Tight end Shuffle: Hartsock, Maneri, Terrence Miller in; Jones, Watson, RB Houston out

chasa · Aug 14, 2014

TonyTucker said:
They sure looked cool in the AFCCG when they scored 3 points until garbage time.

TE should have been a priority. Look at how many stinkbombs they've signed and released recently. It's pretty sad that the talent behind Gronk is so bad than HOOMAN is considered decent. He stinks, too.

I'm sure thats all on the TE position and didn't factor in that Dobson and thompkins were both less then 100%, and that a street free agent(Collie) was seeing major looks because we had one single healthy wide receiver(minitron).

Of all the teams in the league I would switch TE groups with MAYBE 4 teams. MAYBE.

Ring 6 · Aug 14, 2014

Elijah said:
I don't see what made Hartsock any different from Matthew Mulligan.

I don't either. Seems like the goal was to fill the same role of a glorified extra OT.
I assume Hartsock was found to be over the hill.

Ring 6 · Aug 14, 2014

Brady6 said:
I liked what Mulligan gave us last season so if Maneri can play a similar role I would be pleased. I just don't even know if Hooman will be ready for the season. I also think Hooman is being overrated because our TE situation is so dyer. He is a solid depth option but having him as the primary backup isn't ideal in my opinion. He has had 2 straight seasons where he had a tremendous opportunity to step in and prove he could be a starting caliber TE and he didn't show much at all.

As I have been saying, Hooman is not a starting quality TE, but that makes us just like basically every other NFL team. Look around, the TE position in the NFL is very weak.

PatsWickedPissah · Aug 14, 2014

You're right Andy. It's so weak that I bet a prison team like in that movie could field better TEs.

Brady6 · Aug 14, 2014

PatsWickedPissah said:
You're right Andy. It's so weak that I bet a prison team like in that movie could field better TEs.

I think that's why Hernandez was excused from court today. It was the divisional round of the PFL.

Brady6 · Aug 14, 2014

Colt Lyerla has torn MCL and PCL.

Packers' Colt Lyerla reportedly has torn MCL, PCL - NFL.com

captain stone · Aug 14, 2014

Elijah said:
I don't see what made Hartsock any different from Matthew Mulligan.

Neither do I; both of them absolutely suck.

Brady6 · Aug 14, 2014

captain stone said:
Neither do I; both of them absolutely suck.

They should have drafted CJF he would have been a great fit as the in line blocking TE and he would have been able to contribute in the pass game.

captain stone · Aug 14, 2014

If CJF were still available at the end of the 3rd round, then I agree. I would not however have drafted
him at the end of the 2nd round. I wouldn't have drafted JG at 62 either, but that's a subject for another thread.

What disappoints me about the draft specific to the TEs is that Bill should've been more aggressive
in signing the many UDFAs available who were better than Watson & Jones, similar to not signing
Joesph Fauria last year.

BTTA · Aug 15, 2014

chasa said:
Of all the teams in the league I would switch TE groups with MAYBE 4 teams. MAYBE.

This is a worthwhile conversation. Which ones?

patchick · Aug 15, 2014

captain stone said:
If CJF were still available at the end of the 3rd round, then I agree. I would not however have drafted
him at the end of the 2nd round. I wouldn't have drafted JG at 62 either, but that's a subject for another thread.

What disappoints me about the draft specific to the TEs is that Bill should've been more aggressive
in signing the many UDFAs available who were better than Watson & Jones, similar to not signing
Joesph Fauria last year.

Totally agree on CJF -- not only was he NOT a 2nd-round talent, if they had been so rash as to draft him there the board would have exploded in cries of "REACH!! He would have been available later!"

As for the the other UDFAs, I'm surprised how many people suggest that could have been some kind of solution to the position. This is a draft where even a stiff like Lynch went in round 5. Sure, statistically it's likely that one of the many UDFAs will develop into something, but even that something will probably be the next Michael Hoomanawanui, not an immediate legit backup to Gronkowski.

IMO if you want to argue that the Pats "ignored opportunities" at TE, free agency is the only place to look.

BradyManny · Aug 15, 2014

Bill would much rather go into a season with weak depth at a position than spend foolishly on it in free agency. It's a good principle to have, though it means you are at the whims of what is available to you in a given offseason, and past personnel mistakes (or, say you're starting TE being a homicidal maniac) continue to hurt you.

I'm not at all comfortable with what we have at TE, but as others have pointed out, we're not worse off than most of the league. And if Gronk is healthy, we have the best tight end in the world. So, there's that.

Nobody said we had to have 2 Pro Bowl TEs all the time, it just happened we ended up with that. We'll play to our strengths. We have several good skill players on offense.

