Realistic compensation for Ryan Mallet?

upstater1 said:

They could offer, but Mallet would never take it. He's never had a chance to be #1. He can make at least $3m elsewhere and possibly more later if he shows he can be a #1. This is why Belichick HAD to take a QB (not necessarily in the 2nd round however). The only other option was trading Brady.

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My bad - I didn't realize you were being sarcastic about Mallet

Obviously he can't make "at least $3 million elsewhere" and I'm not even sure what "the only option was trading Brady" even means, but obviously that's a joke as well

Use those rolling eye emoticons next time as some might think you were seriously suggesting that Mallet, who has barely seen the field, would "easily" be among the Top Five paid backup QBs in the league, joining the proven veteran starter/backups in that salary stratosphere

JoeSixPat said:

My bad - I didn't realize you were being sarcastic about Mallet

Obviously he can't make "at least $3 million elsewhere" and I'm not even sure what "the only option was trading Brady" even means, but obviously that's a joke as well

Use those rolling eye emoticons next time as some might think you were seriously suggesting that Mallet, who has barely seen the field, would "easily" be among the Top Five paid backup QBs in the league, joining the proven veteran starter/backups in that salary stratosphere

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Dozens of people have explained the situation to you. Yet you persist in the belief that Mallet's aspiration is to be a backup. He wants to compete for a starter position, and he will. $3m is backup money now. He'll get more than $3m, you watch.

PatsWickedPissah said:

He won't make "at least $3M elsewhere" if JAG beats him out and becomes the backup QB. Were that to happen, he'd likely have to take a 1 year vet minimum possibly with incentives elsewhere in a prove it deal.

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A backup vying for starter makes at least $3m in today's NFL. A team with a Geno Atkins type starter will throw give him that at least.

Thinking back to a certain other QB the Pats signed last year...you know who I'm talking about...if BB had started to sour on Mallett (as the evidence of Garoppolo suggests) then it puts that move last year in a new light I think... obviously it didn't pan out but maybe the intent of that signing really was to see what that other QB could do for the Patriots and Bill really didn't think of him as anything other than a QB...

upstater1 said:

Dozens of people have explained the situation to you. Yet you persist in the belief that Mallet's aspiration is to be a backup. He wants to compete for a starter position, and he will. $3m is backup money now. He'll get more than $3m, you watch.

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I don't want to spoil the surprise for you - but go ahead and research how much backup QBs with no starting experience in the NFL make

The only ones who make that much are veterans QBs (and only the top 5 veteran backup QBs at that - and even THEY are looking at being cut or restructured if the young promising QB looks good) looked to for depth/insurance by teams with unproven young developmental QBs who need them if their young QBs don't work out

Then tell us how many QBs with ZERO NFL starts "easily" get offers of $3 million a year

I've always found Patriots fans to be among the most savvy on the planet, yet when it comes to perceptions of backup QBs, the one thing you can always count upon here is that most Patriots fans will swear our backup QB is among the most under-rated QB in the league

Whether it was Scott Zolak, Ray Lucas, Michael Bishop, Rohan Davey, Matt Gutierrez Kevin O'Connell, Bryan Hoyer or Mallet, these were and always have been guys local fans felt just needed a chance to show they could be starters in the NFL - and in every case they were more or less wrong

Ironically you had few people saying that about Brady (who even after rising from #4 to #2 watched as Bledsoe was signed by Belichick to a 10 year $100 million contract) and to a lesser degree Cassel, who looked HORRIBLE on the pre-season field but then helped a 16-0 team go 11-5 as a starter the following season

But in all other cases these guys were all right on the cusp of NFL stardom as far as most fans were concerned - but even a guy who still has potential like Hoyer was cut by the Patriots when the newly drafted #2 displaced him, with no trading partners to be found (and - spoiler alert - Hoyer didn't sign for "easily at least $3 million a season")

I'd love to see them get two 1st round draft choices for Mallet - and I'd be happy for Mallet if he became the only $3 million backup QB without an NFL start under his belt - but that's just not going to happen, because most NFL GMs (including Belichick) are a better judge of talent than fans

JoeSixPat said:

