PatsFans.com Menu
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans

Semi-OT: Cowher to Steeler fans: Get over Spygare


Status
Not open for further replies.
Your tedious, repeated claim that no one but Patriots fans bring this topic up is pure, steaming BS. Where do you live? In Chechnya?
Oh I agree Patriots haters bring it up when they are trolling us. But fact is this topic gets more play in this forum than it does anywhere else and I see more Patriots fans still talking about it (going on 7 years later) than anywhere else.

Maybe if I actually cared about what the haters said, I would be interested in Coach Cowher's statements and use that against them.

Obviously they get under your sick.... but I assure you, they do not get under mine.
 
Go and read ANY comment section having to do with ANYTHING about the Patriots.

Article about Revis?

Dozens of Spygate and cheater comments.

I dare you to find a single article that even brushes on the Patriots over on PFT for example and have it NOT have a huge percentage of these kind of comments.
Heaven forbid we let facts get in the way, but since you asked....

Here is the PFT article announcing the Patriots signed Revis. Out of 137 comments, there is only 1 single comment that makes a (veiled) reference to Spygate.

Report: Darrelle Revis agrees to one-year deal with Patriots | ProFootballTalk

Here is the PFT article announcing the Patriots signed Browner. Out of 106 comments, only 2 make veiled references to Spygate.

Brandon Browner chooses the Patriots | ProFootballTalk

Here is the PFT article announcing the Patriots signed LaFell. Out of 113 comments, I only see 1 Spygate reference.

Report: Pats agree to terms with Brandon LaFell | ProFootballTalk

Yeah, 4 Spygate references out of 356 comments is really overwhelming. :rolleyes: That whole 1.1% number sure is a (to quote you) "huge percentage"....

Face it: Patriots fans keep this topic alive moreso than anyone else. Anytime someone makes a cough that sounds like the world "Spygate" this forum goes crazy.
 
Spygate... cheaters... asterisks... blah blah blah (had the relevant thing quoted, I thought, but I was mistaken)
I'd like to respond to this as well.

Why were the fines so severe? Because the uproar was so severe. People have this mistaken impression that the NFL is like the justice system: truth and fairness reign supreme. The NFL is a business, which intends to make money by pleasing their fans at all costs, so when a large enough contingent of those fans call for someone's head, they will get it regardless of the significance of the transgression.

If enough fans called for the head of Mike Tomlin, when he clearly tried to influence a play on the field physically, he would've been fined to the nines as well.


I'd like to clarify something with you, my fellow Pats fans, because I have always found this to be the simplest argument against the spygate nonsense. The rule implemented in 2006, right? We are absolutely sure about this? Because as long as that's true, it's easy enough to prove the ridiculousness of condemning a team for breaking a rule that did not exist at the relevant time.

People's perception (fans and media) definitely play a role in the reaction.

When the Saints were in the middle of the bounty scandal, another story came up that they may have been eavesdropping on the opponent's communications from the coaching booths to the sidelines. The day it broke, Bill Polian was on ESPN saying that it wouldn't provide much of an advantage, if any. That became the popular narrative with the story

At that point, we had been hearing for 5 years that filming hand signals made on the sideline in full view of the opposition were the key to the Patriots success. Somehow, though, listening in on private conversations between opposing coaches (not just playcalls, but injury information, general strategy, etc) wouldn't help a team at all. I listened to Mike & Mike the next day accept all that with barely a question.

The incident with Tomlin is another example. I think the perception of him is that he's a decent enough guy. So when he prevents an opposing team's kick returner from scoring a TD, people will believe his explanation that it was just an accident and a mistake on his part. Someone else may not get the same benefit.

Belichick can be portrayed as a great villain. So when he's caught doing something wrong, it's got be much worse than it looks.
 
Who cares what Steeler fans think?
Remember when we used to compete with them for AFC dominance? Like we used to compete with the Jets, and the Colts, and the Ravens?

Where are all of them now?

We're still here, competing with the newest AFC upstart, Denver.

Where is Pittsburgh?

With their crappy 6-10 team bleeding all their free agents to other teams from ridiculous cap mismanagement.

I care what Steeler fans think like I care what Jaguar fans think.

If I want the opinion of a Steeler fan on anything, the only thing I can think to ask is how getting slapped in the mouth with 55 points tastes.
 
Heaven forbid we let facts get in the way, but since you asked....

