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Tyms Suspended 4 games


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I'm not sure where all of the Boyce is in trouble stuff is coming from, by all accounts he got off to a strong start and had a good offseason, in general people are being way too reactive, and that includes me because i started the Gropp thread because of my reaction to his first outing. We are always surprised and wrong about the final 53 and this season will be no different.

I think that he'll likely make the team, but some of the talk may be coming from his bad performances lately in practice. There were reports last week that he had been tailing off quite a bit, and I believe that he's been seeing lots of work with the 3s if I'm not mistaken.

Just today, he had 3 blatant drops---2 of which hit him directly in the hands and then bounced up into the air where defenders then picked it off. Not a great look for someone who was already the lowest of the WRs (for a realistic list).

I think it will come down to his ability to return kickoffs as you've pointed out before, but then again, do you really see Belichick having him as a consistent gameday active player? I have a difficult time envisioning that myself, particularly if he cannot contribute much in the passing game, or more appropriately--has plenty of other talent ahead of him.

Keeping on the topic of Tyms, a guy like Boyce is probably an excellent candidate to get the axe after game #4 if Tyms shows enough to stick around. There's obviously no way we're going to keep all of the WRs AND Tyms past week 4, right? I kind of doubt that we'll end up keeping all of the WRs already.
 
From a standpoint of the severity of the crime, I agree, but thats a naive view. The substance abuse policy is intended as a deterrent. If you leave room to debate a failed PED test, you leave room to cheat. If you test for illegal drugs, you must have a severe penalty because your intent is to keep players from taking illegal drugs.
While smoking weed or taking adderal is not as bad an offense as beating up your wife, I find it hard to consider potential suspensions as a deterrent to beating up a woman. (Like saying they better suspend Hernanndez for a long time so players will think twice about committing execution style murders)
All that said the Rice suspension was a joke, especially in light of Roethlisberger but comparing Rice io a substance abuse suspension is apples to oranges because of the deterrent nature of substance abuse suspensions.

No. I simply cannot see how the league runs their "pink month," while Rice's wife going to bat for him warrants a lesser suspension. I'm pretty sure all of us know that abused women tend to defend their abusers.

What's happening with Jim Irsay? Because he has long money and the Detroit system needs it, he greases some wheels, and catches a misdemeanor or two. Meanwhile, if any of us had been driving around doped up, with that much cash, all those drugs...two felonies to start. But he learned his lesson, made it rain at practice. I guess if the woman who died at his house had a tape of him dropping the "n-bomb" Goodell would have to take action (clippers anyone?).

Goodell is an absolute joke.
 
The guy has been on four different teams in the last three years. I don't buy him being the next Victor Cruz. He could be a find like say Ninkovich was who bounced around or David Patten back in the day, but odds are against him. The guy has two receptions for 12 yards for his career.

Victor Cruz was an undrafted free agent signed by the Giants. He was not highly thought of because he went to UMass. Different situation.

I don't think the fact he has bounced around from a few teams is surprising, given his background. He's really raw and inexperienced. He essentially had one year of college production and one previous year of college and high school ball total before that.

He probably needed those camps and needed somebody to spend a lot of time with him and that just doesn't happen, he's a marginal player.

Seems like he has some drive, but he could have emotional problems too, who knows? He definitely has some upside if he can produce consistently.
 
I'm not sure where all of the Boyce is in trouble stuff is coming from, by all accounts he got off to a strong start and had a good offseason, in general people are being way too reactive, and that includes me because i started the Gropp thread because of my reaction to his first outing. We are always surprised and wrong about the final 53 and this season will be no different.

Boyce did not help himself Monday when a TFB pass bounced off his hands for an INT. We all know how TFB feels about receivers that cost him picks.
 
From a standpoint of the severity of the crime, I agree, but that's a naive view. The substance abuse policy is intended as a deterrent. If you leave room to debate a failed PED test, you leave room to cheat. If you test for illegal drugs, you must have a severe penalty because your intent is to keep players from taking illegal drugs.

While smoking weed or taking adderal is not as bad an offense as beating up your wife, I find it hard to consider potential suspensions as a deterrent to beating up a woman. (Like saying they better suspend Hernandez for a long time so players will think twice about committing execution style murders).

