Had they both been available, would you have picked Manziel or Garoppolo?

rookBoston said:

Here's my problem with the OP... Most people who never heard of JAG prior to the draft will swear up and down (now) that they would have made the pick. And now that Manziel has (further) exposed himself to be a jackass, it's easy to be super smart in retrospect. But there's no way in hell.

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Danger Zone said:

You are cherry picking the exceptions. But lets take a look at those.

1. Corey Dillon, Haynesworth, Talib, Hernandez, Moss and Johnson were at least publicly consummate Patriots.
2. Haynesworth was released and was still very respectful of his time here.
3. Johnson was released and was incredibly respectful of his time here.
4. Law was allowed to leave
5. Cox was allowed to leave after 1 year.
6. Moss was traded when his diva started showing.
7. Hernandez was threatened with being fired after his domestic abuse charges

The Patriots have a "way" that has little to do with being a goody-goody-two-shoes and infinitely more to do with:

A. Team first selflessness
B. Not being a diva
C. Acting in a way that's best for the team
D. Acting in a way that doesn't embarrass the team or cause distractions
E. With the Patriots a players past history is just that -in the past. In fact giving troubled NFL players a second chance is part of the enigmatic Patriots Way in that the Patriots don't care nearly as much about a player's past as they do about how he behaves while they are on their roster.

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primetime said:

Then what does this have to do with Manziel? He flipped the bench off in a preseason game while playing in Cleveland. It's not like he's muled drugs (Law), beat up his girlfriend (Dillon), ran over a meter maid (Moss), or, you know, murdered a whole bunch of people (you know who). I just don't see how this is an argument against Manziel being an "anti-Patriot" when you're going to tell me all those guys who did much worse things were model Patriots.

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RayClay said:

If you understand what the word imagine means, you understand why I used it. It's a hypothetical.

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Brady6 said:

I get it, but even hypothetical it makes little sense. Manziel was the #22 pick in the draft; Garopollo was the #62 pick in the draft. That hypothetical “what if” is as I said the equivalent of my saying who would you have taken Clowney, or Easley at #29, Manziel was never going to be on the board at #62, and Garopollo was never going to be taken in the first round. So sure this “what if” is fun but it is also illogical and extremely premature, you are asking the question about Garopollo when he is on a high and Manziel is on a low. I hate Manziel, but anyone on the board who claims they would have taken Garopollo over him if they were both on the board at the same time is lying out their rear.

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Brady6 said:

I get it, but even hypothetical it makes little sense. Manziel was the #22 pick in the draft; Garopollo was the #62 pick in the draft. That hypothetical “what if” is as I said the equivalent of my saying who would you have taken Clowney, or Easley at #29, Manziel was never going to be on the board at #62, and Garopollo was never going to be taken in the first round. So sure this “what if” is fun but it is also illogical and extremely premature, you are asking the question about Garopollo when he is on a high and Manziel is on a low. I hate Manziel, but anyone on the board who claims they would have taken Garopollo over him if they were both on the board at the same time is lying out their rear.

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RayClay said:

Hypotheticals, are "what ifs". They are constructed situations that do not necessarily conform to reality. A number of other posters seemed to get that and it generated some good responses.
I personally hate Manziel's playing style and decision making and stated so before the draft. I wouldn't have drafted him in the 7th round, though I would have tried to trade the pick, therefore I would have drafted Garropollo first in my hypothetical situation. I'm sure another team would have drafted him higher, but that's not what the question was.

Why would you draft a quarterback who's style didn't fit, that you didn't like, just because other teams rated him highly?

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Brady6 said:

To be completely honest I would not have drafted Manziel or Garopollo if I were doing the drafting. I am pleased with what I have seen from Garopollo so far but for the next 4 years, he is extremely likely to be what Mallett has been an enigma that is never seen and only speculated on. I think posters overlook the fact that for the past 10 years we have had the best QB in the NFL and have failed to win a Super Bowl. If we cannot win with the best player at the most important position, I see no reason to believe we are going to be able to win with Ryan Mallett or Jimmy Garopollo now or in 5 years. For that reason I am against the idea of allocating significant resources to the backup QB right now, I felt we should have drafted a player that would have helped us win a Super Bowl while we still have Brady and a good shot at the Lombardi.