Here is the PFT article announcing the Patriots signed Revis. Out of 137 comments, there is only 1 single comment that makes a (veiled) reference to Spygate.

Report: Darrelle Revis agrees to one-year deal with Patriots | ProFootballTalk

Here is the PFT article announcing the Patriots signed Browner. Out of 106 comments, only 2 make veiled references to Spygate.

Brandon Browner chooses the Patriots | ProFootballTalk

Here is the PFT article announcing the Patriots signed LaFell. Out of 113 comments, I only see 1 Spygate reference.

Report: Pats agree to terms with Brandon LaFell | ProFootballTalk

Yeah, 4 Spygate references out of 356 comments is really overwhelming. :rolleyes: That whole 1.1% number sure is a (to quote you) "huge percentage"....

Face it: Patriots fans keep this topic alive moreso than anyone else. Anytime someone makes a cough that sounds like the world "Spygate" this forum goes crazy.

The lengths you will go to prove a point are astounding -as is your highly, highly suspect and very aggressive position in berating us for talking about Spygate in a Thread about an ex-NFL coach.... talking about Spygate.

The fact that Bill Cowher made these statements.. and later that that Mike Florio and PFT didn't think it worthy of an article is the reason we are having this discussion.

Unless there is some app that does it for you, you had to count those comments by hand and come back after getting to 400.

Ask anyone that reads PFT regularly, Spygate/cheating gets referenced much more than 4 times out of 400 comments there. And very very few of them are "veiled".

Your numbers are so far off, that I went back to investigate. I have to say they do a MUCH MUCH better job of retroactively moderating their forums than I gave them credit for. The last article I read was about 25% to 50% Spygate trolling comments.

But for now, let me just say that, in the article about Edleman for example. After moderating the Spygate/cheating references, they left in some of the Patriots reactions TO the trolls. Its pretty clear that those guys were reacting to something... and not just my "imagination".

So maybe its because I read these articles very quickly after they've been posted that I have to wade through all the trolling comments before their moderation has had a chance to catch up.

They do NOT number 4 out of 400 and they are NOT veiled.

I owe PFT a mental apology. I didnt think they moderated anything out at all but criticism for the writing.

The next fresh Patriot article that pops up that has some real meat to it (something that might suggest the Patriots are doing well in FA for example) I'll count the initial number of Spygate references that comes up.

And do you really want to take the position that this problem is simply over-sensitive Patriot fans and that the football world has long forgotten that this ever happened? And that the footballs of other teams are so classy they never reference it?

Next you will be telling me that the likes of Florio and Borges are actually very objective and professional in their reporting of all things Patriots and Bill Belichick.

And Im not sure why Im bothering, honestly, anyone that comes into a Thread clearly labelled as one talking about Spygate AND who starts in with such self-righteous condemnation of such a sensitive subject AND whose Avatar is one of literature's most spoiled, petulant and hated of villains, is obviously just trolling for reactions.

Enough said.
 
Of course I appreciate this on a fan level. But it will make no difference on public perception. People don't spew spygate nonsense to protect the integrity of the game. They latched onto it because they hate the Patriots and it warmed their little jealous bellies. They won't let this take away their excuse making.

This accounts for much of the bull-headed stupidity throughout the world including sports. It's why we are stuck in neutral in politics. We seem to love to hate--it's our most prized emotion. Everyone or thing we disagree with is EVIL and what we love and/or agree with is GOOD. I really think it's that simple and that stupid.
 
Guys, Spygare or Spygate is over and done. Who cares? Everyone needs to take Cowher's advice and get over it.
 
Guys, Spygare or Spygate is over and done. Who cares? Everyone needs to take Cowher's advice and get over it.

Cut! Turn a little more to the right. That's it. Okay, once again from the top:
 

Attachments

  • patsvideo2.jpg
    patsvideo2.jpg
    24.5 KB · Views: 83
... why continue with that practice? Especially on Jets turf. If the info he gleaned from it was minimal at best as he's stated in the past then why continue and risk being caught and punished? Is he really that arrogant or is there more than just normal information gathering going on? ...
Read BB's statement. He thought the rule (and the memo, which was a clarification of the minor rule about camera position) could be interpreted to allow sidelines taping. And I agree.
 
Read BB's statement. He thought the rule (and the memo, which was a clarification of the minor rule about camera position) could be interpreted to allow sidelines taping. And I agree.

