How Much Optimism Do You Have Over This Defense?

Danger Zone said:

Religion is a hot button issue.

It is a polarizing issue along with: Health care. Evolution. Creationism. Welfare. Sexual orientation. Gender roles. Abortion. Politics. Right to bear arms.

There is a reason, like with politics, you shouldn't bring up these issues if you are unsure of your audience -that is, don't bring up these issues if you have any expectation what-so-ever of keeping the conversation on topic. Such as football.

Mentioning, even with the best of intentions, anything about any hot button issue and you only have yourself to blame for where the conversation goes from there. Doing so and then claiming you are "under attack" is passive aggressiveness.

Had you brought up politics or any other hot button issue, you'd have received a similar response from the same kind of people asking you to refrain. Calling them "Christian bigots" for doing so might be correct in some cases but it is also passive-aggressiveness.

I admire the strength of courage it takes Jehovah Witnesses to come knocking on my door. That doesn't mean I want them doing so when I'm watching the game.

I personally dont mind people interjecting references to God in conversations when I can assess that they mean well.. and I know you meant well.. But then, Republicans also mean well, and Democrats also mean well and yet all three are still hot button issues.

Talking about either political party is just going to derail any other conversation. There's a reason I pick and choose my time to talk politics... just as there's a reason we don't see Harry Boy over here talking football. Thank God for that..

(oops).

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I just hate this attitude that someone can somehow be offended by another persons beliefs, feelings, or opinions to the point of saying they shouldn't be allowed to speak their mind. I guarantee you there is no a single person in the world who is harmed by Christian Cat believing in God, or saying staying healthy is in Gods hands. Christian Cat truly believes that God has an influence on that. Why would anyone who doesn't feel the same be threatened by that?

The problem here is not Christian Cat making an innocent comment based on her beliefs but the fact that someone decided to make an issue of it.

Christian Cat can write whatever he wants about God and the Patriots, it's seemingly benign enough. Though it does seem to derail plenty of threads, and so you'd think he'd want to stop at some point.

I do, however, believe it's rather questionable (to put it as mildly as I can) for educated people in the year 2014 to think some kind of omnipotent force has an influence over the daily trials and tribulations of an NFL football team. That's my belief, and I hope no one is offended by that belief either.

And any time someone says something rather questionable (to put it as mildly as I can) about any subject, I would expect other people to take objection to that. So I wouldn't be so shocked that you have people reacting as they have.

I'm optimistic but I believe we will have significant injuries again or players under performing because we simply have too much guys coming from surgeries/IR.

Last season it was unexpected let's say, they are always prepared for a loss or 2, what happened was much more than that. This season on the other hand I expect BB to not be caught off guard. I expect extra depth at the position, Siliga, Jones, Vellano, I hope they all make the roster.

We got injuries on the secondary as well last year, Arrington, Dennard and of course Talib. This year, my main concern is over DT, Arrington had groin surgery to repair, Dennard had extra rest in prison and we got rid of that injury prone playoff choker Talib. I expect the secondary to be fine and with Ryan and Harmon we have quality depth.

Danger Zone said:

Religion is a hot button issue.

It is a polarizing issue along with: Health care. Evolution. Creationism. Welfare. Sexual orientation. Gender roles. Abortion. Politics. Right to bear arms.

There is a reason, like with politics, you shouldn't bring up these issues if you are unsure of your audience -that is, don't bring up these issues if you have any expectation what-so-ever of keeping the conversation on topic. Such as football.

Mentioning, even with the best of intentions, anything about any hot button issue and you only have yourself to blame for where the conversation goes from there. Doing so and then claiming you are "under attack" is passive aggressiveness.

Had you brought up politics or any other hot button issue, you'd have received a similar response from the same kind of people asking you to refrain. Calling them "Christian bigots" for doing so might be correct in some cases but it is also passive-aggressiveness.

I admire the strength of courage it takes Jehovah Witnesses to come knocking on my door. That doesn't mean I want them doing so when I'm watching the game.

I personally dont mind people interjecting references to God in conversations when I can assess that they mean well.. and I know you meant well.. But then, Republicans also mean well, and Democrats also mean well and yet all three are still hot button issues.

Talking about either political party is just going to derail any other conversation. There's a reason I pick and choose my time to talk politics... just as there's a reason we don't see Harry Boy over here talking football. Thank God for that..

(oops).

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Don't turn this around on me. I have nothing to blame myself for. I will mentioned the word God in my post if I so choose. I don't deserved to be attacked because of it. If it bothers someone so much, they could have clicked ignore. I have a right to mention God in any of my posts. There was no passive aggressiveness on my part. I was responding to a personal attack. When my original post in this thread was a general response to the thread itself. You are being passive aggressive here. If the mere mention of God, religion etc upset you than put the posters you feel do that on ignore.

