What you're getting in Jemea Thomas

mgteich said:

Most of us have Thomas making the roster. I suspect that this is our hearts talking. Thomas seems like a perfect candidate for the Practice Squad.

CB: Revis, Dennard, Arrington, Browner (Green for 4 weeks)
S : McCourty, Harmon, Ryan
ST: Ebner
S/ST: Chung and/or Tavon Wilson

IMHO, Thomas is not likely to be a better special teamer than Wilson and Chung.

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It may be an uphill climb for him to battle those two for a roster spot, but it sure isn't much of a climb, is it?

KontradictioN said:

Not what I said at all. I said coverage wasn't his strength and he translates better as an in-the-box safety in the NFL. You were the one implying that I stated he couldn't cover "at all". But you can feel free to look up the scouting reports that say the same thing as I did about projecting where he would line up as a pro. I do appreciate you attempting to twist my words even after I corrected you in the thread, though. Keep up the good work, bud.

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Someone clearly has a guilty conscience. But, let's see what you really said:

KontradictioN said:

If Thomas plays CB in the pro's, he'll make Arrington look like Revis. He's strictly an in-the-box, run support safety. Playing him even as a nickel corner would be exposing his weakness (man coverage) and ignoring his strengths (tackling) ability.

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Sure looks like you are saying he can't cover at all by saying "He's strictly an in-the-box, run support safety".

Oh, and I did look up a scouting report that didn't happen to agree with you and you ignored it..

DaBruinz said:

Someone clearly has a guilty conscience. But, let's see what you really said:

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Again, being an in-the-box safety with strong tackling does not mean "he can't cover at all", no matter how much you would like to think that it does.

Sure looks like you are saying he can't cover at all by saying "He's strictly an in-the-box, run support safety".

Oh, and I did look up a scouting report that didn't happen to agree with you and you ignored it..

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If you did, you didn't quote me so of course I would ignore it. But here you go. This is just one of several that DO agree with me...

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/jemea-thomas?id=2543808

And I quote:

ANALYSIS
Strengths
Very strong pound-for-pound. Sacrifices his body and shows up well in the run game. Takes good angles and understands run-game fits. Carries a very quiet confidence. Mentally and physically tough and seeks contact. Good short-area zone awareness -- is best moving forward and reacting to the thrown ball in front of him. Experienced, four-year starter. Commands respect from teammates. Very durable and has played through injuries and never missed any time. Hardworking and accountable.

Weaknesses
Is stiff-hipped, short-armed and undersized with a frame that looks maxed out at less than 200 pounds. (KONTRA: Not exactly what you look for in a corner) Gives up some ground and allows separation in man coverage vs. quickness. Easily mismatched by size vs. tight ends. Average range -- lacks desirable length and fluidity to patrol the back end. Hands are iffy. Regarded by some teams as too much of a tweener.

Bottom Line
A tough, downhill box safety who plays bigger than his size. Hip inflexibility could relegate him to a situational nickel-safety role initially, yet possesses the toughness, competitiveness and football temperament to earn his way onto the field.

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Care to keep trying? Or are you going to skip right to the part where you break out the red herrings and 50's sitcom cut downs?

Oh, and why are the usual post-draft suspects acting like it's such a slight that I'm calling him an in-the-box safety? It's not. It's his strength. Playing corner or deep safety is not. That's not cutting the guy down. It's what he is.

KontradictioN said:

Oh, and why are the usual post-draft suspects acting like it's such a slight that I'm calling him an in-the-box safety? It's not. It's his strength. Playing corner or deep safety is not. That's not cutting the guy down. It's what he is.

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I definitely see him as an in the box safety. He's strong, fast, hard hitting tackler. Don't see him covering deep, but he could really be what we've been missing on the strong side. Hard to get too optimistic based on highlight reels, but I really like what I see thus far

KontradictioN said:

Again, being an in-the-box safety with strong tackling does not mean "he can't cover at all", no matter how much you would like to think that it does.

