Fan of Josh McDaniel’s I am not…

I expect most to disagree with me here on this one but I personally I am not a fan of Josh McDaniel’s, nobody has been a bigger beneficiary of the “Brady Affect” then McDaniel’s.

These are some the primary reasons I am not a charter member of the Josh McDaniel’s fan club:

1. Personnel decisions; Greg Salas, Spencer Larsen, Brandon Lloyd, Daniel Fells and even Michael Hoomanawanui have all been less than stellar additions to the squad.
2. Undervaluing Wes Welker; rightfully so or not I place much of the blame for Welker not being here on McDaniel’s, and I must assume that it was Josh who lobbied for the often injured Danny Amendola.
3. The use of personnel; I am very tired of seeing players like Blount and Develin on the football field, while players like Ridley and Bolden pace the sidelines.
4. Locking into JAG types; he attempts to will these subpar players to productivity by giving them snaps and opportunities that should be going to a better player.
5. Lack of an offensive identity; the offense looks confused it has for 2 seasons now, are we a trying to be a power running team, a spread offense or a vertical offense, currently it looks more like a 13 year olds custom playbook in Madden 25.
6. Play calling; I find myself saying what was that an awful lot.

Many align McDaniel’s with 2007’s record breaking performance and ignore the fact he fielded an offense consisting of a 28 year old Brady, Randy Moss, Wes Welker and Donte Stallworth. We have never won a Super Bowl with McDaniel’s as the offensive coordinator and we’ve only made it to one his two tenures at the helm combined.

If you remove 2007 in which Brady had more offensive talent around him than any other season, Brady had more productive seasons with O’Brien in which he average more passing yards, touchdowns, yards per pass, a higher quarterback rating and less interceptions.

It is my position that McDaniel’s rode Brady’s coattails to a head coaching job at which he failed and now he is back riding them again, as I said I do not expect this to be a popular opinion so feel free to express your disagreement but I would appreciate it if you can do so in a respectful and courteous manner.

Aside from not understanding why he chose not to run the ball against Cincy I kindof look at McDaniels as getting a big incomplete

In fact, given the available personnell due to injuries alone I'm inclined to give McDaniels a higher grade rather than lower. He (and obviously Brady and the team) have eeked out 5 wins with a less than all star offense. Beyond that it's difficult to know how much is play calling and how much is exectution by the team (and Brady himself has had a lot of what look like bad throws too)

But I know the guy is far from perfect and I think questions about how well prepared the team was personnel wise going into this season is a valid one.

You're a fan.

You are supposed to react this way after a great win.

Brady6 said:

If you remove 2007 in which Brady had more offensive talent around him than any other season, Brady had more productive seasons with O’Brien in which he average more passing yards, touchdowns, yards per pass, a higher quarterback rating and less interceptions.

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Just so we're clear, you're discounting the best year under McDaniels but counting the years that BB gave McDaniels little to work with in terms of the pass game (2006, 2013) and the Matt Cassell season. On the other hand, having discounted 2007 because of the offensive weapons, you credit Bill O'Brien even though he had mostly the same weapons and also benefited from the being given Gronk and AHern.

Actually.... I agree with pretty much everything you said. I feel that McDaniels is more about finesse and outwitting the defense than he is about establishing toughness and a sense of identity for this young offense. Ultimately we as fans all just want to win, granted... I would however like to see the Pats play the game on offense where they are physical, imposing, intimidating and play with attitude. I've never been a fan of 3 yd passes and complex passing schemes that end up being risky at best sometimes (Last week?). With the personnel the Pats have right now I'd love to see them play smash mouth, which isn't going to happen with McDaniels.

Is McDaniel’s also a moderator on this site part time…:lol:


Just curious why this was moved to the practice squad within 20 minutes? Considering that those who posted in the thread did not express adamant disagreement, nearly instantaneous move seems rather odd to me.

manxman2601 said:

Would like to see your numbers on this.

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Just look at his stats – Brady has had 3 seasons in which he had a quarterback rating of 100 or higher; 2007 with McDaniel’s as the coordinator; 2010 and 2011 with O’Brien as the coordinator.

I think you are blaming McDaniels for things he cant control.