I don't want to spoil the surprise for you - but go ahead and research how much backup QBs with no starting experience in the NFL make

The only ones who make that much are veterans QBs (and only the top 5 veteran backup QBs at that - and even THEY are looking at being cut or restructured if the young promising QB looks good) looked to for depth/insurance by teams with unproven young developmental QBs who need them if their young QBs don't work out

Then tell us how many QBs with ZERO NFL starts "easily" get offers of $3 million a year

I've always found Patriots fans to be among the most savvy on the planet, yet when it comes to perceptions of backup QBs, the one thing you can always count upon here is that most Patriots fans will swear our backup QB is among the most under-rated QB in the league

Whether it was Scott Zolak, Ray Lucas, Michael Bishop, Rohan Davey, Matt Gutierrez Kevin O'Connell, Bryan Hoyer or Mallet, these were and always have been guys local fans felt just needed a chance to show they could be starters in the NFL - and in every case they were more or less wrong

Ironically you had few people saying that about Brady (who even after rising from #4 to #2 watched as Bledsoe was signed by Belichick to a 10 year $100 million contract) and to a lesser degree Cassel, who looked HORRIBLE on the pre-season field but then helped a 16-0 team go 11-5 as a starter the following season

But in all other cases these guys were all right on the cusp of NFL stardom as far as most fans were concerned - but even a guy who still has potential like Hoyer was cut by the Patriots when the newly drafted #2 displaced him, with no trading partners to be found (and - spoiler alert - Hoyer didn't sign for "easily at least $3 million a season")

I'd love to see them get two 1st round draft choices for Mallet - and I'd be happy for Mallet if he became the only $3 million backup QB without an NFL start under his belt - but that's just not going to happen, because most NFL GMs (including Belichick) are a better judge of talent than fans

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JoeSixPat said:

I don't want to spoil the surprise for you - but go ahead and research how much backup QBs with no starting experience in the NFL make

The only ones who make that much are veterans QBs (and only the top 5 veteran backup QBs at that - and even THEY are looking at being cut or restructured if the young promising QB looks good) looked to for depth/insurance by teams with unproven young developmental QBs who need them if their young QBs don't work out

Then tell us how many QBs with ZERO NFL starts "easily" get offers of $3 million a year

I've always found Patriots fans to be among the most savvy on the planet, yet when it comes to perceptions of backup QBs, the one thing you can always count upon here is that most Patriots fans will swear our backup QB is among the most under-rated QB in the league

Whether it was Scott Zolak, Ray Lucas, Michael Bishop, Rohan Davey, Matt Gutierrez Kevin O'Connell, Bryan Hoyer or Mallet, these were and always have been guys local fans felt just needed a chance to show they could be starters in the NFL - and in every case they were more or less wrong

Ironically you had few people saying that about Brady (who even after rising from #4 to #2 watched as Bledsoe was signed by Belichick to a 10 year $100 million contract) and to a lesser degree Cassel, who looked HORRIBLE on the pre-season field but then helped a 16-0 team go 11-5 as a starter the following season

But in all other cases these guys were all right on the cusp of NFL stardom as far as most fans were concerned - but even a guy who still has potential like Hoyer was cut by the Patriots when the newly drafted #2 displaced him, with no trading partners to be found (and - spoiler alert - Hoyer didn't sign for "easily at least $3 million a season")

I'd love to see them get two 1st round draft choices for Mallet - and I'd be happy for Mallet if he became the only $3 million backup QB without an NFL start under his belt - but that's just not going to happen, because most NFL GMs (including Belichick) are a better judge of talent than fans

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We just went over this the other day. Lots of young QBs get paid. Chase Daniel did. Dan Orlovsky did. I hate to break this to you, but you're wrong.

Here are two more facts that Belichick understands:

#1. Ryan Mallet is going to sign with a team that allows him to compete for the starter's position. That means, he was NOT going to sign with New England.

#2. Prior to the draft, there was only 1 QB on the roster other than Mallet and Brady.

Belichick understood these 2 facts very well.

upstater1 said:

We just went over this the other day. Lots of young QBs get paid. Chase Daniel did. Dan Orlovsky did. I hate to break this to you, but you're wrong.

