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Ridley Fumbles - Let's not let facts get in the way


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I remember making a thread about this and I was shunned.

Hate to say it but I told you so. i love the kid but he fumbles way too much for me

Indeed.
What have you done OP? What have you done to this poor kid?
You've invited nothing but pain and anguish.

-Jamman
 
Regardless of the stats, Ridley has consistently shown bad form in ball handling even when he doesn't fumble. Todays fumble was another very bad one. I wouldn't be opposed to it being his last carry as a Pat.
 
I am of the opinion that his time here in New England is up unless there are injuries.

Fumbles have ruined many a career here in the NFL. If you can't hold onto the ball, you can't make it in this league no matter how many yards you can get.
 
Regardless of the stats, Ridley has consistently shown bad form in ball handling even when he doesn't fumble. Todays fumble was another very bad one. I wouldn't be opposed to it being his last carry as a Pat.

I agree it's very frustrating, but he's young and it's only his second year as a professional. This IS a correctable problem that is almost 100% about simple concentration and mental discipline. I have to believe that they wouldn't have drafted him unless they felt he could be coached-up.

Although right now it might appear like he'll never "get it", give him another year working with Fears and BB. Just don't expect him to be a feature back, especially this early in his career.
 
He's in the lead or tied for the lead in fumbles this season.

That sums it up right there. A two-down back with zero versatility in the passing game who isn't a three-down player isn't worth the trouble as a feature back. Time to move on.
 
He's in the lead or tied for the lead in fumbles this season.

That sums it up right there. A two-down back with zero versatility in the passing game who isn't a three-down player isn't worth the trouble as a feature back. Time to move on.

I can't disagree with that, but I would hate to see the team give up on him too early. Bench him next week; no doubt. Limit his touches for now on. Let him be a garbage time back. But he is great on his feet. The hands/arms thing can change over time. I wouldn't move him off the roster, even though I blame him for a lot of the Patriots recent big game failings.
 
Ridley is a really talented back, and last year I wouldn't say that he had a fumble problem. He was around average. But this year he has had a really bad year of fumbles. He needs to secure the ball when he goes through the line.

I really, really like Ridley. He is the by far best running back that we have had here for a long time. But he needs to secure the ball better when he goes through the line.
 
I agree it's very frustrating, but he's young and it's only his second year as a professional. This IS a correctable problem that is almost 100% about simple concentration and mental discipline. I have to believe that they wouldn't have drafted him unless they felt he could be coached-up.

Although right now it might appear like he'll never "get it", give him another year working with Fears and BB. Just don't expect him to be a feature back, especially this early in his career.

He's a third year player.
 
He had his chances he cannot be trusted it doesn't matter how good you are if you continue to cough up the football. Riddley is really overrated around here when in reality he a above average RB who fumbles alot. I have seen enough and hope BB has too.
 
Stevan Ridley will not be on the Patriots next year. That is my prediction. They will trade him for a 2nd or 3rd round pick, or maybe even a WR.
 
Stevan Ridley will not be on the Patriots next year. That is my prediction. They will trade him for a 2nd or 3rd round pick, or maybe even a WR.

Maybe a 3rd nobody is giving us a 2nd for him...he's a limited 2 down RB only.
 
Stevan Ridley will not be on the Patriots next year. That is my prediction. They will trade him for a 2nd or 3rd round pick, or maybe even a WR.

He makes $777,750 in 2014. He has no trade value. Only idiots (see Jim Irsay) trades high draft picks for RBs.
 
I can't disagree with that, but I would hate to see the team give up on him too early. Bench him next week; no doubt. Limit his touches for now on. Let him be a garbage time back. But he is great on his feet. The hands/arms thing can change over time. I wouldn't move him off the roster, even though I blame him for a lot of the Patriots recent big game failings.
My thoughts exactly.

When I say to move on from him, I don't mean to move on in the sense of cutting the guy or permanently benching him. Just to move on from the idea of him being the featured back on the team.

I've never been really all that impressed with him as a complete football player. His fumbles are a big part of that, but also, he's somewhat overrated. It doesn't make much sense to keep featuring a guy you can't trust. He's hurting the team more than helping.

Vereen is the more complete player, and Bolden offers more as a passing back too. Blount fumbling and subsequently getting benched exasperated the situation even more. Either way, Ridley should not be the lead dog going forward until he proves he can secure the football consistently. I just don't think he ever truly will.
 
Either way, Ridley should not be the lead dog going forward until he proves he can secure the football consistently. I just don't think he ever truly will.

I don't tend to disagree with you too often Ozy, but in this case I do.

I feel that Stevan Ridley is definitely still the best choice in RB's and that he has the best overall talent. No one else can run with the same sense of quickness, power, shiftiness etc.

