Pats backroom let down Brady AGAIN

Brady6 said:

Belichick also thought Tavon Wilson, Jake Bequette, Ras-I Dowling, Ron Brace, Jermaine Cunningham, Chad Jackson, and many others would fit and they either did not or have not so do not be smug and act as if his draft history is without error.

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Ya because thinking they are bad picks because they didn't meet your measurable standards is the correct way to go.

Also I see you keep pounding the table about Marcus Martin comparing to Alex Mack because Rob Rang said so. Ya let's take the word of a high school poetry teacher draftnik on that.

Talk about a sheep to the big boards.

JMC00 said:

Ya because thinking they are bad picks because they didn't meet your measurable standards is the correct way to go.

Also I see you keep pounding the table about Marcus Martin comparing to Alex Mack because Rob Rang said so. Ya let's take a high school poerty teacher draftnik word on that.

Talk about a sheep to the big boards.

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Yeah and we started a player who allowed a league high 37 QB disruptions and graded out as the worst OC in the league last year for all 16 games, clearly the Patriots are flawless. It does not matter if you told me it was sunny outside JMC because I would still have to look out the window cause you never offer anything objective, you are 100% predictable, if someone says something negative you are going to advocate that they are wrong and give them a hard time. That is what you do 99.9% of your posts reflect that, so how can I put an ounce of stock in anything you say? I cannot.

Coach42 said:

I don't like Monday morning QBs. Did the picks work out? Absolutely not, you can cherry pick bad picks several years later and prove nothing if you want. Everybody misses, sometimes they even miss huge. Fact is they are able to consistently put enough talent to compete for championships for 15 years now so you're knee jerk assessment of players drafted this weekend means less than nothing. Yes I disagree with some of your thoughts, it's a message board, grow up.

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Fact: It's impossible to evaluate Patriots moves before the moves are made, so all evaluations are "Monday morning Quarterback" situations to some degree.

Fact: When people try to evaluate moves immediately after the moves are made, they are told that it's not fair to evaluate moves before things play out.

Fact: When people point to failed moves after things play out, they are accused of Monday Morning Quarterbacking.

Fact: Appeals to authority are usually logical fallacies


Reality: The issue the homers have is that someone is questioning the team, not that there's MMQB involved. The timing is irrelevant beyond changing the excuse for trying to shut down the dissent. The post draft nonsense tossed out by the homers(like yours here, for example) shows that with perfect clarity.

@dex13 – troll much?

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yukon cornelius said:

here's a key point folks seem to neglect on some of these picks:

sometimes the players themselves fail to uphold their end of the bargain - they don't do their study, their film work, their work outs aren't up to snuff, they don't rehab, their heart was more in getting there rather than succeeding there

there's only so much prep-work a team can do.....sometimes they take the right guy at the right time and it still doesn't pan out.....and sometimes that falls on the player, not on the GM picking them, or the coaches coaching them

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I've always felt that 90% of the success of the players career is based on what he does AFTER he is drafted. None of them are NFL ready, at least not ready to play at a good level. Technique, conditioning, strength, knowledge all need to improve. Players need to learn how to face guys who are as good or better than them every week instead of most often facing inferior guys in college.
Just the fact that they are 21 years old and need to develop a personal life that supports their career as a professional athlete can send players in opposite directions.
Coaching, including training, nutrition, off the field behavior has way, way more to do with how a player turns out than which scouts had them rate a round higher or lower.

Taking a 3rd string QB with your 2nd draft pick is NOT doing everything you can to help Tom Brady out. I'm sorry, but it just isn't. I am not sure how you can dispute this. Instead of drafting a TE or pass rusher, someone at a position that will actually play, we got a backup QB.

I'm fine with our draft other than the Garapollo pick. But wasting a coveted 2nd rounder.. I just can't let that slide.

BradyToAmendola said:

Taking a 3rd string QB with your 2nd draft pick is NOT doing everything you can to help Tom Brady out. I'm sorry, but it just isn't. I am not sure how you can dispute this. Instead of drafting a TE or pass rusher, someone at a position that will actually play, we got a backup QB.

I'm fine with our draft other than the Garapollo pick. But wasting a coveted 2nd rounder.. I just can't let that slide.

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I get that, and I can easily agree with for rings and figure it out later, but you really can't dismiss the fact that this move was to find the replacement for a 37 year old QB. Given that no one who could have been taken later seems to me to have any chance of being a quality starter, I think the decision to draft Garappolo was the decision to fill the need this year, or keep gambling that we don't need one.

For those of you complaining about "wasting" a second rounder on Garappolo, tell us, who should belichick have taken with that pick to be a "weapon" for brady instead? Fiedorowicz was really the only one available and maybe belichick didn't think too highly of him.

Deus Irae said:

Your post was looking great right up to that point. Then you went completely off the rails.

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Since we disagree about most things relative to the Pats, I was worried about your praise. Now I am relieved by your criticism. Let me ask you if you have any recollection of the Bobby Grier era. Those picks were right from the Street and Smith's draft guide with every player highly rated. Only draw back was that they couldn't play. Parcells and Jimmy Johnson were laughing every draft day.

