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O yee of Little Faith (or Analysis)


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So nothing matters aside from cumulative points scored. An 8-8 team that scored 75 in every win and 10 in every loss would be your idea of the best offense ever. If the Patriots had piled on more points on top of the ones needed to win all 16 games, in your mind those meaningless points would make them a better offense.

Oh and by the way, since the Patriots have scored more points since the middle of the season than the Broncos, does that mean the Patriots have become a better offense than the Broncos or are you only allowed to look at statistics that say what you like?

I didn't cherry picked anything, the regular season is over.Since they scored more points in the regular season, the experts consider them greater and i agree


It does when you compare it to 13-3 with no SB.
It does when you are limiting your discussion to the regular season.


So we didn't deserve our 12 wins, we were fortunate?
We shoudn't be in the AFCCG because we didn't earn the win we had over the Colts? Who deserves to be here instead. What team that has gone home gets your nod as deserving to be here instead of us?

We were fortunate to win against Cleveland, the Saints, the broncos at home barely,we couldn't do the same on the road at the Dolphins, Jets,Panthers, Bengals.Our next game will be at the Broncos without Rob, i can't be that crazy to think things are no looking good right now.




we have enough talent to be here. we have enough talent to already have beaten the Broncos once. That must have been painful to you.

without Rob :bricks:



We have the 7th best road record in the NFL and 2 of the losses were due to extremely dubious calls. 6-2 is an excellent road record. So are you saying that if the refs had not made the calls that many felt were egregiously wrong, then we would win this week?

By the way, which deficiencies do you think are going to 'catch up with us' and cause us to lose to your Broncos this week?

So your saying we won't miss Rob,Mayo and all our injuries in a hostile environment, Denver doesn't really have the best offense of all time.Our road record against winning teams is nothing to worry about.Peyton Manning will throw away the game of his career at home.
 
Seems to me like there's a lot of cherry-picking on both sides, and inconsistency in the relative value of stats (in the overall argument, though perhaps not by the same person.)

I also think there's a lot of over-valuing of past players for being part of Super Bowl winning teams -- a mistake that lead many NFL GMs to regret over-paying role-players who never amounted to much outside the Patriots organization. Also, many of us are judging players in hindsight based on who they would become, rather than who they were then.

Hell, in 2001 our quarterback was a QB playing in the 15th game in his career, and our left tackle was a rookie considered a reach in the 2nd round, whom half of Patriots fans thought should be benched in favor of Drew Bledsoe.

In 2003, we had rookie Eugene Wilson at free safety, and a hobbled 35 year-old journeyman Roman Phifer. David Patten was on his 3rd team in as many years, and had never caught more than 38 passes in his career.

In 2004, we lost starting corners Ty Law and Tyrone Pooke, and replaced them with Asante Samuel, a 2nd year player projected spend his career in the slot, and Randal Gay, an undrafted rookie. Earthwind Moreland, Je'Rod Cherry and Hank Poteat were playing meaningful snaps in the post-season. Our right tackles was perennial turnstile Brandon Gorin.

Finally, the fact that we know how things turned out makes us forget details and skew our perceptions. Games were lower scoring, and passing numbers a whole lot less gaudy, making our defenses seem better than, and the 2001 Rams seem less impressive than the 2013 Broncos.

Also in 2001, the Rams had a top-ranked defense in addition to their record-setting offense, and in the AFC championship game, the Patriots had just barely eked out a controversial win thanks to the then-unheard of "tuck rule" and two long field-goals in the snow.

In 2003, we had the 30th ranked running game in yards per carry. Our passing game was derided as "dink n' dunk."

In 2004, with our 2ndary shredded over the course of the season, we were considered far bigger underdogs to Manning's offensive-record-setting Colts than we are to Manning's Broncos this year, and in the AFC Championship, we were playing a 17-1 team that had blown us out in the regular season.

So yeah, I don't think it's at all crazy to compare this team favorably to any of our SB teams. There are a lot of reasons to think that, should it go on to win the super bowl, and should our young players turn out to be future stars, it will look even rosier in hindsight.