Christiancat said:

Well I have a ton of optimism over this defense. Bill will do his best to put together the best possible defense. Once all the players are in place the defensive coordinator and coach need to set up some good play calls. After that it is in God's hands to make sure all the players are in good enough health to perform at their best.

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People actually took issue with this post?

IT was probably the one after that if I had to guess. But God only knows what goes though the minds of some here. I mean My God, Christian Cat is a Tebow lover like I have never seen. I pray to God it will someday stop.

Christiancat said:

Don't turn this around on me. I have nothing to blame myself for. I will mentioned the word God in my post if I so choose. I don't deserved to be attacked because of it. If it bothers someone so much, they could have clicked ignore. I have a right to mention God in any of my posts. There was no passive aggressiveness on my part. I was responding to a personal attack. When my original post in this thread was a general response to the thread itself. You are being passive aggressive here. If the mere mention of God, religion etc upset you than put the posters you feel do that on ignore.

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Ive had too many conversations with people over the years to not realize the fact that this conversation will go absolutely nowhere.

That doesnt mean I think Im better than you, but Ive been here at the start if this particular conversation too many times to expect either one of us will change the other's perspective.

Christiancat said:

Don't turn this around on me. I have nothing to blame myself for. I will mentioned the word God in my post if I so choose. I don't deserved to be attacked because of it. If it bothers someone so much, they could have clicked ignore. I have a right to mention God in any of my posts. There was no passive aggressiveness on my part. I was responding to a personal attack. When my original post in this thread was a general response to the thread itself. You are being passive aggressive here. If the mere mention of God, religion etc upset you than put the posters you feel do that on ignore.

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Don't waste your time. You were in the right. The critics were wrong. Leave it at that. They'll troll you about religion again soon enough.

Deus Irae said:

Don't waste your time. You were in the right. The critics were wrong. Leave it at that. They'll troll you about religion again soon enough.

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Thanks Deus I will. One could only hope the critics have now put me on ignore. Have a Great day and God Bless!

We should probably stick to talking about football, if you ask any human resource representative there are two things that they discourage employees from discussing, one is religion and the two is politics. Not everyone is going to see eye-to-eye on these subjects so if you are going to flamboyantly express your religious beliefs you should expect to met with some resistance or disagreement given the personal nature of the subject.

KontradictioN said:

People actually took issue with this post?

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Kontra - I didn't take issue to the original post. But I do take issue with posters taking issue with those that did take issue. (Sorry for the riddle).

This really isn't the place to have such debates, but it's approaching the time where we as a society need to start assimilating the knowledge the scientific community has accrued in the past 100+ years into our outlooks on life. Amazingly, it just really has not happened, at all. The status quo of accepting certain archaic thinking and elevating things to a privileged and unassailable category of beliefs is going to have stop at some point.

Again, a football forum is not the place to worry about such things. But if we're touching the topic, then I have to say religion has to stop being handled with kid gloves, safely guarded away from criticism. People can believe whatever they want. But at the same time, those beliefs should not be beyond reproach.

BradyManny said:

Kontra - I didn't take issue to the original post. But I do take issue with posters taking issue with those that did take issue. (Sorry for the riddle).

This really isn't the place to have such debates, but it's approaching the time where we as a society need to start assimilating the knowledge the scientific community has accrued in the past 100+ years into our outlooks on life. Amazingly, it just really has not happened, at all. The status quo of accepting certain archaic thinking and elevating things to a privileged and unassailable category of beliefs is going to have stop at some point.

Again, a football forum is not the place to worry about such things. But if we're touching the topic, then I have to say religion has to stop being handled with kid gloves, safely guarded away from criticism. People can believe whatever they want. But at the same time, those beliefs should not be beyond reproach.

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Anyone who took issue with it needs to grow up. If that was too much for them, they should stop posting altogether, until they're mature enough to handle it.

And your comment is far more OT than was hers.

BradyManny said:

Kontra - I didn't take issue to the original post. But I do take issue with posters taking issue with those that did take issue. (Sorry for the riddle).

This really isn't the place to have such debates, but it's approaching the time where we as a society need to start assimilating the knowledge the scientific community has accrued in the past 100+ years into our outlooks on life. Amazingly, it just really has not happened, at all. The status quo of accepting certain archaic thinking and elevating things to a privileged and unassailable category of beliefs is going to have stop at some point.

Again, a football forum is not the place to worry about such things. But if we're touching the topic, then I have to say religion has to stop being handled with kid gloves, safely guarded away from criticism. People can believe whatever they want. But at the same time, those beliefs should not be beyond reproach.