Vereen, while very good in space and at receiving/taking advantage of LB mismatches, just doesn't have the same power, Blount doesn't have many of those measurables aside from being able to run over people (at a much slower rate) downhill, and Bolden just doesn't have the same talent level, period. Bolden can't make people miss, he can't use those quick burts, nor can he squirt through holes that aren't there on a consistent enough basis. Ridley offers our best choice at the overall package, which is exactly why he has been our RB1 this whole time.

Unfortunately, the fumbles in 3 straight games make this decision very tough for Belichick, and I'm guessing that he sits for another game or so. After that though, I think he should get another shot for our last month + playoff stretch. We aren't in a position to give up on him totally, although he's definitely not a lock to be retained come Feb 2015 either.

Put it this way---don't you think he'd have improved our chances at winning SB46 pretty significantly? I certainly do. Again...the fumbles are a big knock, and the fact that they have happened in 3 straight games make this a really tough decision that deserves reflection and punishment (so to speak). I just don't feel that we have any other RB who has the same level of overall/all around skills that Ridley has. If he were ever able to figure this problem out, he could be one of the top 8-10 RB's in the entire league.
 
He makes $777,750 in 2014. He has no trade value. Only idiots (see Jim Irsay) trades high draft picks for RBs.

The way that the majority of fans tend to overrate the NFL system of trade value/compensation cracks me up.

Just about every single player on our team commands a 2nd or 3rd round pick on all 31 teams, at least in some poster's minds.

The fact is that there are a small select few players in the NFL (probably 40-50 or less) who would command a 2nd round draft pick, and Stevan Ridley is definitely NOT one of them. On top of that, he's under contract on the cheap here throughout 2014, so we will most likely be taking full advantage of that.

Now...whether or not he comes back in 2015 is a different story altogether, but he is definitely worth his 700k salary at the moment--even if only for a depth role (if that is what Belichick ultimately decides and the fumbles continue).
 
What are people calling for Vereen / Bolden to get Ridley's touches going to say when one of them coughs a ball up over the next few weeks? Hopefully no one says Blount because I'm pretty sure he showed last night why he has a worst fumbles per carry than Ridley.

Also, Ridley will be on this team next year. People are just overreacting (which never happens with NE sports fans). He has a very cheap contract and has shown the talent to be a 1400yd-plus back.
 
I don't tend to disagree with you too often Ozy, but in this case I do.

I feel that Stevan Ridley is definitely still the best choice in RB's and that he has the best overall talent. No one else can run with the same sense of quickness, power, shiftiness etc.

Vereen, while very good in space and at receiving/taking advantage of LB mismatches, just doesn't have the same power, Blount doesn't have many of those measurables aside from being able to run over people (at a much slower rate) downhill, and Bolden just doesn't have the same talent level, period. Bolden can't make people miss, he can't use those quick burts, nor can he squirt through holes that aren't there on a consistent enough basis. Ridley offers our best choice at the overall package, which is exactly why he has been our RB1 this whole time.

Unfortunately, the fumbles in 3 straight games make this decision very tough for Belichick, and I'm guessing that he sits for another game or so. After that though, I think he should get another shot for our last month + playoff stretch. We aren't in a position to give up on him totally, although he's definitely not a lock to be retained come Feb 2015 either.

Put it this way---don't you think he'd have improved our chances at winning SB46 pretty significantly? I certainly do. Again...the fumbles are a big knock, and the fact that they have happened in 3 straight games make this a really tough decision that deserves reflection and punishment (so to speak). I just don't feel that we have any other RB who has the same level of overall/all around skills that Ridley has. If he were ever able to figure this problem out, he could be one of the top 8-10 RB's in the entire league.
There's no question Ridley is the best pure runner on the team. His vision and acceleration to the hole are second to none on the team.

Beyond that though, he's just that. A pure runner. He doesn't offer much in the passing game and isn't a three down player. So that caps his versatility quite a bit. In addition to this deficiency, is the fumbling. Is his skills really worth it for all of the turnovers, especially those backbreaking ones that have been occurring as of late? I don't think they are.

Not saying he can be easily replaced (especially in the no huddle/hurry-up where he's at his best), but the turnovers are a huge issue. I'm just not sure that they are worth it. He can't be trusted.

As for being top 8-10 RBs in the league. I don't agree with that. A lot of players in the NFL would be statistical monsters here too. He plays in a favorable situation for a rusher, with an elite QB under center. Teams plays the Patriots differently than they do a team like Minnesota. Ridley has been the beneficiary of that.

We know this is the case because a far lesser talent in BJGE put up similar stats to Ridley in their best respective season here, in terms of YPC and TDs. If BJGE had as much carries as Ridley did, he may have put up 1200+ yards too. Does that mean he's a top 10 RB? Not a chance in hell. But, playing in a great system allowed him to put up greater stats than his skillset would suggest he'd be able to.

Heck, even look at Knowshon Moreno - he had a monster game tonight, but quite frankly he sucks. Put it him on a team like the Vikings where he'd actually have to run against 8 or 9 men boxes and he wouldn't even garner a quarter of AD's production. Playing with Manning is why he's having a big season with how teams are defending them.