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Too bad that isn't what you said. You said he is "STRICTLY an in-the-box, run support safety". I am certain that the word STRICTLY doesn't mean what you think it means. In that context, it means ONLY. Someone who is "ONLY" an in-the-box, run support safety is someone who can't cover.

I quoted you specifically from the other thread. You trying to deny and and spin what you said is pretty laughable.

KontradictioN said:

If you did, you didn't quote me so of course I would ignore it. But here you go. This is just one of several that DO agree with me...

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/jemea-thomas?id=2543808

And I quote:

Care to keep trying? Or are you going to skip right to the part where you break out the red herrings and 50's sitcom cut downs?

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I don't need to keep trying. I posted one that didn't agree with you. It's the link "scouting report" in my previous post (did I make it too Subtle for you?). And I had quoted you in the other thread with a link to the NFLDraftScout.com report that contradicted you because you said "EVERY SITE" agreed with you and they don't.

Just face facts. You claimed he couldn't cover with your statement that he was "STRICTLY an in-the-box, run support safety" and now you are back-pedalling to try and CYA. The funny part is your attempt to deny the direct quote that you made and spin it into something else.

KontradictioN said:

Oh, and why are the usual post-draft suspects acting like it's such a slight that I'm calling him an in-the-box safety? It's not. It's his strength. Playing corner or deep safety is not. That's not cutting the guy down. It's what he is.

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Because, that isn't what you said no matter how many times you say otherwise. It's funny how you try and deny the direct quotes that you made by claiming this other crap.

Username said:

I definitely see him as an in the box safety. He's strong, fast, hard hitting tackler. Don't see him covering deep, but he could really be what we've been missing on the strong side. Hard to get too optimistic based on highlight reels, but I really like what I see thus far

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BB plays Right and Left Safeties, where each S must be a complete S able to do FS and SS coverages. That is why he has had so much trouble filling the SS position. Chung could play Strong Safety but not the FS portion of a complete Safety. Neither could Tavon Wilson who was drafted as a SS and SS/LB hybrid. Deep coverage failures ruined his chances too.

With the coverage improvements, maybe the Safety assignments for the RS are lesser, and a more pure SS can do it, Alternatively, the RS can be more of a FS/CB and work deeper, with the DL and LB we now have, reducing the need for the SS atributes somewhat.

Would have much rather seen the Patriots select Christian Bryant (OSU - 7th) or Isiah Lewis (MSU - UDFA). I could be wrong, but I have no idea what the scouting staff saw in Thomas over those two because I'm sure as hell not seeing it.

Beasly said:

Would have much rather seen the Patriots select Christian Bryant (OSU - 7th) or Isiah Lewis (MSU - UDFA). I could be wrong, but I have no idea what the scouting staff saw in Thomas over those two because I'm sure as hell not seeing it.

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Really? You don't see anything encouraging at all? I'm surprised by that, but each to their own I suppose.

DaBruinz said:

Too bad that isn't what you said. You said he is "STRICTLY an in-the-box, run support safety". I am certain that the word STRICTLY doesn't mean what you think it means. In that context, it means ONLY. Someone who is "ONLY" an in-the-box, run support safety is someone who can't cover.

I quoted you specifically from the other thread. You trying to deny and and spin what you said is pretty laughable.




I don't need to keep trying. I posted one that didn't agree with you. It's the link "scouting report" in my previous post (did I make it too Subtle for you?). And I had quoted you in the other thread with a link to the NFLDraftScout.com report that contradicted you because you said "EVERY SITE" agreed with you and they don't.

Just face facts. You claimed he couldn't cover with your statement that he was "STRICTLY an in-the-box, run support safety" and now you are back-pedalling to try and CYA. The funny part is your attempt to deny the direct quote that you made and spin it into something else.

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Before I respond to this in detail, please break down what you believe are Thomas' strengths and weaknesses (since it's hard to believe that you think he's a perfect safety who can do it all). Then I'll quote all 3 of your posts to me in one response and break them down quote for quote.