All that said the Rice suspension was a joke, especially in light of Roethlisberger but comparing Rice to a substance abuse suspension is apples to oranges because of the deterrent nature of substance abuse suspensions.
That's true you bring up some good points there. I guess I just find it really hard to believe that you can beat up your wife and get 2 games but you fail a drug test and you get 4 games. I wish the NFL just got more consistent on there suspensions.
 
From a standpoint of the severity of the crime, I agree, but that's a naive view. The substance abuse policy is intended as a deterrent. If you leave room to debate a failed PED test, you leave room to cheat. If you test for illegal drugs, you must have a severe penalty because your intent is to keep players from taking illegal drugs.

No. I simply cannot see how the league runs their "pink month," while Rice's wife going to bat for him warrants a lesser suspension. I'm pretty sure all of us know that abused women tend to defend their abusers.

Can I agree with you both in your disagreement? :)

The slap on the wrist to Rice was outrageous and offensive because it said that knocking your wife unconscious is considered a minor personal conduct matter -- certainly no worse than swinging your helmet at an opponent in the heat of a game. It reeks of insensitivity to domestic violence.

But it should only be compared to treatment of other personal conduct violations, NOT to the treatment of offenses against football -- i.e., cheating. That's a totally separate issue. (Similarly, I consider substance abuse violations totally different from PEDs.)
 
That's true you bring up some good points there. I guess I just find it really hard to believe that you can beat up your wife and get 2 games but you fail a drug test and you get 4 games. I wish the NFL just got more consistent on there suspensions.

Tyms - PED aspect of collective bargaining agreement lays out specifics for infractions
Rice - Discipline aspect of collective bargaining agreement lays out very basic notions, only
Irsay - Owner, not player, and not subject to NFL/NFLPA CBA in the same manner
Blandino - should be interesting, as we know little about the NFL/NFLRA CBA
 
Adderall is the standard answer these days. Have you ever heard of anyone testing positive for (anabolic) steroids in the NFL in the last 5 or so years (Rodney was caught by mail)? Ever hear a player come out and say "yeah, I was taking Winstol with Durabolin".

The fact is that all test results are sealed in the NFL so you can say it was cotton candy if you want (assuming it would make you piss hot). Adderall is the thing people say now because it seems like a medicine that many people view as needed by a lot of people.

The other thing is that the NFL does not suspend the first time you come up hot. It's actually the second time when people get suspended. You just never hear about the first time because the public is not made aware.

It's pretty easy when you know the NFL doesn't suspend the first time. So if you come up hot for Adderall the first time, you pretty much wouldn't come up a second time and you (the public) would never know.

Don't forget, the NFL has a public image as a family friendly league so advising a player to say it was steroids is not in their best interest so it's a wink wink kind of thing.

NOTE: fertility drugs (steroids) seems to be the other latest trend in making excuses as well.

Do people really think everyone in the NFL is on Adderall without prescriptions at this point? lol That's too funny if you do. So no one is aware that they need a prescription for Adderall after all the recent suspensions? lol
 
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BTW, it would not surprise me if the NFL were to put some publicly accepted drugs on the list just so they could uphold their image.

Imagine the NFL banned coffee..... every player who tested positive for drugs (steroids or other party drugs) would come out and say that they came up hot for coffee.
 
Boyce did not help himself Monday when a TFB pass bounced off his hands for an INT. We all know how TFB feels about receivers that cost him picks.


I don't disagree with that statement but that's one play in one practice, i went down to camp last year and the day i went Edelman looked like the worst player on the field and we all saw how that worked out. I think Boyce is in the zone where he should make the team but is not a lock, and until last weekend most of the talk was about what a good camp he was having.
 

Excellent points and distinctions, Deus.
 
The Ol adderal excuse is getting old. If it was a legit prescription why WOULDNT you advise the league of it before hand? I'll tell you why, it's because players use it as a masking agent for STEROIDS.

Don't get me wrong. I don't give two squirrel turds if a player juices up or not. What annoys me is that so many people by into these lame excuses. Can you imagine the excuses this board would be churning out if Gronk gets popped? Lol

That said I'm rooting for the kid. Hope he's more Victor Cruz than Bam Childress.

Adderall isn't strong enough to be used as a masking agent from numerous articles that I have read, both medical and news. The only time I have seen Adderall claimed to be a "masking agent" is by "fans" whose "medical degree" came off their own printer. Could you provide an article, Medical or otherwise, that says that Adderall is a making agent?