Ridley's has been in a timeshare for a reason this season. People can speculate on a variety of reasons, but for me, I think it's pretty clear that coaching staff is running out of patience with his ball security issues. I am too. The positives don't outweigh the negatives in my book.

He should be a strict specialist in certain offensive packages. He's at his best in the hurry-up, so the that should be where he gets the most of his opportunities. It's all about maximizing strengths and minimizing weaknesses. Ball security is a weakness - it needs to be minimized.
 
Vereen is not taking Ridley's reps..Bolden and Blount will though. I guess BB has to use him the rest of the season, but his ball security awareness LOOKS likje it's non existent. I saw his fumble very clearly as thousands of others did I'm sure. Real bad play given the circumstances. He used a spin move into the line. THat ball had to go ten feet up in the air.
 
There are, indisputably, at least three kinds of causes for fumbles:

  • Bad technique.
  • Bad/unlucky field vision. (This applies especially to strip sacks of QBs, but can also apply to ball carriers.)
  • Hellacious hits.
I'd raise the number further, by saying there are different circumstances for technique, the extremes being when you're trying to push through a pile and when you're trying to juke somebody in the open field.


What I can't accept from Ridley is poor technique when he's plowing through heavy traffic. My first thought for the coaches is to do whatever it takes -- including intimidation-through-benching -- to correct that, while groaning and bearing it if he fumbles in more open-field kinds of situations.


My reasoning behind that is that wrapping up the ball up tightly presumably takes him out of his preferred posture and balance; otherwise he wouldn't use bad technique in the first place. And there's less cost from that disadvantage when he's plowing through a melee than when he's running in the almost-clear.
 
There's no question Ridley is the best pure runner on the team. His vision and acceleration to the hole are second to none on the team.

Beyond that though, he's just that. A pure runner. He doesn't offer much in the passing game and isn't a three down player. So that caps his versatility quite a bit. In addition to this deficiency, is the fumbling. Is his skills really worth it for all of the turnovers, especially those backbreaking ones that have been occurring as of late? I don't think they are.

Not saying he can be easily replaced (especially in the no huddle/hurry-up where he's at his best), but the turnovers are a huge issue. I'm just not sure that they are worth it. He can't be trusted.

As for being top 8-10 RBs in the league. I don't agree with that. A lot of players in the NFL would be statistical monsters here too. He plays in a favorable situation for a rusher, with an elite QB under center. Teams plays the Patriots differently than they do a team like Minnesota. Ridley has been the beneficiary of that.

We know this is the case because a far lesser talent in BJGE put up similar stats to Ridley in their best respective season here, in terms of YPC and TDs. If BJGE had as much carries as Ridley did, he may have put up 1200+ yards too. Does that mean he's a top 10 RB? Not a chance in hell. But, playing in a great system allowed him to put up greater stats than his skillset would suggest he'd be able to.

Heck, even look at Knowshon Moreno - he had a monster game tonight, but quite frankly he sucks. Put it him on a team like the Vikings where he'd actually have to run against 8 or 9 men boxes and he wouldn't even garner a quarter of AD's production. Playing with Manning is why he's having a big season with how teams are defending them.

Ridley's has been in a timeshare for a reason this season. People can speculate on a variety of reasons, but for me, I think it's pretty clear that coaching staff is running out of patience with his ball security issues. I am too. The positives don't outweigh the negatives in my book.

He should be a strict specialist in certain offensive packages. He's at his best in the hurry-up, so the that should be where he gets the most of his opportunities. It's all about maximizing strengths and minimizing weaknesses. Ball security is a weakness - it needs to be minimized.

The potential to be a top 10 RB (without the fumbling issues) may have been a stretch, but I'd still have to stick with top 15. I do understand that an offense like ours opens up the run, but I still think he's a good RB when he isn't fumbling. Personally, I think he offers much more than a guy like BJGE myself, although BJGE was fine in his role here even with more limited talent--because he kept the ball in his arms.

As far as being used in a RBBC system, sure--you're right, he was; but he was still "the" main back in that RBBC system at the same time. That likely won't be the case moving forward, at least not for the next game or two. I do hope that he gets another chance though, as I still think that he's our best pure running back. There's always the chance that Vereen can get the job done too, especially if the pass opens up the run more or when certain oppositional defenses provide that kind of opportunity.

If it were up to me, I'd sit Ridley on the bench for the next game or so; but after that I would give him one last chance for the season. We've seen fumbling problems corrected before with guys like Faulk. I'm not sure if Ridley's can be fixed and what the specifics are/were in comparison of the 2 examples, but I'd like to see him get another chance.

If worst comes to worst, then I'd at least like to see him still get reps--maybe in the role that Blount was playing lately in the second half with a lead or at least in garbage time. One way or another, he should still get looks, even if the setting and situation are changed at first.
 
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