I would have taken Manziel because he offers the best trade value, not because I wanted him to be the QB. If you think Garopollo is the future starting QB of the Patriots I would have to disagree, Garopollo is the next Ryan Mallett. Brady’s replacement will be drafted in the 2017 draft and sit behind Brady and Garopollo for 2017.

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RayClay said:

A lot of people hold that opinion of drafting someone else. I would never draft a player I didn't want to trade him, just trade the pick.

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rookBoston said:

Here's my problem with the OP... Most people who never heard of JAG prior to the draft will swear up and down (now) that they would have made the pick. And now that Manziel has (further) exposed himself to be a jackass, it's easy to be super smart in retrospect. But there's no way in hell.

Some of the real draftnik fans on this site who did extensive scouting of the candidates will own up to the fact that Manziel was kinda intriguing predraft...remember BB brought him in to Foxboro for a face to face, which caused a stir. And some of them actually realized then what we all figure now as obvious: BB would have been frustrated coaching Manziel, especially off the field.

But still... There's no saying that Johnny Football wouldn't have behaved differently this preseason if he had Brady as a role model, and Belichick as a boss. Gronkowski spends his summers and weekends almost exactly as recklessly as Manziel, and I'm not seeing Pats Fans vilify Gronk as incongruous with the Patriots Way. Talib was an ass on the field, too, and is still remembered fondly by the fans. Spikes had his porno thing. Welker did that media thing mocking Ryan's foot fetish. That stuff makes BB nutty. But doesn't make those players undraftable.

Myself, I was thinking McCarron or Savage all the way, and I saw Garoppolo as a small school risk that I was okay to pass on. But when BB drafted Jimmy, I was cool with that. And if BB had drafted Manziel I would have been totally okay with that, too, because he knows what he's getting into, thinks it can be managed and presumably it would have meant he believes in the upside...which is still there!

Just comes down to: BB knows football and these players better than I ever will. The fact that he pulled the trigger on Polo in the 2nd seemed like a 'meh' idea to me on draft day. But then I was skeptical when he drafted Mankins (who?... a OG in the 1st?), and so I've given up the idea of second guessing him. Garoppolo is another BB pick that got lots of criticism in the media at the time, but starting to look damn smart in retrospect.

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Brady6 said:

To be completely honest I would not have drafted Manziel or Garopollo if I were doing the drafting. I am pleased with what I have seen from Garopollo so far but for the next 4 years, he is extremely likely to be what Mallett has been an enigma that is never seen and only speculated on. I think posters overlook the fact that for the past 10 years we have had the best QB in the NFL and have failed to win a Super Bowl. If we cannot win with the best player at the most important position, I see no reason to believe we are going to be able to win with Ryan Mallett or Jimmy Garopollo now or in 5 years. For that reason I am against the idea of allocating significant resources to the backup QB right now, I felt we should have drafted a player that would have helped us win a Super Bowl while we still have Brady and a good shot at the Lombardi.

If I had to pick, I would have taken Manziel because he offers the best trade value, not because I wanted him to be the QB. If you think Garopollo is the future starting QB of the Patriots I would have to disagree, Garopollo is the next Ryan Mallett. Brady’s replacement will be drafted in the 2017 draft and sit behind Brady and Garopollo for 2017.

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Brady6 said:

I get it, but even hypothetical it makes little sense. Manziel was the #22 pick in the draft; Garopollo was the #62 pick in the draft. That hypothetical “what if” is as I said the equivalent of my saying who would you have taken Clowney, or Easley at #29, Manziel was never going to be on the board at #62, and Garopollo was never going to be taken in the first round. So sure this “what if” is fun but it is also illogical and extremely premature, you are asking the question about Garopollo when he is on a high and Manziel is on a low. I hate Manziel, but anyone on the board who claims they would have taken Garopollo over him if they were both on the board at the same time is lying out their rear.

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