Ultimately a team is not about who is on it, or how people rate it, it is about what it accomplishes.
This team can do no more than get to and win a SB. It could have done no more, short of gaining the #1 seed, up until today. Everything up until now was to get to this game and whatever the path was is irrelevant at kickoff.
Sunday will determine which of these teams is better. (Better by the definition used by the NFL is who advances further in the post season, becuase that is why they play the games). If the Patriots win then they have had essentially a perfect season up to the result of the SB because regardless of whether they walk in to the SB at 7-9 or 16-0 they achieved 100% of the goal to that point. 7 other Patriot teams have and 3 of them finished the job.
 
I didn't cherry picked anything, the regular season is over.Since they scored more points in the regular season, the experts consider them greater and i agree
I didnt say you cherry picked. I asked you if points scored is all that matters doesnt that mean the Patriots became a better offense than the Broncos in the second half of the season?


We were fortunate to win against Cleveland, the Saints, the broncos at home barely,we couldn't do the same on the road at the Dolphins, Jets,Panthers, Bengals.Our next game will be at the Broncos without Rob, i can't be that crazy to think things are no looking good right now.
So all close wins are luck?


without Rob
And in the past 2 seasons we are 12-4 without Gronk. We are 14-5 with Gronk.
To pretend he is the whole team is ridiculous.





So your saying we won't miss Rob,Mayo and all our injuries in a hostile environment, Denver doesn't really have the best offense of all time.Our road record against winning teams is nothing to worry about.Peyton Manning will throw away the game of his career at home.

We would be better with the injured guys not better, but we are a damn good team even without them.
No Denver does not have the best offense of all time. And it wasn't very good against us last game. Without the benefit of turnovers they were average at best.
Our record against winning teams is about what most playoff teams are. We are 3-2 Denver is 5-3, but 3-2 not counting 9-7 SD so its about even.
Peyton Manning has a habit of coming up short in big games. He has a losing record in the playoffs.
How is this the biggest game of his career?
 
!!!ProTip!!!​

In the nfl a team is comprised of two things, offense and defense

16-0 in a regular season had never been done before, and has not been done since. 16-0 was deferred by the 2009 colts, they could have done it if the wanted to

Scoring records, and individual stat records have been dropping like flies as the nfl continues to move towards a high offense setup.

If you dont understand why that makes 16-0 more impressive then scoring the most points in league history(breaking a record that's merely a few years old) then this discussion is a lost cause.

16-0 is better then 13-3 people will always remember when the patriots went 16-0, 10 years from now nobody will even care how many points the broncos scored this season because that number is likely to be shattered next year.
Must be why they refuse to take down that disgraceful 16-0 banner.
 
David Patten was a big part of the 2001 Pats Championship team and was hurt in 2003. He had 112 catches for 1573 yards and 9 td catches between 2001 & 2002. So 2003 was his THIRD YEAR with the PATS.

Dude that was like interupting Belushi and telling him the Germans didn't bomb Pearl Harbor.
 
The Broncos are as injured as we are. You keep ignoring that.
We scored more points than them in the second half of the season. You keep ignoring that.
They allowed almost 4 ppg more than we did. You seem to be ignoring that.

Meh.. they're missing a few player on defense, the offense remains intact. On the other hand we're in worst shape on both side, far worst.
 
Must be why they refuse to take down that disgraceful 16-0 banner.

I notice you added a little line about the colts "could have" gone 16-0

A lot of things COULD happen, the fact that they don't is a helluv a thing.

The patriots COULD have won everychampionship since football became a sport.

see i can do could haves too.

The patriots could have scored more points this season then the colts, they just chose not to.

WOW this is easy.

You could have made an intelligent post.

hmm maybe that one is a little out there.
 
Meh.. they're missing a few player on defense, the offense remains intact. On the other hand we're in worst shape on both side, far worst.

our defense is better now then the first time we played them,

Thier offense is about the same.

Last game we spotted them 21 points via turnovers on the first 3-4 drives.

