Chandler Jones

Jrik83 said:

Slightly OT: I swear that Chandler Jones has to lead the league in most times held without generating a holding call. I feel like that has to start evening out eventually as he becomes more established in the league. It has driven me nuts the last couple of years.

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Happens to all the good ones.

moosekill said:

Probably 15 pounds of hair. That should make him much more aerodynamic, like a swimmer!!

It is so rare today to see professional football players working out in the off season. Thank goodness Mr. Jones is the exception!!!!

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I agree. I was just kidding. This kid has such a great demeanor and works so hard and is so gifted, you just have to root for a young dude like that. We got something special with him.

I think he is Elite already. Not only does he have double digit sacks, but he's a guy you have to game plan for, plan to double, chip or roll away from. That is what makes a DE elite, regardless of how many sacks he has. Not saying he can't improve, of course he can, but he has already arrived!

I think that people overlook how much Jones is asked to do on defense. He is not Robert Quinn he does not lineup with his hand on the ground in a 9 technique every play.

I remember against the Jets early in the season on one series Jones lined up as a 3 technique, 5 technique, 7 technique, and 9 technique. JJ Watt is the only other player in the NFL doing those things.

Brady6 said:

I think that people overlook how much Jones is asked to do on defense. He is not Robert Quinn he does not lineup with his hand on the ground in a 9 technique every play.

I remember against the Jets early in the season on one series Jones lined up as a 3 technique, 5 technique, 7 technique, and 9 technique. JJ Watt is the only other player in the NFL doing those things.

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I would love to see Chandler get those big, gangly arms up in the passing lanes like Watt does. That's half of what makes Watt so special: If he knows he's not going to get there, he's got great instincts to swat down the ball anyway.

Sicilian, could you make one of your excellent drawings of Jones for us?

I am not an X's and O's kind of fan, but I have to imagine that Jones and Easley have the very real potential to just keep feeding sacks to one another.

And while quarterback stats can be misleading, this was last year.
[url=http://www.nepatriotslife.com/2013/12/2013-patriots-finish-with-most-sacks.html]2013 Patriots finish with most sacks for any Bill Belichick team | nePatriotsLife.com[/URL]

Big-T said:

Huh, he did only get 11.5...thought it was 12.5! I know he got some taken away from him by the league, but didn't think it was that many.

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You are correct sir. They robbed him of his sack against Drew Brees. He should have had 12.5 but only had 11.5 for the season.

PatsWickedPissah said:

Sicilian, could you make one of your excellent drawings of Jones for us?

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It's all semantics, but I won't declare him elite just yet. He had 11.5 sacks in the NFL but when I assess if someone is elite, I use the eyeball test. Is he someone that I'm confident in like a J.J. Watt? Jones doesn't inspire that much-sought-after "elite" appellation.

Sacks are too heavily influenced by circumstances. I think we had the most sacks in the NFL in 2007, for example--even more than the haunting Giants defensive line, but our defense was not reflective of that statistic. Looking at the 2013 squad, Nink had 8 sacks. Is the difference between elite and not elite 3.5 sacks? Another stat: 24 players had double-digit sacks last year between all the defensive linemen (15 DL) and linebackers (9 LB)--excluding playoffs.

I don't have a strong opinion on this, but it's the post-draft and pre-Training camp offseason-purgatory and my football-blood sugar is plummeting precipitously.

patriot lifer said:

It's all semantics, but I won't declare him elite just yet. He had 11.5 sacks in the NFL but when I assess if someone is elite, I use the eyeball test. Is he someone that I'm confident in like a J.J. Watt? Jones doesn't inspire that much-sought-after "elite" appellation.

Sacks are too heavily influenced by circumstances. I think we had the most sacks in the NFL in 2007, for example--even more than the haunting Giants defensive line, but our defense was not reflective of that statistic. Looking at the 2013 squad, Nink had 8 sacks. Is the difference between elite and not elite 3.5 sacks? Another stat: 24 players had double-digit sacks last year between all the defensive linemen (15 DL) and linebackers (9 LB)--excluding playoffs.

I don't have a strong opinion on this, but it's the post-draft and pre-Training camp offseason-purgatory and my football-blood sugar is plummeting precipitously.

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Elite isn't just measured in sack stats. Also, a lot of Chris Jones' sacks were directly because of Chandler Jones.

VrabelJr said:

Elite isn't just measured in sack stats. Also, a lot of Chris Jones' sacks were directly because of Chandler Jones.

