3-3, 22 yards CB Kyle Arrington — 2-5, 21 yards
CB Darrelle Revis — 1-5, 4 yards, interception
S Devin McCourty — 0-1, interception
S Duron Harmon — 0-1
S Patrick Chung — 0-1
CB Malcolm Butler — 0-1, pass breakup
DT Dominique Easley — interception

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Read more at: http://nesn.com/2014/09/donta-hightowers-enhanced-pass-rush-among-takeaways-from-patriots-win/

Imagine if Jamie Collins had been playing instead of Skinner.

pencilneckgeek said:

The thing about turnovers is that you are relying on someone else to make a mistake. That works if your opponents are careless with the ball, but it is not a good way to make a living. The yardage and first down stats from yesterday looked pretty even, but Cassel threw three bad balls and had one unlucky bounce. It is seldom that turnovers can be considered the lifeblood of a defense, unless you can bring the pressure and force them. The Pats have a hard time with that unless their offense is dominating. I'm not taking anything away from their playmakers on D, and they have several of them, but they've got a long way to go yet.

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This is totally false, unless you think all the Patriots Super Bowl teams were lucky. Great defenses force mistakes and turnovers constantly.

Through the years, Belichick defenses have generally had enough playmakers to finish on the plus side in turnover ratio. The Patriots were plus-7 in 2001 en route to their championship in Super Bowl XXXVI. In 2002, they were plus-5, followed by plus-17 in 2003. Last year, the team was plus-9.

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http://www.boston.com/sports/footba...05/10/12/patriots_hope_to_turn_over_new_leaf/

Check our wins against Peyton over the years. It's not because he happens to be careless. Without being forced into mistakes, he usually destroys defenses.

I'm really liking Hightower's play. He is playing with an attitude. He really looks good rushing the QB. Also Easley looks good like the way they are working him in. Has the season goes on this defense could be top 5