Our offense is missing gronk but gained a power running attack that the broncos wont be able to stop.

This isn't going to be some blowout that you are making it out to be. the patriots should do what they did in the second half of last game, win.
 
Many Pats Fans seem to have subscribed to a form of Depression that we can't field a complete game breaking Pass Offense, so we have no chance.

You are spoiled. You never had that in the Superbowl winning years... Nor a #1 Defense either!

I think he Pats are much stronger today the then, or even the day the Broncos fell earlier this year.

A true NT, Siliga has entered the situation, and the Bronks won't be as productive in the run-a-dope. Siliga wasn't there in the last game. Undersized Verano and Jones were blown off the LOS, while Spikes was limping about. Neither Hightower nor Collins had found themselves back then, either.

The Bronks may even ignore the run invitation, being suspicious, making the Pass Defense even better, at no cost. Manning may be afraid to look a gift horse in the mouth, after the last trap game, offering the run.

The Pats secondary is both now deep and more important, now healthy. That wasn't true last time.

This is looking to me, more and more like a replay of the "The Greatest Show on Turf" game, of some fame. The Pats can actually match up with competent DBs against ALL of Manning's weapons, just like they did to Warner's. Bob Kraft even remarked that he felt that way, too.

Most teams don't have a prayer of doing so, before they have to employ DB scrubs, which then get toasted. Most teams simply don't have the secondary depth, That is Belichick's secret weapon, his 40-53 roster quality, and always has been.

Our present WR corps of Edelman, Amendola, Collie and Vereen (and probably Tompkins and possibly Dobson) is bigger and better than the tiny Brown, Branch, Patten, and Faulk. I'll take Blount, Ridley, Vareen over Antowain, Redmond, and Faulk too, by a country mile.

Today's Pats lines, both the Offensive and the Defensive are much better too.

We fondly remember Seymour and Willie, but it's this DL, that has accumulated more sacks than any in Belichick's history or Petey's, or Tuna's regimes, going all the way back to Raymond Berry's "Squish the Phish" season, 34 years ago.

You don't need a #1 Offense to win a Superbowl or three.
The Patriots were no where near such rarified stature then. Our #3 Offense this year, is better than any we had back then.

The Patriots dominated for several years with a dink and dunk passing game in combination with a fairly good running game. We are much better than that now, as the power run game is much better.

It's going to be delicious and delightful to Upend all the mediot analyst's prognostications, once more. Jump back on the Bandwagon...

That's a rad post.

we will fight!

as a TEAM

we will destroy

60 minutes bITC%^^!

Old School Beats Public Enemy - Public Enemy No 1 - YouTube

defense

offense

special teams....just like voltron

thanks for listening;)


p.s.
yo defense.....here's a warning....get your ass ready

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lb0HImG_MU&list=PL50EF6AAFEFCA2CF5
 
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Meh.. they're missing a few player on defense, the offense remains intact. On the other hand we're in worst shape on both side, far worst.

As stated in another post, I am not saying one team is worse off then the other but Denver (especially the defense) has had it's fair share of injuries this season. On the offensive side, the biggest injury is obviously Clady...

Denver Defensive Starter Injuries:
- Derek Wolfe // Starting DT - IR
- Chris Harris // Starting DB - IR
- Rahim Moore // Starting S - IR
- Kevin Vickerson // Starting DT - IR
- Von Miller // Starting DE - IR

Denver Offensive Starter Injuries:
- Dan Koppen // Starting C - IR
- J.D. Walton // Starting C - IR
- Ryan Clady // Starting T - IR
 
Meh.. they're missing a few player on defense, the offense remains intact. On the other hand we're in worst shape on both side, far worst.

They are missing as many players as we are. I gave the breakdown earlier.
I guess having their 2 best defensive players out means nothing to you because they dont generate offensive statistics and that is all that matters.
 
our defense is better now then the first time we played them,

Thier offense is about the same.

Last game we spotted them 21 points via turnovers on the first 3-4 drives.

