Logan Mankins Traded

Interesting update From Rapaport:

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/504651633045688321

Ian RapoportVerified account‏@RapSheet

#Bucs really 1st called about acquiring a #Patriots backup guard. Pats expressed interest in TE Tim Wright. Soon it was “How about Mankins?”

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VJCPatriot said:

I was hoping for at least a 1st round pick back for Mankins. We're only getting 4th. I hope the tight end we got in return is really good. All I know is that he is from Rutgers. *facepalm*

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Pats have done ok with kids from Rutgers. DMC, Harmon, Ryan...

ATippett56 said:

I don't give a crap about your argument. It's obvious YOU can't see the forest thru the trees.

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Then dont respond to my post.
Not sure what forest I am supposed to be seeing, since my post was asking why pointing out that the guy was wrong about the year had anything to do with the piece of the discussion that the Patriots have done well when Mankins has been sidelined.
Or are you one of those guys who thinks when you think you are right about something, every contradictory piece of information must be squashed so you can win the internet?

AndyJohnson said:

Then dont respond to my post.
Not sure what forest I am supposed to be seeing, since my post was asking why pointing out that the guy was wrong about the year had anything to do with the piece of the discussion that the Patriots have done well when Mankins has been sidelined.
Or are you one of those guys who thinks when you think you are right about something, every contradictory piece of information must be squashed so you can win the internet?

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It's obvious YOU can't see the forest thru the trees.

BradyFTW! said:

Interesting update From Rapaport:

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/504651633045688321

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Interesting indeed... So it was the Patriots who initiated the idea of moving Mankins himself. Guess they really wanted to get that salary off the books once he refused to reneg.

Bostonian1962 said:

I agree with you. Lovie blasted Wright last week, and said he can't block, OR catch. I gotta think, with them bringing in TEs and not liking Wright's performance, that we could have gotten Wright for nothing soon. A 4th round pick for an All Pro Guard, from a team desperate for a guard? Wow, that suxxxxx!

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You can't analyze an NFL trade without considering the cap effect.
How many teams would even consider trading for a $10mill OG? THAT has a tremendous impact on trade value, as well as the level of value you need to get back for the trade to be a positive for you.

Miguel said:

No, before his trade Mankins' 2015 cap number was 11 million. It is now $4 million. Gross cap savings = 7 million. Net cap savings = $6,490,000 as a player with a $510,000 salary takes Mankins' place in the Top 51 list.

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And there was no way they were going to pay him 11 million next season and no way Mankins was going to take a dime less than what he had signed for, so a release nect offseason with no compensation was really what they were looking at. I hate losing Mankins and didn't think they got enough in return but given that outcome and the potential to get Revis and McCourty done I can certainly understand where the Patriots are coming from. Now let's see those deals get done.

ATippett56 said:

It's obvious YOU can't see the forest thru the trees.

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I will take that as you have no intelligent response to my comments.

BradyFTW! said:

Interesting update From Rapaport:

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/504651633045688321

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Very interesting.

AndyJohnson said:

I will take that as you have no intelligent response to my comments.

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Focus on the BIG picture.

I will be more behind this move if it is followed by a Revis long term extension. Right now the return for an all-pro guard look pretty slim. Mankins despite his faults or unwillingness to take a dime less than what he originally signed for was still one of our best offensive linemen, period.

patchick said:

Yep, Jason Cole has reported that the Patriots twice approached Mankins about restructuring -- once in January and then again before the trade -- and he refused. Cole is one of the more reliable sources out there, IMO.

Here's one link: http://larrybrownsports.com/football/logan-mankins-trade-pay-cut/239487

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He's not willing to take one for the team, then out the door he goes. Makes sense to me.

Great trade. Old expensive, somewhat washed up guy for a talented, cheap TE/receiver and a fourth round pick.

Bostonian1962 said:

I agree with you. Lovie blasted Wright last week, and said he can't block, OR catch.

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That was a one time comment that was taken out of context to some extent.

Saying :

"He hasn't played as well as Tim should be playing," Smith said. "He's dropped some balls. If you watched practice, he's dropped balls. But he's a big part of what we want to do with the two-receiver, two-tight-end set. Tim hasn't blocked as well inside. Once you're that H-back and you don't block, now they say you're just another receiver and teams start going nickel. If they do that at least you have to be a good pass catcher. Tim's a good player. He just hasn't played as well as he needs to lately."

Obviously isn't a compliment but saying he isn't playing as well as he should doesn't mean he has been bad. He just wasn't at the level he wanted him. And he DID NOT say he can't block or catch.

And then things got better :

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/136608/tim-wright-back-in-good-graces-with-lovie

“He’s responded well,’’ Smith said. “Let me go back and talk on Tim. I love Tim Wright as a football player. You go through spells where you don’t play your best ball for a short period of time. When I talked [previously], there was a little period of time where Tim hadn’t played his best ball.
“But, you look at the big picture, Tim Wright has been a good football player for us. We like what he’ll be able to do. There have been other days we’ve talked about, going forward, what we’re going to do with him. You can split him out, the matchups we have with safeties and linebackers. You can catch me at any time and I might be disappointed in a player. But, big picture, no, there’s no disappointment with Tim Wright. We like him being on our football team.’’

