Greg Cosell on Brady........

Gumby said:

We had One of These "big-armed guys" once- one of the better ones in the league..... His name was Bledsoe. Just in case iapatsfans had forgot;

Oh, by the way... TB replaced him......cause he was better!

Click to expand...

Never liked him. From day one it seemed like he often perceived pressure when it wasn't there. Also thought he was soft mentally when things weren't going well.

Edelman is not Randy Moss. Brady just makes him look that way sometimes, so when Edelman blows a route, it looks like it's Tom Brady's fault. As I said in the other thread, this is the difference between having an ACTUAL good receiver and having guys that Tom Brady just makes look good.

Edelman blew it. If he kept going, Tom put it where it would of been a TD pass.

People claiming that was Brady's bad don't know anything.

JackBauer said:

iapatsfan,

Do you ever post when things are going well for the team? Do you ever make posts that could be construed as positive toward the team and/or its players?

Click to expand...

I know he had a penalty, but after re-watching the game again on a flight, I thought Hightower showed some good things when rushing the QB. However, this team will only go as far as Brady can take them, and I see a significant decline in his physical ability. That is my primary concern.

People are hard on Bledsoe. He may never have been able to get us over the line to win a SB, but he helped turn the franchise round, and that AFCCC win over Pittsburgh was vital.

You would think sometimes people wished we had got Rick Mirer.

AndyJohnson said:

Didn't look to me like he slowed much, and in any event, the pass was completed.

Click to expand...

It was completed, but for all of those clamoring for a big, fast, outside the numbers WR, I believe this play depicts why a guy like that would be irrelevant. I love JE as a #3 slot guy, but he is not a burner. This was a middle of the field throw to a guy with moderate speed, and Brady couldn't lead him for additional yards or a TD. I don't believe Brady's arm strength would allow us to take advantage of an explosive outside guy.

iapatsfan said:

It was completed, but for all of those clamoring for a big, fast, outside the numbers WR, I believe this play depicts why a guy like that would be irrelevant. I love JE as a #3 slot guy, but he is not a burner. This was a middle of the field throw to a guy with moderate speed, and Brady couldn't lead him for additional yards or a TD. I don't believe Brady's arm strength would allow us to take advantage of an explosive outside guy.

Click to expand...

I disagree. He would have led a faster receiver by more than that.
Look, I know you have a big agenda about being negative so I'm just going to get out of this now, and put you on ignore, because this is the only way it ends well. There is little value to this board in you and I having any discussions at all.

AndyJohnson said:

There is little value to this board in you

Click to expand...

I fixed it for you.

Gumby said:

We had One of These "big-armed guys" once- one of the better ones in the league..... His name was Bledsoe. Just in case iapatsfans had forgot;

Oh, by the way... TB replaced him......cause he was better!

Click to expand...

We had one of those "big-armed guys" a couple of weeks ago...

People were happy to get a 7th round pick for him.

As to the throw itself, yes it was a little either under thrown (but 1-2 yds isn't enough to say his arm now sucks) or misjudged (which on a 44 yd play is easy to do), or the dL flying by his feet left n right we're bothering him.

Me personally, I think he gets a lot more nervous in the pocket than he used to pre-pollard. As long the pocket holds he is like before, but when the OL sux, ...
On that throw he did appear to have a lot of loft (throwing at 45 deg) because he couldn't step into it enough; so I think it was a conscious decision to trade depth on the throw for less time standing exposed in the pocket.

AndyJohnson said:

I disagree. He would have led a faster receiver by more than that.
Look, I know you have a big agenda about being negative so I'm just going to get out of this now, and put you on ignore, because this is the only way it ends well. There is little value to this board in you and I having any discussions at all.

Click to expand...

Question: Are reality and "negativity" mutually exclusive, or can these two be congruent? If, by December, Brady's degradation of ability is obvious to even the staunchest of homers, will my comments still be considered "negative", or will they be placed under the label of Historical Fact?

iapatsfan said:

It was completed, but for all of those clamoring for a big, fast, outside the numbers WR, I believe this play depicts why a guy like that would be irrelevant. I love JE as a #3 slot guy, but he is not a burner. This was a middle of the field throw to a guy with moderate speed, and Brady couldn't lead him for additional yards or a TD. I don't believe Brady's arm strength would allow us to take advantage of an explosive outside guy.

Click to expand...

To me, Brady's arm strength is fine. I just think he's timing is off when he's making deep throws to smaller WRs. You can see when he throws deep to Edelman he's trying to make perfect touch throws. If he had a big, fast WR, I think he wouldn't have to make perfect throws knowing the catch radius would be a bit bigger and he can probably air it out a bit more.

Hoping Dobson gets back on the field. Or they throw deep to Thomkins more so than to Edelman.

condon84 said:

To me, Brady's arm strength is fine. I just think he's timing is off when he's making deep throws to smaller WRs. You can see when he throws deep to Edelman he's trying to make perfect touch throws. If he had a big, fast WR, I think he wouldn't have to make perfect throws knowing the catch radius would be a bit bigger.