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The whole point of my initial point wasn't to denigrate religion it was arguing against the position that religion influences a player's ability to do their job, their health and my optimism regarding the Defense. I owe that cautious optimism to the coaches, the front office, ownership and the players who signed contracts with the Patriots not my belief system.

Regarding the rest of your post, I had hoped the stymy the religious talk because it ends up here. Unfortunately, it seems to have gone in the other direction where people are now arguing philosophy, freedom of speech and ideas leading to topic diversion. For that, I must apologize.

ausbacker said:

it was arguing against the position that religion influences a player's ability to do their job, their health and my optimism regarding the Defense.

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This.

Look, you have nothing to apologize for.

Someone made a silly statement relating the Patriots 2014 outlook to supernatural powers...an unfortunately completely socially acceptable silly statement that had nothing to do with the conversation at hand that was inevitably going to lead to a conversation like this, and you merely pointed it out.

Deus Irae said:

Anyone who took issue with it needs to grow up. If that was too much for them, they should stop posting altogether, until they're mature enough to handle it.

And your comment is far more OT than was hers.

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I realize I'm now way more OT, I don't deny that. As for taking issue with the post, again, ChristianCat is free to believe whatever he wants. But if I were to make a post in all sincerity suggesting that Brady's 2014 performance will depend on what color hoodie Belichick wears on the sideline, I'm pretty sure you, and others here, would point out how irrelevant that suggestion is. All Ausbacker did was point out that ChristianCat's comments were meaningless to the conversation, and no harm should come from that. If that's too much for you to handle, "I suggest you stop posting altogether"...

BradyManny said:

I realize I'm now way more OT, I don't deny that. As for taking issue with the post, again, ChristianCat is free to believe whatever he wants. But if I were to make a post in all sincerity suggesting that Brady's 2014 performance will depend on what color hoodie Belichick wears on the sideline, I'm pretty sure you, and others here, would point out how irrelevant that suggestion is. All Ausbacker did was point out that ChristianCat's comments were meaningless to the conversation, and no harm should come from that. If that's too much for you to handle, "I suggest you stop posting altogether"...

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Basically ausbacker was saying your post is meaningless. In other words pretty much saying your belief is incorrect/wrong. That's not right. You are free to believe whatever you want, but don't go to someonelse and say don't talk about your religion because you don't believe it.

Some athletes, musicians, actors etc. are Christians and use their platforms to spread their faith and speak about it. That doesn't mean that they are saying that you better believe in what they believe in. It is just them simply stating what they feel, believe in etc. Which they have a right to talk about their faith. Then their are some athletes, actors, musicians etc. who are NOT Christians and don't believe in God.

No one should be condemned for speaking about their faith and no one should be told that it is odd for "smart adults" for having their beliefs and stating their beliefs in God simply because those beliefs don't coincide with yours.

For instance, Carrie Underwood and her husband spoke to Oprah about their faith in Jesus etc.
http://www.godvine.com/Carrie-Underwood-and-Her-Husband-Talk-About-Their-Faith-in-Jesus-3067.html

Drew Brees spoke on CBN about his faith in God
http://www.cbn.com/tv/1472017254001
"The Super Bowl winning quarterback talks about his new book, Coming Back Stronger."

Faith in the Superbowl on CBN
"Superbowl 44 Colts and the Saints players talk to The 700 Club about how there's more to life than winning the big game."
http://www.cbn.com/tv/1424555920001


Philip Rivers talks on CBN about his faith
"San Diego Chargers veteran quarterback Philip Rivers speaks about his uncompromising faith"
http://www.cbn.com/tv/2666256965001


Tim Tebow talking about his faith on CBN
"CBN Sports’ Shawn Brown recently sat down with Tim Tebow to talk football, faith, and being a champion in both worlds"
http://www.cbn.com/tv/1407077172001

David Akers NFL kicker talks about his faith on CBN
Veteran NFL kicker shares how life's highs and lows demand a deep faith.
http://www.cbn.com/tv/2562251956001

In all the videos linked none of the people are saying that you better believe what they believe. They are just simply sharing their beliefs with the world. Which they have every right to do.

Here is MY personal underlying message: believe whatever you want. However,don't tell others that have a different belief than yours that they can't talk about their religious beliefs or that they aren't smart because of their religious beliefs. If you can't handle that than I suggest you stop posting altogether.

There is no need to be disrespectful to Deus. Not only is Deus a long time poster, but he is a very knowledgeable, fair and nice person. He doesn't deserve that at all.

Yikes, I'm outta here. (This thread that is)

After reading the latest posts from today , I believe I'll attend this church for a few minutes...

Christiancat said:

Thanks Dues I will. One could only hope the critics have now put me on ignore. Have a Great day and God Bless!

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Ironic
Was the misspelling by accident or on purpose ??