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So when asked to provide a list of all NFL Backup QBs with Zero starts making over $3 million your resposne is to cite Chase Daniel, a veteran with actual starting experience, who everyone acknowledges was overpaid?

And Dan Orlovsky? Zero starts?

And HOW MUCH do you think he's making????

Over $3 million a season????

upstater1 said:

A backup vying for starter makes at least $3m in today's NFL. A team with a Geno Atkins type starter will throw give him that at least.

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Look at backup salaries posted here some time ago. They fall into 2 clusters. Guys with a rep that someone bought into making 3+ M and guys who are perceived as backups at around vet min. There is NO information available to GMs that says Mallet fits the higher paid group. Only Patsfans think so.
He'll get a close to minimum one year prove it deal with escalators. Even that will not be easy if JAG, unlike TFB in his 1st year, beats him out as #2.

PatsWickedPissah said:

Look at backup salaries posted here some time ago. They fall into 2 clusters. Guys with a rep that someone bought into making 3+ M and guys who are perceived as backups at around vet min. There is NO information available to GMs that says Mallet fits the higher paid group. Only Patsfans think so.
He'll get a close to minimum one year prove it deal with escalators. Even that will not be easy if JAG, unlike TFB in his 1st year, beats him out as #2.

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I posted the link.

Chase Daniel threw less than 10 passes in 4 years.

JoeSixPat said:

So when asked to provide a list of all NFL Backup QBs with Zero starts making over $3 million your resposne is to cite Chase Daniel, a veteran with actual starting experience, who everyone acknowledges was overpaid?

And Dan Orlovsky? Zero starts?

And HOW MUCH do you think he's making????

Over $3 million a season????

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Chase Daniel never started. He threw less than 10 passes in 4 years.

Orlovsky got over $3 million a season.

How about "Door Number One, Door Number Two or Door Number Three?"

We have no idea how good a starter Mallett will or will not be since we can count the number of downs he's played in an NFL season one one hand, maybe two.

All we really know is that BB kept him around for three seasons, going into a fourth. That goes in the "plus" column.

On the other hand, we also know that after watching Mallett for those same three seasons, BB decided to use a second round pick on a QB. That goes in the neutral column at best and more likely, IMO, goes in the "minus" column, though we're all just guessing there and your guess is as good as mine.

upstater1 said:

Chase Daniel never started. He threw less than 10 passes in 4 years.

Orlovsky got over $3 million a season.

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Right - so the one QB who is the poster child of a bad, overpaid QB contract in Chase Daniel and Orlovsky who signed a Veteran Minimum contract despite numerous NFL starts...

That's your example of why Mallet - who no one wanted to trade for - who has 0 NFL starts - will "easily get $3 million a season"?

Look - I hope Mallet "easily" gets $3 million THIS season because my hope is that the Patriots new 2nd round pick outplays Mallet enough to have him cut

And any team that wants to overpay as much as the Chiefs overpaid Daniel is more good news as far as I'm concerned - the more teams spend cap $ foolishly the better for the Patriots.

But to state that NFL backup QBs with no starting experience "easily get $3 million a season" is just more of the same type of fan overhype we saw with Michael Bishop - who many thought should be starting ahead of both Bledsoe AND Brady - and then was subsequently cut by Belichick - followed by being cut by the CFL

JoeSixPat said:

Right - so the one QB who is the poster child of a bad, overpaid QB contract in Chase Daniel and Orlovsky who signed a Veteran Minimum contract despite numerous NFL starts...

That's your example of why Mallet - who no one wanted to trade for - who has 0 NFL starts - will "easily get $3 million a season"?

Look - I hope Mallet "easily" gets $3 million THIS season because my hope is that the Patriots new 2nd round pick outplays Mallet enough to have him cut

And any team that wants to overpay as much as the Chiefs overpaid Daniel is more good news as far as I'm concerned - the more teams spend cap $ foolishly the better for the Patriots.