ATippett56 said:

Focus on the BIG picture.

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The discussion isn't about the big picture it is about the details.
Clearly you want to win the internet so fear any detail that conflicts with your conclusion.
Thats fine, you just have to continue being an internet tough guy and you can squash all of the facts that do not support your conclusion and win the internet. HOORAY.

kennyb said:

He's not willing to take one for the team, then out the door he goes. Makes sense to me.

Great trade. Old expensive, somewhat washed up guy for a talented, cheap TE/receiver and a fourth round pick.

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Mankins may not be as good as he was in 2009 but to say he is "somewhat washed up" is a bit much.

VJCPatriot said:

I will be more behind this move if it is followed by a Revis long term extension. Right now the return for an all-pro guard look pretty slim. Mankins despite his faults or unwillingness to take a dime less than what he originally signed for was still one of our best offensive linemen, period.

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Logan Mankins is or was the best offensive guard on the New England Patriots roster. This is Richard Seymour deja vu except without the first round draft compensation.

AndyJohnson said:

The discussion isn't about the big picture it is about the details.
Clearly you want to win the internet so fear any detail that conflicts with your conclusion.
Thats fine, you just have to continue being an internet tough guy and you can squash all of the facts that do not support your conclusion and win the internet. HOORAY.

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You don't have a clue what you are talking about. Dan Connolly was not a better offensive guard than Logan Mankins in 2010 and Dan Connolly was not a better offensive guard than Stephen Neal in 2010.

BelichickFan said:

That was a one time comment that was taken out of context to some extent.

Saying :

"He hasn't played as well as Tim should be playing," Smith said. "He's dropped some balls. If you watched practice, he's dropped balls. But he's a big part of what we want to do with the two-receiver, two-tight-end set. Tim hasn't blocked as well inside. Once you're that H-back and you don't block, now they say you're just another receiver and teams start going nickel. If they do that at least you have to be a good pass catcher. Tim's a good player. He just hasn't played as well as he needs to lately."

Obviously isn't a compliment but saying he isn't playing as well as he should doesn't mean he has been bad. He just wasn't at the level he wanted him. And he DID NOT say he can't block or catch.

And then things got better :

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/136608/tim-wright-back-in-good-graces-with-lovie

“He’s responded well,’’ Smith said. “Let me go back and talk on Tim. I love Tim Wright as a football player. You go through spells where you don’t play your best ball for a short period of time. When I talked [previously], there was a little period of time where Tim hadn’t played his best ball.
“But, you look at the big picture, Tim Wright has been a good football player for us. We like what he’ll be able to do. There have been other days we’ve talked about, going forward, what we’re going to do with him. You can split him out, the matchups we have with safeties and linebackers. You can catch me at any time and I might be disappointed in a player. But, big picture, no, there’s no disappointment with Tim Wright. We like him being on our football team.’’

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That was dated 8/21...I bet TB had the calls w/ BB 8/20...

BelichickFan said:

That was a one time comment that was taken out of context to some extent.

Saying :

"He hasn't played as well as Tim should be playing," Smith said. "He's dropped some balls. If you watched practice, he's dropped balls. But he's a big part of what we want to do with the two-receiver, two-tight-end set. Tim hasn't blocked as well inside. Once you're that H-back and you don't block, now they say you're just another receiver and teams start going nickel. If they do that at least you have to be a good pass catcher. Tim's a good player. He just hasn't played as well as he needs to lately."

Obviously isn't a compliment but saying he isn't playing as well as he should doesn't mean he has been bad. He just wasn't at the level he wanted him. And he DID NOT say he can't block or catch.

And then things got better :

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/136608/tim-wright-back-in-good-graces-with-lovie

“He’s responded well,’’ Smith said. “Let me go back and talk on Tim. I love Tim Wright as a football player. You go through spells where you don’t play your best ball for a short period of time. When I talked [previously], there was a little period of time where Tim hadn’t played his best ball.
“But, you look at the big picture, Tim Wright has been a good football player for us. We like what he’ll be able to do. There have been other days we’ve talked about, going forward, what we’re going to do with him. You can split him out, the matchups we have with safeties and linebackers. You can catch me at any time and I might be disappointed in a player. But, big picture, no, there’s no disappointment with Tim Wright. We like him being on our football team.’’

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I think this story has been brought up ("Lovie said Wright sux!"), then freaked out over ("OMG we could've got him for nothing in a few days!!!! WTF"), then clarified ("That's taken out of context, and Lovie backtracked and said Wright is doing very well again").... then brought back up again, rinse lather repeat, at least 3 or 4 times in this thread now.

ATippett56 said:

You don't have a clue what you are talking about. Dan Connolly was not a better offensive guard than Logan Mankins in 2010 and Dan Connolly was not a better offensive guard than Stephen Neal in 2010.

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When did I say that?