Brady6 said:

It is not just Belichick that is responsible for this but realistically we have had the best QB in the league for the past ten years, and while the other top QBs have all won a title in that time Brady has not, that to me indicates that we are not building around Brady well enough.

If we did not, have the GOAT and we were in the AFCCG or SB every year I would be sitting here defending everything Belichick does too, but when you have the best QB in a league that the most important player is the QB you should be in contention.

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No one said BB isn't responsible for personnel mistakes, he's had many. What I said was your assessment of his decisions a day after the draft are less than worthless.

flasox27 said:

Since we disagree about most things relative to the Pats, I was worried about your praise. Now I am relieved by your criticism. Let me ask you if you have any recollection of the Bobby Grier era. Those picks were right from the Street and Smith's draft guide with every player highly rated. Only draw back was that they couldn't play. Parcells and Jimmy Johnson were laughing every draft day.

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And now you're posting gibberish and foolishness.

How were BB's drafts from 2006-2009?

Deus Irae said:

Fact: Appeals to authority are usually logical fallacies

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Appeals to authority are only fallacious when they are used to dismiss evidence. I do not think that is what people in this thread are doing since there isn't even any evidence to suggest whether or not these players are/will be busts. They are simply pointing out that at this point in time, Belichick has more data available to him and has done much more research on the prospects available in this draft than anyone here. I do not think that can even be argued.

Fact: Deus Irae claims to be rational and logical.

Fact: Pats Fans is a Patriots fan based message board.

Fact: Deus Irae can't understand why there are so many Patriot fans on a Patriots fan website.

Seems logical. Fool.

Deus Irae said:

Fact: It's impossible to evaluate Patriots moves before the moves are made, so all evaluations are "Monday morning Quarterback" situations to some degree.

Fact: When people try to evaluate moves immediately after the moves are made, they are told that it's not fair to evaluate moves before things play out.

Fact: When people point to failed moves after things play out, they are accused of Monday Morning Quarterbacking.

Fact: Appeals to authority are usually logical fallacies


Reality: The issue the homers have is that someone is questioning the team, not that there's MMQB involved. The timing is irrelevant beyond changing the excuse for trying to shut down the dissent. The post draft nonsense tossed out by the homers(like yours here, for example) shows that with perfect clarity.

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act

Never understood why we don't have an Assclown forum over here ...

Deus Irae said:

Fact: It's impossible to evaluate Patriots moves before the moves are made, so all evaluations are "Monday morning Quarterback" situations to some degree.

Fact: When people try to evaluate moves immediately after the moves are made, they are told that it's not fair to evaluate moves before things play out.

Fact: When people point to failed moves after things play out, they are accused of Monday Morning Quarterbacking.

Fact: Appeals to authority are usually logical fallacies


Reality: The issue the homers have is that someone is questioning the team, not that there's MMQB involved. The timing is irrelevant beyond changing the excuse for trying to shut down the dissent. The post draft nonsense tossed out by the homers(like yours here, for example) shows that with perfect clarity.

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You clearly didn't read the conversation. I have no problem talking about the personnel mistake. Just use proper context when discussing them. Cherry picking misses to qualify your own assessment of a draft barely 24 hours old is not logical. Fool.

strngplyr said:

The same basic way our offense has stalled in every playoff game since at least 2007 has been because of interior pressure. BB just added 2 big interior linemen and added another Tackle which can potentially let Marcus Canon slide inside and also compete for the job.

It's never been about the weapons. Brady has proven countless times he can move the offense with any supporting cast as long as the guys blocking for him do their job.

I'd rather focus on the pass rush and pass protection any day over adding more skill position players that Brady won't even think about looking at because he doesn't trust them.

Fix the line and he'll make the offense go all by himself basically.

A disruptive defense also gives him more chances to do his thing by forcing turnovers.​

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I'm not confident in the linemen he took. Stork seems ok but I need to do more research on him, I'm concerned about concussions, the reports of 'lingering migraines' has me scared. Fleming is a waist-bended from the film I've seen and Halapio seems like camp fodder only, he's very often the last one to move off the snap and is on the ground quite a bit, plays off balance.

I hope they all become pro-bowlers and form a better line than Dallas had in the 90s but I wouldn't bet money on the O-line performing significantly better. Stork might be an upgrade and Fleming may play at RG some and may function as an emergency RT or perhaps some swing.

Coach42 said:

Fact: Deus Irae claims to be rational and logical.

Fact: Pats Fans is a Patriots fan based message board.

Fact: Deus Irae can't understand why there are so many Patriot fans on a Patriots fan website.

Seems logical. Fool.


act

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And you decided to just completely crap the bed. Illogic followed by a personal attack. Well done.

Coach42 said:

You clearly didn't read the conversation. I have no problem talking about the personnel mistake. Just use proper context when discussing them. Cherry picking misses to qualify your own assessment of a draft barely 24 hours old is not logical. Fool.

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I read your conversation. Your argument was lousy, to put it kindly.

And the personal attacks you're making aren't going to change that.

Deus Irae said:

I read your conversation. Your argument was lousy, to put it kindly.

And the personal attacks you're making aren't going to change that.

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Typical. Lazy.

IcyPatriot said:

Never understood why we don't have an Assclown forum over here ...

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Bandwidth?