Eric, thanks for that. Of course, we all know that sixth-round picks are sixth-round picks for a reason and few of them make the transition to the NFL. But college fans have a sense of players that goes beyond the externals that scouts see (however important those are). Sometimes those intangibles tip the scales. At any rate, they make it fun to root for a player. All we can say is that, if any team in the NFL will give a player a chance to make it on merit and commitment alone, not draft status or reputation, it's the Patriots. Good luck to Jemea Thomas and appreciation for your enthusiasm.

Username said:

Really? You don't see anything encouraging at all? I'm surprised by that, but each to their own I suppose.

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Highlight videos aren't really a good way to judge talent. Even Mark Sanchez had a few highlight videos at one point. That being said even Thomas' highlight video is underwhelming. If you want to compare highlight videos give me this guy:

Adam Seward said:

So pretty much I should change from 'Adam Seward' to 'Jemea Thomas'?

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By all means! Or just about anybody else you would care to be.

Beasly said:

Would have much rather seen the Patriots select Christian Bryant (OSU - 7th) or Isiah Lewis (MSU - UDFA). I could be wrong, but I have no idea what the scouting staff saw in Thomas over those two because I'm sure as hell not seeing it.

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You sure as hell are not seeing it based upon what? Your extesive film review of the 3 players? I highly doubt that, so stop it with the bold statement about the wisdom (or lack thereof) of picking Thomas. The bottom line about all of these players is that none of us who post here knows what the hell he/she is talking about, even the day 1 prospects. I'm sure that BB, Caserio, Robinson and the scouts have forgotten more about Bryant and Lewis than you know about them and they like Thomas better. Time will tell if they are correct.

From watching that highlight video, Thomas looks like the quintessential patriot safety. A midget, unable to cover good Wrs 1 on 1, going to get burned often by the deep ball, going to give up jump ball touchdowns in the redzone to tall Wrs, and likes to make tackles 15 yards downfield.

I like that other video of Isiah Lewis. Tall, Fast, Rangy, great cover skills, ballhawk, nice instincts, able to prevent the deep ball, can win jump balls, very physical tackler.

Patriots need to start going after defensive backs with height, playmaking abilities, and speed. Defensive Backs who can COVER. I love the signings of Browner and Revis.

Patsgofor4 said:

You sure as hell are not seeing it based upon what? Your extesive film review of the 3 players? I highly doubt that, so stop it with the bold statement about the wisdom (or lack thereof) of picking Thomas. The bottom line about all of these players is that none of us who post here knows what the hell he/she is talking about, even the day 1 prospects. I'm sure that BB, Caserio, Robinson and the scouts have forgotten more about Bryant and Lewis than you know about them and they like Thomas better. Time will tell if they are correct.

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Another appeal to authority. Might as well shut the forum down since there's no point in discussing literally anything with that logic (or lack thereof, considering it is a logical fallacy).

NG Pats Fan said:

From watching that highlight video, Thomas looks like the quintessential patriot safety. A midget, unable to cover good Wrs 1 on 1, going to get burned often by the deep ball, going to give up jump ball touchdowns in the redzone to tall Wrs, and likes to make tackles 15 yards downfield.

I like that other video of Isiah Lewis. Tall, Fast, Rangy, great cover skills, ballhawk, nice instincts, able to prevent the deep ball, can win jump balls, very physical tackler.

Patriots need to start going after defensive backs with height, playmaking abilities, and speed. Defensive Backs who can COVER. I love the signings of Browner and Revis.

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Jemea Thomas: 5' 9 1/4", 4.52
Isaiah Lewis: 5' 9 7/8", 4.53

There are two groups of posters: the ones who know they don't know what they're talking about, and the ones who don't. Always hilarious to see the two camps emerge in such clear definition at draft time!

Don Kipines said:

There are two groups of posters: the ones who know they don't know what they're talking about, and the ones who don't. Always hilarious to see the two camps emerge in such clear definition at draft time!

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And there are those who think that any player who wasn't drafted in the 1st 6 rounds has little chance of making an NFL squad.