But to state that NFL backup QBs with no starting experience "easily get $3 million a season" is just more of the same type of fan overhype we saw with Michael Bishop - who many thought should be starting ahead of both Bledsoe AND Brady - and then was subsequently cut by Belichick - followed by being cut by the CFL

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You still don't understand that if Mallett gets an equal contract by the pats and a team without a clear starting QB then Mallett will most likely not the team without a clear starter. So even if we liked Mallett we would have to pay him much more than veteran minimum because we would have to pay him as a QB fighting and maybe winning the QB spot.

Mallett isn't staying here as a backup if he can go and compete for a starting spot and earn big bucks if he where to win it.

JoeSixPat said:

Right - so the one QB who is the poster child of a bad, overpaid QB contract in Chase Daniel and Orlovsky who signed a Veteran Minimum contract despite numerous NFL starts...

That's your example of why Mallet - who no one wanted to trade for - who has 0 NFL starts - will "easily get $3 million a season"?

Look - I hope Mallet "easily" gets $3 million THIS season because my hope is that the Patriots new 2nd round pick outplays Mallet enough to have him cut

And any team that wants to overpay as much as the Chiefs overpaid Daniel is more good news as far as I'm concerned - the more teams spend cap $ foolishly the better for the Patriots.

But to state that NFL backup QBs with no starting experience "easily get $3 million a season" is just more of the same type of fan overhype we saw with Michael Bishop - who many thought should be starting ahead of both Bledsoe AND Brady - and then was subsequently cut by Belichick - followed by being cut by the CFL

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Orlovsky signed a big contract. He's in his 30s by now, this isn't his second contract. pay attention.

Not only that, but Chase Daniel was a short 6 foot UDFA who hadn't played at all prior to signing that contract.

You're going to be surprised when Mallet signs for at least $3m per, but not many people other than you will be surprised.

upstater1 said:

Orlovsky signed a big contract. He's in his 30s by now, this isn't his second contract. pay attention.

Not only that, but Chase Daniel was a short 6 foot UDFA who hadn't played at all prior to signing that contract.

You're going to be surprised when Mallet signs for at least $3m per, but not many people other than you will be surprised.

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I would be surprised. They must really like what they have seen from Chase, probably has shown a lot more than Mallet in practice.

As for Dan, he has started in the league and has had stretches of playing reasonably well.

Nunchucks said:

I would be surprised. They must really like what they have seen from Chase, probably has shown a lot more than Mallet in practice.

As for Dan, he has started in the league and has had stretches of playing reasonably well.

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But I'm talking about Orlovsky's second contract here.

He was a 3rd stringer behind Stanton at Detroit.

A bucket of warm Spit...or the Highest Bidder.

Off The Grid said:

A bucket of warm Spit...or the Highest Bidder.

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Aren't you paying attention? He's going to "easily" get at least $3 million a season - probably $4 million a season

Because, after all - look a all those starts!!!

Nunchucks said:

Brady also looked very good in training camp and in preseason. Patriots basically lucked out with Cassel, he has certainly not lived up to that 2nd round pick compensation, I am not sure if any team would give up any compensation for Cassel now that he has played in the league for a few years.

NFC West and a team talented enough to go 18-1 with great coaching.....

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Cassell has been to two Pro Bowls. He is good enough to win with, but not good enough to carry a poor team on his back, like the elites sometimes can. Yet another example of BB talent is both drafting and grooming QBs. Hoyer as well.


Mallett is the groomed backup for 2014, as the new rookie, from a third rated football program even, tries to figure out what an NFL football program is all about. I find it amazing how y'all can complain about raw potential depth at other positions, but don't want any at the most important position in football, the QB.

JoeSixPat said:

My bad - I didn't realize you were being sarcastic about Mallet

Obviously he can't make "at least $3 million elsewhere" and I'm not even sure what "the only option was trading Brady" even means, but obviously that's a joke as well

Use those rolling eye emoticons next time as some might think you were seriously suggesting that Mallet, who has barely seen the field, would "easily" be among the Top Five paid backup QBs in the league, joining the proven veteran starter/backups in that salary stratosphere

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Get with the program. The going rate for groomed backup QBs is even higher than that. The days of sub-million dollar backup QBs are long gone.