Here is but one of the many I've read.
Adderall: MLB’s latest performance-enhancing drug | Philly.com

"Hussar added that Adderall is not a known masking agent for other performance enhancing substances. "
 
Adderall is the standard answer these days. Have you ever heard of anyone testing positive for (anabolic) steroids in the NFL in the last 5 or so years (Rodney was caught by mail)? Ever hear a player come out and say "yeah, I was taking Winstol with Durabolin".

The fact is that all test results are sealed in the NFL so you can say it was cotton candy if you want (assuming it would make you piss hot). Adderall is the thing people say now because it seems like a medicine that many people view as needed by a lot of people.

The other thing is that the NFL does not suspend the first time you come up hot. It's actually the second time when people get suspended. You just never hear about the first time because the public is not made aware.

It's pretty easy when you know the NFL doesn't suspend the first time. So if you come up hot for Adderall the first time, you pretty much wouldn't come up a second time and you (the public) would never know.

Don't forget, the NFL has a public image as a family friendly league so advising a player to say it was steroids is not in their best interest so it's a wink wink kind of thing.

NOTE: fertility drugs (steroids) seems to be the other latest trend in making excuses as well.

Do people really think everyone in the NFL is on Adderall without prescriptions at this point? lol That's too funny if you do. So no one is aware that they need a prescription for Adderall after all the recent suspensions? lol


The test results are SEALED because of HIPAA.
Actually, You are wrong regarding the drug testing rules. There are some substances that you do get a 4 game ban on your 1st positive test. Adderall happens to be one of them..

Adderall, diuretics could slide from PED policy to substance-abuse policy | ProFootballTalk
Currently, one positive Adderall tests results in a four-game suspension. If Adderall moves to the substance-abuse policy, multiple violations would have to occur before the player is prevented from playing.
 
Adderall and Ritalin are mild central nervous system stimulants. I'm not a biochemist, but I seriously doubt this is the kind of drug used as a "masking agent" for anything.
 
I think that he'll likely make the team, but some of the talk may be coming from his bad performances lately in practice. There were reports last week that he had been tailing off quite a bit, and I believe that he's been seeing lots of work with the 3s if I'm not mistaken.

Just today, he had 3 blatant drops---2 of which hit him directly in the hands and then bounced up into the air where defenders then picked it off. Not a great look for someone who was already the lowest of the WRs (for a realistic list).

I think it will come down to his ability to return kickoffs as you've pointed out before, but then again, do you really see Belichick having him as a consistent gameday active player? I have a difficult time envisioning that myself, particularly if he cannot contribute much in the passing game, or more appropriately--has plenty of other talent ahead of him.

Keeping on the topic of Tyms, a guy like Boyce is probably an excellent candidate to get the axe after game #4 if Tyms shows enough to stick around. There's obviously no way we're going to keep all of the WRs AND Tyms past week 4, right? I kind of doubt that we'll end up keeping all of the WRs already.



Thanks Sup, I never saw those reports but in all honesty I gave up reading Boston paper's years ago so I am not as informed on camp reports as i once was. Given the roster exemption for Tyms I think Boyce is safe until at least week 5 and whether or not he sticks will be determined in the meantime. I could be wrong, but that would be the first time in my life that has happened. Lmao, who am I kidding, no way i am wrong.
 
The test results are SEALED because of HIPAA.
Actually, You are wrong regarding the drug testing rules. There are some substances that you do get a 4 game ban on your 1st positive test. Adderall happens to be one of them..

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...de-from-ped-policy-to-substance-abuse-policy/


A couple of things.

1) You're believing that it was Adderall because they say so...I find that incredibly unlikely and the only thing to go in his his statement. I'm not buying it.

2) I stand corrected on the first offense not being suspension but the body of what I said still remains. I doubt anyone is really getting caught with Aderall. It's naive to think that after all of the "Adderall" suspensions, someone would unknowingly take it. If you need it, you can get it by filing a therapeutic-use exemption.

3) HIPAA protects your rights but there is nothing preventing the NFL from (not requiring ) requesting players to waive their right to that privacy. The NFL doesn't do it because they don't want transparency.

