Let's talk about the lines: OFFENSE

As much as we want to talk about the glamour positions (offensive skill positions, DB, etc.), I think the key this year for NE will be the play in the trenches. The OL needs to give Brady time to throw and open up holes for the RBs. The DL needs to get pressure on the QB and be solid against the run. Basic stuff, but hugely important.

So let's talk about the lines. First, the offense.

Here are the current Patriots' players on the offensive line (by espn.com's NE depth chart):

LT - Solder, Devey, Fleming
LG - Mankins, Halapio
C - Wendell, Stork, Cave
RG - Connolly, Kline
RT - Vollmer, Cannon

OL subs - Barker, Mattes, Schwab, Fisher, Martin

I think this has the potential to be a pretty solid group, assuming good health (haha). Solder is a beast. Vollmer is a beast. Mankins is still solid. Connolly is fine as a guard. Wendell worries me at C, however. Cannon has shown to be a versatile and valuable performer.

It is the depth that intrigues me. Stork, Fleming, and Halapio are all big and strong. I don't think any of them are particularly quick (not that they are slow; just that they are not particularly quick). Maybe a prelude to a more power philosophy?

If the kids pan out, this group could be dynamic. If they don't, there's not a ton of depth there. I am a bit concerned about the center of this group - LG/C/RG. They weren't very strong last year, so perhaps Stork can solidify them there. I am curious to see if he actually wins a starting spot over Wendell. I also wouldn't be opposed to using Connolly as the starting C, sliding Cannon in as RG, and then letting Wendell be a backup.

The OL really needs to step up its game this year. If they do, look for the offense to put up big, big point totals. If they struggle, this team will have to rely on the defense to win games.

It's going to be an intriguing battle to watch in TC. There are a lot of opportunities for improvement along the line, as we essentially take last years starters and add to the mix:

- Three drafted rookies to compete for spots
- Four young players who could feasibly improve (Solder, Cannon, Cave, and Kline)
- Vollmer at RT

Now opportunities are not guarantees. It's possible that none of the rookies are ready to step in and contribute in year one (it would be disappointing, but not unheard of). It's also possible that Mankins takes a step back due to age. But going into camp there is ample competition and reason to feel optimistic. Should be fun to watch.

Fleming wasn't even a LT in College and I think David Shaw (his former coach) said he was a RT only when he was on NFLN at the time Fleming was picked.

If Stork sorts out his botched snaps in time (I assume they were ones from under center) I'd like him to start week 1 with a line like:
Solder-Mankins-Stork-Cannon-Vollmer

There's a lot of bulk there to just maul teams in the run game.

I am hopeful this group will do better than last year (especially in the middle).

I get the feeling from what I have heard that Halapio will be a starter before this year is done. I like the size and nastiness he potentially provides and would allow Cannon to stay as a backup that can fill in for 3 or so spots.

I am going to assume unless things go very badly Connolly is probably a cap casualty. I have high hopes for Stork but at this point it is clear he just looks out of his element. Too many fumbles. It is probably a technique thing that can be corrected but it is hard to put a time table on that.

I am interested to see what the Patriots do with Fleming. Maybe he is going to be a jack of all trades backup ala Cannon which would be fine I guess. I just don't like his measurable to fit any one spot as a full time guy. However maybe the Patriots think differently. Ideally though he will not get a chance to see the field much anyway as we have a nice duo if tackles (which is what it sounds like they got him for).

This is one of the spots I will look most closely at during TC.

i like the depth and the potential of the group

This is my depth chart projection.

LT- Solder, Vollmer, Cannon
LG- Mankins, Halapio, Kline
OC- Connolly, Stork
RG- Cannon, Halapio, Kline
RT- Vollmer, Cannon, Fleming

Brady6 said:

This is my depth chart projection.

LT- Solder, Vollmer, Cannon
LG- Mankins, Halapio, Kline
OC- Connolly, Stork
RG- Cannon, Halapio, Kline
RT- Vollmer, Cannon, Fleming

Click to expand...