BB is a very smart guy and his trouble is, he knows it. He has no respect for empty suit corporate tools like Goodell. His hubris in openly defying one of the new commissioner's first pronouncements caused the suit to over react to establish his authority and the Patriots org paid the price.
 
Read BB's statement. He thought the rule (and the memo, which was a clarification of the minor rule about camera position) could be interpreted to allow sidelines taping. And I agree.

Just want to say

:welcome:

Don't make us wait 3.5 years for post #2
 
SB39, go check out the PFT article about the Patriots and Talib/Spikes injuries. Most commented on the site, and I'd say more than 1.1 percent of those are about cheating. You'll see what we're talking about. Or you can just keep burying your head in the sand.
 
SB39, go check out the PFT article about the Patriots and Talib/Spikes injuries. Most commented on the site, and I'd say more than 1.1 percent of those are about cheating. You'll see what we're talking about. Or you can just keep burying your head in the sand.

these idiots on pft do realize every team manipulates the injury report. how naive are these rubes? they have to be being purposely this stupid, right?
 
Read BB's statement. He thought the rule (and the memo, which was a clarification of the minor rule about camera position) could be interpreted to allow sidelines taping. And I agree.

Spygate if you recall was comprised of 2 distinct chapters. Chapter 1 started in game 1 of the '07 season and was solely about the taping of defensive signals. It spanned about 3 months by the time the league investigated, released the tapes, punished the Patriots, and the resulting media firestorm that went on an on. But by end of November it had all died down, mainly because the Pats were killing everybody by 30 points without the cameras, so not many people were connecting the SB wins with the camera placement.

Chapter 2 occurred the weekend of that year's Super Bowl, when puke-face Tomase and his Herald editors ran the false story of the Pats filming the Rams practice the day before SB 36. What had been a pile of dying embers exploded into the biggest inferno probably in league history, happening right on SB weekend. This entirely separate type of incident, which if true would have been undeniable & blatant cheating, is what really turned the world on us and resurrected the initial camera issue, as you now had 2 independent incidents that basically corroborated each other.

Without the Herald garbage story, since discredited entirely, Spygate would never have had any legs past 2007. Plus I'm convinced it cost us that Super Bowl victory as well; the whole coaching staff was being interrogated by the league office throughout SB weekend, and you couldn't have created a bigger distraction for the players.

So I think seeing Spygate as about camera placement misses the real gist of why it lives on, which was the false Herald story of filming the Rams' practice. How anyone at the Herald who was connected with that debacle still has a job in this city is beyond me.
 
... which was the false Herald story of filming the Rams' practice. How anyone at the Herald who was connected with that debacle still has a job in this city is beyond me.

The fact that they continue to employ Ron Borges says everything you might hope not to know about their low standards or their integrity.
 
Spygate if you recall was comprised of 2 distinct chapters. Chapter 1 started in game 1 of the '07 season and was solely about the taping of defensive signals. It spanned about 3 months by the time the league investigated, released the tapes, punished the Patriots, and the resulting media firestorm that went on an on. But by end of November it had all died down, mainly because the Pats were killing everybody by 30 points without the cameras, so not many people were connecting the SB wins with the camera placement.

Chapter 2 occurred the weekend of that year's Super Bowl, when puke-face Tomase and his Herald editors ran the false story of the Pats filming the Rams practice the day before SB 36. What had been a pile of dying embers exploded into the biggest inferno probably in league history, happening right on SB weekend. This entirely separate type of incident, which if true would have been undeniable & blatant cheating, is what really turned the world on us and resurrected the initial camera issue, as you now had 2 independent incidents that basically corroborated each other.

Without the Herald garbage story, since discredited entirely, Spygate would never have had any legs past 2007. Plus I'm convinced it cost us that Super Bowl victory as well; the whole coaching staff was being interrogated by the league office throughout SB weekend, and you couldn't have created a bigger distraction for the players.

So I think seeing Spygate as about camera placement misses the real gist of why it lives on, which was the false Herald story of filming the Rams' practice. How anyone at the Herald who was connected with that debacle still has a job in this city is beyond me.

Nicely stated.

I'd also like to add that a certain senator and Eagles fan from PA grandstanding about this on Super Bowl weekend* also helped revive this topic.

*Goodell could have addressed Specter about this months earlier, with much less fanfare, but he chose to ignore Specter's initial and follow-up letters.
 