A player can waive that right anytime they want to. Ever see one do it to prove their innocence? They're Lance Armstrong proclaiming their innocence in public but when it comes time to grant access to those results, they make you never hear a peep. All they have to do is appoint someone from the NFL to be the representative and the player would allow them to receive and share the drug testing policy without exposing their injury history or any other history but the drug testing results.
 
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"OK guys...let's roll up our sleeves and put our adderalls on and get to work!!! we got a trophy to defend!.."

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A couple of things.

1) You're believing that it was Adderall because they say so...I find that incredibly unlikely and the only thing to go in his his statement. I'm not buying it.

What you believe to be unlikely doesn't have any bearing on what happens in the world.

2) I stand corrected on the first offense not being suspension but the body of what I said still remains. I doubt anyone is really getting caught with Aderall. It's naive to think that after all of the "Adderall" suspensions, someone would unknowingly take it. If you need it, you can get it by filing a therapeutic-use exemption.

If you had actually bothered to read the interview he gave, he explained the situation. But, clearly you didn't bother to read it.

"Technically, I've had a prescription for it since I was nine," he said. "Like I said, it costs money to get all that stuff situated, money which I didn't have to spend. It was my fault. I should have brought it to the NFL and said, 'hey, this is my prescription' before it got to that point, but it wasn't like I was using it as something to — I guess — boost my ratings, know what I mean? I've been taking it since I was nine — that and Ritalin."

3) HIPAA protects your rights but there is nothing preventing the NFL from (not requiring ) requesting players to waive their right to that privacy. The NFL doesn't do it because they don't want transparency.

Transparency? Fine. Post your health records so everyone can see. Then let's talk about transparency. Otherwise, it's none of your business. Plain and simple.

A player can waive that right anytime they want to. Ever see one do it to prove their innocence? They're Lance Armstrong proclaiming their innocence in public but when it comes time to grant access to those results, they make you never hear a peep. All they have to do is appoint someone from the NFL to be the representative and the player would allow them to receive and share the drug testing policy without exposing their injury history or any other history but the drug testing results.

First of all, yes they can waive their right. But why should they? Their private health issues are NONE of your damn business. Who the hell are you to say that it is?

Secondly, just because they waive their "HIPAA" rights, doesn't give the NFL the right to broadcast that information. Case in point. A recent article regarding "Baby Boards" at doctor's offices. According to HIPAA, those boards are illegal. Why? Because the pictures of babies are considered a "type of protected health information". So, despite the fact that parents are giving them permission to post them by sending the pictures to the doctor, they aren't allowed to.

Baby Pictures at the Doctor’s? Cute, Sure, but Illegal - NYTimes.com

Under the law, the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, baby photos are a type of protected health information,

Bringing in Lance Armstrong when the situations are significantly different shows just how much you are reaching.

Tyms shared his history. He was diagnosed with ADHD at age 9 and has had prescriptions for Adderall and Ritolin since that time. That's all you need to know. Oh wait. It's not. Because, got forbid that we take him at his word. Even if it was an "NFL Representative" isn't it naive of you to think that the representative wouldn't present the picture that the NFL wanted instead of the "truth".

BTW, did you know that the NFL doesn't accept the exemptions that are filed with the NCAA for players? Why not? Why is it that the NFL doesn't automatically file this information when it's brought up at the Combine and Pro-Days? Why does the NFL force these players to pay filing fees and doctors fees and force them to jump through all sorts of hoops before giving the exemption? Particularly for players who have been on the drug since before they started college.
 
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lol I'll leave it at that. Everyone is on Adderall. I could answer all of that since a lot of what you said is misleading but I won't since I don't have the time to argue but I will say that you can believe what you want becuase I'm not about to get into a lenthy argument on a message board about the virtuous NFL and its transparency. lol Unbelievable what some people believe. lol
 
lol I'll leave it at that. Everyone is on Adderall. I could answer all of that since a lot of what you said is misleading but I won't since I don't have the time to argue but I will say that you can believe what you want becuase I'm not about to get into a lenthy argument on a message board about the virtuous NFL and its transparency. lol Unbelievable what some people believe. lol

Typical. When faced with actual facts, a person like yourself makes BS excuses. Nothing of what I said is misleading, but someone as arrogant as you would say that because you can't actually refute what was said with facts.

What's unbelievable is people like yourself thinking that they somehow know something about a subject and really are totally clueless. And then they proceed to make up crap about what the other people said..
 
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