Click to expand...

In my opinion this throw is less relevant to the overall point than some of the other throws of the day. I don't know how anybody can watch the 4th quarter of that game and not feel Brady has a hard time pushing the ball downfield and to the sideline (over 10 yds).

I wonder how much Brady's struggles are due to Tom Martinez not being there anymore

Brady has never been a deep ball with pin point accuracy type of qb - Randy Moss probably blurred Brady's deep ball reality a ton. Look at him prior to Moss - his deep targets, if they ever threw it deep were one of Troy Brown, David Patten, Bethel Johnson, Tim Dwight, and Reche Caldwell, Deion Branch etc. IF memory serves, those were the guys that ran the long pass routes. One of Brady's best throws ever was a long sideline throw to Caldwell in 06 AFC Champ game - on a line with about 2' left on 3d and 10 for 40-50 yards basically to win the game. that actually might be Brady's biggest playoff moment since he last won a super bowl - on the road, to go to the super bowl...hasn't done anything comparable, especially in an underdog role, in a really long f#cking time...
Back on topic, Brady was never great with the deep ball, Moss skewed public opinion, and now, at the age of 37, he's not as good as he was when he was 26 or 27, which was great to start...

TommyBrady12 said:

I wonder how much Brady's struggles are due to Tom Martinez not being there anymore

Click to expand...

I think it has a lot more to with him being 37 and not being the most naturally gifted guy to begin with. Brett Favre was a far more naturally gifted guy (not saying better QB) to begin with, and by the time he was Brady's age he was with the Jets and his drop in skills was obvious. Why do people continue to think this can't possibly be the case with Brady?

FCB02062 said:

Brady has never been a deep ball with pin point accuracy type of qb - Randy Moss probably blurred Brady's deep ball reality a ton. Look at him prior to Moss - his deep targets, if they ever threw it deep were one of Troy Brown, David Patten, Bethel Johnson, Tim Dwight, and Reche Caldwell, Deion Branch etc. IF memory serves, those were the guys that ran the long pass routes. One of Brady's best throws ever was a long sideline throw to Caldwell in 06 AFC Champ game - on a line with about 2' left on 3d and 10 for 40-50 yards basically to win the game. that actually might be Brady's biggest playoff moment since he last won a super bowl - on the road, to go to the super bowl...hasn't done anything comparable, especially in an underdog role, in a really long f#cking time...
Back on topic, Brady was never great with the deep ball, Moss skewed public opinion, and now, at the age of 37, he's not as good as he was when he was 26 or 27, which was great to start...

Click to expand...

I'd say the best throw I ever saw Brady make was the incompletion to Moss at the end of the 1st Pats/Giants Super Bowl. When you see how far that ball went in the air, and how accurate it was, it's one of the best throws I've ever seen.

See below. The Brady of today would not come close to making this throw.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=YUGj5qQFnnc

To be fair to Brady - how many legitimate deep threats or outside-the-lines guys has he had over the past 5 years? 1?

iapatsfan said:

I'd say the best throw I ever saw Brady make was the incompletion to Moss at the end of the 1st Pats/Giants Super Bowl. When you see how far that ball went in the air, and how accurate it was, it's one of the best throws I've ever seen.

See below. The Brady of today would not come close to making this throw.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=YUGj5qQFnnc

Click to expand...

If it was another 5 yards deeper, that's a TD, at the very least a reception. But it's hard to fault Brady. He threw that from the Pats 12 yard line and it landed on the Giants 20 yard line.

Moss was a freak. Double teamed, CB playing 10 yards off and S playing over the top 30 yards off but he still ran by both of them.

iapatsfan said:

Question: Are reality and "negativity" mutually exclusive, or can these two be congruent? If, by December, Brady's degradation of ability is obvious to even the staunchest of homers, will my comments still be considered "negative", or will they be placed under the label of Historical Fact?

Click to expand...

Keep saying it year in and year out and eventualy you'll end up being right. How many years have you been going on about this now?

Danger Zone said:

I love Edleman, but he should not be who Brady is throwing to on the outside.

Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more. Edelman is playing out of position and its actually impressive as hell that he's been as successful as he has. That being said, small, slow, and weak WRs don't scare the Ravens, Broncos, etc. Especially now that they know our line is full of holes. Theyre going to do what the Jets/Ravens do/did. Jam at the line and blitz like crazy. Amendola and Edelman won't be able to get off jams at the line and Brady will get destroyed due to the lack of time from the oline and how long it takes the WRs to get separation, IF they get any at all.

EDIT: Also, I think some people on PF think we want another Moss, while yes that would be nice its not going to happen. It's the fact that the Pats have ZERO burners and one guy who can go up and get the ball (in college) in Dobson. The Broncos added Sanders, improved their defense, and oline last year. The Pats signed Revis and Browner, but the pass rush is still bad. And oh yeah, signed Brandon LaFell and traded their all pro (declining) OL Mankins for Tim Wright...

When are the Pats going to learn as Brady gets older they have to surround him with better talent/speed and MUST protect him, like Pinkhead