Our offense is missing gronk but gained a power running attack that the broncos wont be able to stop.

This isn't going to be some blowout that you are making it out to be. the patriots should do what they did in the second half of last game, win.

Their offense has not played nearly as well since that game as it did before, and Welker is not right. He is a very important piece of their offense.
 
Must be why they refuse to take down that disgraceful 16-0 banner.

Somebody else asked and you never answered, who is your favorite team?
 
I notice you added a little line about the colts "could have" gone 16-0...i mean they pull out there players,they weren't interested clearly.

A lot of things COULD happen, the fact that they don't is a helluv a thing.

The patriots COULD have won everychampionship since football became a sport.

see i can do could haves too.

The patriots could have scored more points this season then the colts, they just chose not to. i hope your joking

WOW this is easy.

You could have made an intelligent post.

hmm maybe that one is a little out there.

Nothing wrong with my post, you could stop protecting a record that has no meaning without a championship and other fans actually make fun of. You could stop saying other post are not intelligent while pretending to be intelligent.
 
Nothing wrong with my post, you could stop protecting a record that has no meaning without a championship and other fans actually make fun of. You could stop saying other post are not intelligent while pretending to be intelligent.

What an absolutely moronic post. If you extrapolate it rationally, there's only one stat that has any meaning at all, and that's SB wins, because season record is obviously something very meaningful in the course of seasons and history in order to set up the SB contestants, so it's about as meaningful a stat as any non-SB, non-playoff wins stat can be.

You've now got nothing to talk about and can go troll some other board. Again, what's your favorite team? Maybe their boards will be happy to have you.
 
Nothing wrong with my post, you could stop protecting a record that has no meaning without a championship and other fans actually make fun of. You could stop saying other post are not intelligent while pretending to be intelligent.

Right because 13-3 with more points is better than 16-0 with less points.:rolleyes:
 
What an absolutely moronic post. If you extrapolate it rationally, there's only one stat that has any meaning at all, and that's SB wins, because season record is obviously something very meaningful in the course of seasons and history. lmao

You've got nothing to talk about and can go troll some other board. Again, what's your favorite team? Maybe their boards will be happy to have you.
if i have nothing to say then stop replying.you don't like my post ignore it, i challenge you not to reply anymore....and to answer your question,yes i like the pats that doesn't mean i have to pick them all the time.
 
if i have nothing to say then stop replying.you don't like my post ignore it, i challenge you not to reply anymore....and to answer your question,yes i like the pats that doesn't mean i have to pick them all the time.

1.) I've obviously had something to say in reply to your posts.

2.) Go back and actually take the time to read your posts in this thread. You'll find that they're nothing but troll posts. You may not have intended them that way, but that's clearly what they are.

Must be why they refuse to take down that disgraceful 16-0 banner.

is obviously ridiculous and trollish, for example.


I'm not one to pound on people just because they have an issue with the team. You've gone way, way past that though, just like the O.P. went way past reasonable optimism in his posts. With the two of you, we've basically seen the irrational extremes of +/- fan posting in this thread.
 
I will be shocked if Denver doesn't win.All the stars have aligned just for them, they're just healthier. The better team will win and Denver has the better team, in fact we're the worst team left standing in the postseason. The only bright side is we won't be losing another Super Bowl . I remember when we lost in 2010, the jets said they knew they were better because all they had to do is compare rosters .

I agree that Denver has the more talented roster, especially on offense but there's something "special" about this team. I don't know if its chemistry, toughness, or something else but they do have a quality that reminds me of 2001. While I agree with most here that the OP's stance is way over the top, he's not completely wrong to be excited either. Despite Denver having the better roster on paper, there is a part of me that is very confident that we're going to win this game.....And I'm not just talking about Brady love. I think my confidence has more to do with the style of football this team plays. This, more or less, is the same style we employed in our SB winning years and its also the same style the Giants used to beat us in our Super Bowl losses. At the end of the day, I think we match up well with the Broncos especially now that they're missing their best pass rusher and cover corner. They're ripe for the pick'n.
 
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