BB is a very smart guy and his trouble is, he knows it. He has no respect for empty suit corporate tools like Goodell. His hubris in openly defying one of the new commissioner's first pronouncements caused the suit to over react to establish his authority and the Patriots org paid the price.

I agree with everything you said... almost. We got one statement and one interview from the coach about this, and that's all we're ever likely to get (until maybe long after he's retired). He admitted he knew about the rule. He maintained he thought what they were doing was within the rules. It didn't help that Goodell called this a lie. It leaves fans, even Pats fans, thinking that BB was full of hubris, or that he lied and cheated. Not me.
 
I agree with everything you said... almost. We got one statement and one interview from the coach about this, and that's all we're ever likely to get (until maybe long after he's retired). He admitted he knew about the rule. He maintained he thought what they were doing was within the rules. It didn't help that Goodell called this a lie. It leaves fans, even Pats fans, thinking that BB was full of hubris, or that he lied and cheated. Not me.

In 2010, when the league had to defend itself against a frivolous lawsuit filed by a Jets fan, their attorney had this to say:

But [lawyer for the NFL, Shepard] Goldfein said everyone knows that NFL rules allow for teams to study the signals of opponents, and that the Patriots violated the rule by videotaping from the sidelines. But Goldfein also said the rule was subject to interpretation and that Belichick thought he was staying within the rule by simply not using the videotapes on the same day they were made.

When they had to explain their actions more fully, the league admitted that it was possible to have more than one interpretation of the rule and acknowledged that teams try to steal each other's signals. The entire article is here, but you need to create an ID to access it.
 
Rumor Mill | ProFootballTalk

I think this latest and most recent article from PFT clearly shows that it's not Patriot fans keeping the story alive.

Mike Florio has already reported about Talib's and Spike's allegations.

But now he wants to use his bully pulpit and this topic as an excuse to vilify the Patriots via dredging up Spygate all over again -even going so far as to insinuate that Belichick is blackmailing the NFL should they ever mess with him again.

Filing injury reports in such a way as to protect their players is worthy of multiple articles to Florio, but an ex-NFL coach minimizing the impact of Spygate is not.

That is at best an agenda and at worst, petty hate-mongering hackery.


Compare Florio's article to this one written by Mike Reiss.

http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-...60509/undeserved-hit-on-pats-injury-reporting
 
Rumor Mill | ProFootballTalk

I think this latest and most recent article from PFT clearly shows that it's not Patriot fans keeping the story alive.

Mike Florio has already reported about Talib's and Spike's allegations.

But now he wants to use his bully pulpit and this topic as an excuse to vilify the Patriots via dredging up Spygate all over again -even going so far as to insinuate that Belichick is blackmailing the NFL should they ever mess with him again.

Filing injury reports in such a way as to protect their players is worthy of multiple articles to Florio, but an ex-NFL coach minimizing the impact of Spygate is not.

That is at best an agenda and at worst, petty hate-mongering hackery.


Compare Florio's article to this one written by Mike Reiss.

Undeserved hit on Pats' injury reporting - New England Patriots Blog - ESPN Boston

At least Florio admitted that there is a possibility that the league destroyed the tapes because they showed clear evidence of cheating - by other teams. To me, that is the only logical reason they would destroy the tapes to cover something up. If Belichick had evidence of the Pats cheating in other ways, there is no way he would turn it over.

I just don't care.

Mike Reiss did an article today talking about how the Talib and Spikes allegations are much ado about nothing.

But let's move on from Spygate already. Florio will never let it go, but we can.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.


Patriots Kraft ‘Involved’ In Decision Making?  Zolak Says That’s Not the Case
MORSE: Final First Round Patriots Mock Draft
Slow Starts: Stark Contrast as Patriots Ponder Which Top QB To Draft
Wednesday Patriots Notebook 4/24: News and Notes
Tuesday Patriots Notebook 4/23: News and Notes
MORSE: Final 7 Round Patriots Mock Draft, Matthew Slater News
Bruschi’s Proudest Moment: Former LB Speaks to MusketFire’s Marshall in Recent Interview
Monday Patriots Notebook 4/22: News and Notes
Patriots News 4-21, Kraft-Belichick, A.J. Brown Trade?
MORSE: Patriots Draft Needs and Draft Related Info
Back
Top