Miguel · Aug 15, 2014

2014 NFL Depth Charts By Position | TE | Ourlads.com

may be helpful.

chasa · Aug 15, 2014

betterthanthealternative said:
This is a worthwhile conversation. Which ones?

I think the lions have a group Brady would make elite, the Bills(If moeaki is anything close to 100%) has a nice group, the Bengals are similar to the lions, Lots of young talent, and finally the eagles Celek has always been dependable, and Ertz was really starting to flourish last season.

All four teams have a solid duo at a mimimum, but the patriots with a 100% gronk is still better then all of them.

mgteich · Aug 15, 2014

As with QB, the question is the quality of our backup or #2. nil.com recently rated Mallett as the #8 backup QB.

How do we think that Hooman rates as a backup or #2 TE? How many teams have a better backup, a better #2? Where would you rate Hooman?

Isn't this the issue? Surely, one way to look at dealing with injury is to consider who will be player who is forced to start (as with QB). An injury to Gronk would force us to emphasize other positions. Surely we don't expect any TE to replace Gronk.
==================================

In ADDITION to having a backup to Gronk (and plans to deal with an injury to him), we have considered whether a move or pass-receiving TE would be a valuable addition, even with Gronk healthy. Sure, any quality addition would be helpful, but choices need to be made. It is not at all clear that a move TE would get much playing time or be more than the #8 receiver on the team (after Gronk, 4 WR's, and 2 RB). Perhaps, a solid addition could be the #7 or even #6 receiving threat.

IMHO, if Gronk is healthy, a move TE is of limited value unless he is a top player.

Ring 6 · Aug 15, 2014

mgteich said:
As with QB, the question is the quality of our backup or #2. nil.com recently rated Mallett as the #8 backup QB.

How do we think that Hooman rates as a backup or #2 TE? How many teams have a better backup, a better #2? Where would you rate Hooman?

Isn't this the issue? Surely, one way to look at dealing with injury is to consider who will be player who is forced to start (as with QB). An injury to Gronk would force us to emphasize other positions. Surely we don't expect any TE to replace Gronk.
==================================

In ADDITION to having a backup to Gronk (and plans to deal with an injury to him), we have considered whether a move or pass-receiving TE would be a valuable addition, even with Gronk healthy. Sure, any quality addition would be helpful, but choices need to be made. It is not at all clear that a move TE would get much playing time or be more than the #8 receiver on the team (after Gronk, 4 WR's, and 2 RB). Perhaps, a solid addition could be the #7 or even #6 receiving threat.

IMHO, if Gronk is healthy, a move TE is of limited value unless he is a top player.

Good post.
If you ranked backup TEs, other than a couple of good ones, you can just throw a blanket over the rest of them, because the difference is minor, and with any of them replacing Gronk our offense would change dramatically. Whether that would be a guy catch 14 passes or 23 isn't very relevant to me.

I would love to have a great backup TE, but looking over the league, those guys are getting starters jobs. Yes, we could have drafted a TE, but again, is backing up Gronk a position you use a high pick for (I saw no one that I would consider converting back to a 2 TE offense for) and by the 3rd round, what was left seemed to be about the same as what came as UDFAs.

AzPatsFan · Aug 15, 2014

chasa said:
How on earth is this offense going to maintain its top 5 offense without a second TE?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

with gronk we have the best offense in the league, without him we are top ten.

Drafting a TE was not a priority, The patriots made TE's cool, they can make playing without them cool as well.

It WAS a Top 5 without Gronk in 2013, or have you forgotten?

Mack Herron · Aug 15, 2014

Another bed for the medical tent?

Ian Rapoport ‏@RapSheet 52s
The #Bears waive TE Zach Miller following his foot surgery. If he clears waivers, he’ll be placed on Injured Reserve. Bears want to keep him

Danger Zone · Aug 15, 2014

AzPatsFan said:
It WAS a Top 5 without Gronk in 2013, or have you forgotten?

Yup and with a healthy Gronk we end up a comfortable #2 and probably close in enough on #1 that it would have spoiled some of Manning's sense of accomplishment and drove the Manning > Brady crowd crazy (if any of those remain with their blood vessels still intact).

supafly · Aug 15, 2014

Mack Herron said:
Another bed for the medical tent?

I wonder if Belichick really does take the "unwritten rule" into account---for anyone? In other words, we've seen him grab injured players from the waiver wire before, but would he do it to certain teams? Is there a line that wouldn't get crossed--or is it just open season in any attempt to make the team better?

No one will agree on this answer due to personal opinion, but it's something I've pondered before.

Tight end Shuffle: Hartsock, Maneri, Terrence Miller in; Jones, Watson, RB Houston out

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