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I think the area in which I would like to see Jones make the biggest improvement relates to his performance against some of the bigger, heavier tackles in the game. Understandably so, some of his offensive tackle opponents outmatched his weight by significant margins. Jones did not have the power to explode through the better OTs with traditional bull-rushes. Call it a weakness in his play or an opportunity for improvement, the lower body weight gains from this offseason should diminish this nitpick.

It reflects the already known weakness to the lighter DE trends: OTs are getting taller and heavier. At least we've got our own two towers on the O-line.

If he comes in stronger with a bad hairline some opposing teams fans will scream ped use. BTW many players scream hold. Its a fine line and the best defense against it is to win decisively so it is no doubt flagrant to the refs

Flagrant like this with 2! zebras looking right at it:

patriot lifer said:

It's all semantics, but I won't declare him elite just yet. He had 11.5 sacks in the NFL but when I assess if someone is elite, I use the eyeball test. Is he someone that I'm confident in like a J.J. Watt? Jones doesn't inspire that much-sought-after "elite" appellation.

Sacks are too heavily influenced by circumstances. I think we had the most sacks in the NFL in 2007, for example--even more than the haunting Giants defensive line, but our defense was not reflective of that statistic. Looking at the 2013 squad, Nink had 8 sacks. Is the difference between elite and not elite 3.5 sacks? Another stat: 24 players had double-digit sacks last year between all the defensive linemen (15 DL) and linebackers (9 LB)--excluding playoffs.

I don't have a strong opinion on this, but it's the post-draft and pre-Training camp offseason-purgatory and my football-blood sugar is plummeting precipitously.

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While I actually agree that sacks are not the end all be all measure of a defense, the Giants actually were the league leader in sacks in 2007 by a pretty wide margin. I think they had 57 and we were 2nd with 48, or something along those lines, so that example doesn't really make your point for you.

patriot lifer said:

I think the area in which I would like to see Jones make the biggest improvement relates to his performance against some of the bigger, heavier tackles in the game. Understandably so, some of his offensive tackle opponents outmatched his weight by significant margins. Jones did not have the power to explode through the better OTs with traditional bull-rushes. Call it a weakness in his play or an opportunity for improvement, the lower body weight gains from this offseason should diminish this nitpick.

It reflects the already known weakness to the lighter DE trends: OTs are getting taller and heavier. At least we've got our own two towers on the O-line.

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Exactly. That's y I say him being slightly quicker while getting more powerful is what can make him elite. He isn't qwik-twitch enough to ever win the explosive burst. However if he gets a little quicker and more powerful he will be one of the guys who is elite through a combination of quickness,power,flexibility and length. Having a good amount of everything can be better than being elite at one thing. And he just needs the slightest more quickness and a little added power to combine with his length and flexibility to be a 15 sack guy who consistently hurries qbs. Collins just needs a little bulk to be flat out terrorizing at blitzing. Combined with Dominique Easley and that's plenty of disruption. I also believe Zach Moore surpasses Buchannon. He has as much raw talent as Jones. Over 10' broad,nearly 36" vertical at 6'5 275 and has ran 4.73 40s with no upper level coaching yet meaning very raw. With NFL training and coaching he could win significant time at LE by January.

Sicilian said:

While I actually agree that sacks are not the end all be all measure of a defense, the Giants actually were the league leader in sacks in 2007 by a pretty wide margin. I think they had 57 and we were 2nd with 48, or something along those lines, so that example doesn't really make your point for you.

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I stand corrected on the stats, but the point is still valid fwiw. We did not have that good of a pass-rush that year. The point was that circumstances bear a strong influence on sack totals.

To indulge the topic further: As an example, in 2007, our team was repeatedly in circumstances where we played from ahead. The effect is that the opposing teams must pass more, with more frequent 5- and 7-step drops. Therefore, more opportunities for sacks, and therefore more sacks. Vrabel, for example, had 12.5 sacks, which was a personal record. His normal sacks per year were around 4-5.

This past season, we had one of the top scoring offenses. This created a similar effect for the 2013 year.

Big-T said:

Flagrant like this with 2! zebras looking right at it:

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Tony Corente doesn't see a problem there.

SalemPats said:

Chandler had 11 sacks last year. He gets Wilfork/Kelly and Easley who are good penetrators which should help Jones. I like what he was saying about Easley, it seems like he wants to help teach the young guy. I'm hoping for a 14-15 sack season and 3-4 force fumbles.

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And if he has that type of season..that will help out the studs we have covering WRs now as well

PatsWickedPissah said:

Word up on if he lost those 15 LBS of body fat yet?

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Not sure, I did however send his trainer a regimen that included jogging, jumping jacks, an ab roller, and one of those small trampoline things, as well as a nutrition outline that suggested cutting down on soda and MacDonalds, if he followed it he will become an all pro fer sher.