I'm fine with this group of nine.

Wendell is the first alternative if there is an injury or non-performance by a youngster. This also presumes that either Cannon or Stork is able to be a starter; otherwise, we would need to keep Wendell. After all, Connolly can only play one position at a time.

mgteich said:

I'm fine with this group of nine.

Wendell is the first alternative if there is an injury or non-performance by a youngster. This also presumes that either Cannon or Stork is able to be a starter; otherwise, we would need to keep Wendell. After all, Connolly can only play one position at a time.

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Cannon started 10 games at RT last season including the playoffs and played very well, he has proven capable of starting, in fact I think he has potential to be a pro bowl caliber guard. The move inside to OG is not something you often see OTs struggle to do, Mankins and Connolly both entered the NFL as OTs.

It will be very interesting to see if Wendell and Connolly survive the cut. I could see it going either way.

I don't think Stork will start at center. Maybe during the season.

If Wendell survives the cut he is due to a good amount of money.

I think Wendell will get cut, Connolly will start at C, and Halapio/Cannon will start at RG.

LT SOLDER
LG MANKINS
C HALAPIO/Stork
RG CANNON/FLEMING
RT VOLLMER

NOT SAYING IT TURNS OUT LIKE THIS. BUT if you want to get our best and most dominant players on the field and in their best position that matches their skillset to succeed, then this is our lineup. That is power and athleticism across the line that can best handle a dominant defensive front 7 featuring menacing multiple pass rushers and power DTs that occupy multiple blockers. And our OLine has needed multiple blockers to handle these defenders. We are sure to see these defenses in the playoffs/Superbowl.

Connolly/Wendell have consistently proven they can't handle bigger and better DLineman one on one. I have hopes for Stork but he has already made several mental mistakes in camp due to being overwhelmed. Very uncharacteristic of a center whose best attributes are supposed to be cerebral play. Many great centers are busts because of overwhelmed by NFL power. Konz was supposed to be a first rounder. Teams began seeing he lacked power. He dropped to round2 and has struggled on his roller skates. Storks power is in question.

Halapio impressed in camp with his power/attitude. Many scouts saw him as a convert to center,hopefully bill does as well. He appears to be that rare center who can man up a Nose with no help.

Fleming lacks Tackle movement skills but he is powerful and never gets beat. His movement skills are superior for a guard however. Couple that with his power and how he knows how to not get beat and he has pro bowl guard skills. He can compete with Cannon for RG. Both much much better than Connolly. This line is significantly more talented than last seasons mess of weak losers. Brady had to do 3 steps release or get hit/sacked.

the biggest issue last year with center, brady was getting sacked up the middle FAR too quickly.

Brady6 said:

This is my depth chart projection.

LT- Solder, Vollmer, Cannon
LG- Mankins, Halapio, Kline
OC- Connolly, Stork
RG- Cannon, Halapio, Kline
RT- Vollmer, Cannon, Fleming

Click to expand...

With Fleming being basically a pure RT, I'm definitely intrigued to see whether the Cannon-to-RG move will happen. Personally, I'd really like to see it.

PatFanCraig said:

LT SOLDER
LG MANKINS
C HALAPIO/Stork
RG CANNON/FLEMING
RT VOLLMER

NOT SAYING IT TURNS OUT LIKE THIS. BUT IF you want to get our best and most dominant players on the field and in their best position that matches their skillset to succeed,then this is our lineup. That is power and athleticism across the line that can best handle a dominant defensive front 7 featuring menacin multiple pass rushers and power DTs that occupy multiple blockers. And our OLine has needed multiple blockers to handle these defenders. We are sure to see these defenses in the playoffs/Superbowl. Connolly/Wendall have consistently proven they can't handle bigger and better DLineman one on one. I hove hopes for Stork but he has already made several mental mistakes in camp due to being overwhelmed.Very uncharacteristic of a center whose best attributes are supposed to be cerebral play. Many great centers are busts because of overwhelmed by NFL power. Konz was supposed to be a first rounder. Teams began seeing he lacked power. He dropped to round2 and has struggled on his roller skates. Storks power is in question. Halapio impressed in camp with his power/attitude. Many scouts saw him as a convert to center,hopefully bill does as well. He appears to be that rare center who can man up a Nose with no help. Fleming lacks Tackle movement skills but he is powerful and never gets beat. His movement skills are superior for a guard however. Couple that with his power and how he knows how to not get beat and he has pro bowl guard skills. He can compete with Cannon for RG. Both much much better than Connolly. This line is significantly more talented than last seasons mess of weak losers. Brady had to do 3 steps release or get hit/sacked.

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Whether or not Halapio can convert to C is a much different quesoin than whether or not he'll be able to play there in week 1, or at all this season. He strictly played RG at Florida, so if he's going to contribute this year I'm betting it'll be at one of the guard positions. I'd bet on Stork overcoming whatever issues he's having far more readily than I'd bet on Halapio learning a new position so quickly.

Surprised the title of this thread did not attract Manziel to our forum.

IcyPatriot said:

Surprised the title of this thread did not attract Manziel to our forum.

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Change it, Icy...try this... Free Blow And Cristal All Night...that'll get him signed on fast...

OLT - Solder
OLG - Mankins
OC - TBD
ORG - TBD
ORT - Vollmer

Returning notables - Cannon, Connolly, Wendell, Kline
Notable additions: Stork, Fleming, Halapio

Beyond that, it's basically 3 rookies and a 2nd year UDFA competing against the veterans, with one wild card being whether or not Cannon gets an opportunity at guard. We haven't seen a single snap even from training camp, never mind from one of the exhibition games, so we have basically nothing to evaluate the rookies on. There's not much more to say until these guys get on the field.

There's not much more to say until these guys get on the field.

a hard concept for some of the fanbase to grasp....

BradyFTW! said:

Whether or not Halapio can convert to C is a much different quesoin than whether or not he'll be able to play there in week 1, or at all this season. He strictly played RG at Florida, so if he's going to contribute this year I'm betting it'll be at one of the guard positions. I'd bet on Stork overcoming whatever issues he's having far more readily than I'd bet on Halapio learning a new position so quickly.

Click to expand...

Many NFL centers were college guards. Halapio played center in high school and played center for whole practices at Florida in case he was ever needed there and coaches were very impressed. Scouts dig at these types of things and that's why many scouts said he is a candidate to convert to center and that it probably his best position because he is powerful and tenacious but is limited on agility. Which makes him susceptible to quick penetrators which won't be nearly as much a problem at center as it would be at guard. So many scouts see him as a better center where his power and ability to handle big NTs without any help is going to be a HUGE WEAPON!

AS for Stork I would love to see him excel. But his ability to handle power is a huge question mark. Many centers stronger than himself who were elite center prospects were busts due to strength deficiency. Peter Konz is an example and he was more dominant in college than Stork. Stork excelled due to being a technician and playing with great awareness, fundamentals,and making great line calls of who to block and double up. Simply put,he played intelligently and never made mental errors. That's what won him an award and got him drafted, Not dominating which is what you like to see because its college level. Stork being known for flawless technical play uncharacteristically made many mistakes at minicamp. Reports out of camp feared his mistakes were due to his lack of power and being overwhelmed and the NFL being to big for him. Hopefully he can finish his growing into his frame and get stronger. But with us having trouble last season up the middle because of our technicians struggling with power, the team wants to move on to a more power driven OLine.

Halapio is out of the box with batteries included in that respect. While he could struggle with quickness at guard, he is a weapon at center because teams expect a big NT/DT to occupy multiple blockers to free up defensive pass rushers and playmakers. Halapio can block out widebody NTs by himself and wreck a defensive scheme. So far Stork can't do that as can't Wendell or Connolly.