Welker was leaving the Pats. It wasn't a question of McDaniels undervaluing him. I think most reports make it clear Welker wanted out. Welker's interview talks about BB as his reason for leaving. I am really not blaming anyone for him leaving. Certainly not McDaniels

I feel the play calling was fairly solid in the game. An overthrow on Amedola that should have been a touchdown. A few drops by Dobson. A bad force throw by Brady at the end. There were many missed oppurtunities where he made the right play call. No one is really to blame anyways, McDaniels has to learn these players as much as they have to learn to play with each other.

Whether the people you list were McDaniels signings or not, they were pretty much the players we thought they were. No real busts and no real gems. You blame him for signing Hooman and Fells but we need TEs on the field and I don't see anyone else available. Everyone was excited for Lloyd when he was signed. He signed here for what was considered reasonable at the time because of McDaniels.

I would say I am a fan of McDaniels

stephens44 said:

Actually.... I agree with pretty much everything you said. I feel that McDaniels is more about finesse and outwitting the defense than he is about establishing toughness and a sense of identity for this young offense. Ultimately we as fans all just want to win, granted... I would however like to see the Pats play the game on offense where they are physical, imposing, intimidating and play with attitude. I've never been a fan of 3 yd passes and complex passing schemes that end up being risky at best sometimes (Last week?). With the personnel the Pats have right now I'd love to see them play smash mouth, which isn't going to happen with McDaniels.

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This makes no sense. McDaniels has moved then team away from a pass happy offense to a more balanced offense. They are running the ball more with him.

Brady6 said:

Just look at his stats – Brady has had 3 seasons in which he had a quarterback rating of 100 or higher; 2007 with McDaniel’s as the coordinator; 2010 and 2011 with O’Brien as the coordinator.

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How many SBs did the team win with McDaniels on the staff?

Kid~Brady said:

You're a fan.

You are supposed to react this way after a great win.

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I am very pleased we won the game, this topic is something I have wanted to put out there for immediate placement in the practice squad forum for a few weeks now, I would have done it after last week but I didn’t want to contribute anymore negativity to a bad week for the team, now with a great win under our belt I thought this is the perfect time to open this thread with the hope it is immediately moved to the practice squad

Robdude said:

How many SBs did the team win with McDaniels on the staff?

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3 super bowls, they also won 3 super bowls with Bobby working the parking lot gate should we make him defensive coordinator?

Brady6 said:

Just look at his stats – Brady has had 3 seasons in which he had a quarterback rating of 100 or higher; 2007 with McDaniel’s as the coordinator; 2010 and 2011 with O’Brien as the coordinator.

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And if McDaniels didn't have to deal with what BB presented him offensively in '06, with Brady's injury in '08 and the personnel issues this year, how different would things be?

To compare Brady's statistics between OC's is so flawed and to deliberately discount '07 just because it messes with your theory is flat out fraudulent.

Sorry Brady6 but I can't agree with you.

Brady6 said:

3 super bowls, they also won 3 super bowls with Bobby working the parking lot gate should we make him defensive coordinator?

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No but he deserves credit for what he has been done here. You response is silly. He was a big part of the offense for 3 SB seasons.

manxman2601 said:

And if McDaniels didn't have to deal with what BB presented him offensively in '06, with Brady's injury in '08 and the personnel issues this year, how different would things be?

To compare Brady's statistics between OC's is so flawed and to deliberately discount '07 just because it messes with your theory is flat out fraudulent.

Sorry Brady6 but I can't agree with you.

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Couple points buddy:

1. I am not including the season Brady missed.
2. The offensive talent was no worse in 2010 for O’Brien than it was in 2006 and is now for McDaniel’s.
3. I am looking at 2010 and 2011 with O’Brien in which Brady had quarterback ratings of 111.0 and 105.6 compared to 98.7 in 2012 when McDaniel’s returned to the helm.


We can disagree it’s all good my friend.

Robdude said:

No but he deserves credit for what he has been done here. You response is silly. He was a big part of the offense for 3 SB seasons.

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He received credit, he got a promotion to offensive coordinator and received a head coaching job – both of which he has done less than he could have and should have with.

Brady6 said:

He received credit, he got a promotion to offensive coordinator and received a head coaching job – both of which he has done less than he could have and should have with.

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And then he was brought back to be our Offensive Coordinator again...He must have done a few things correct. If you want to say you liked O'Brien more. Or you think O'Brien was better that is fine. I do not have an opinion about that. To say McDaniels isn't any good because Brady had his best years (in your opinion I assume) with a different coordinator makes no sense. That does not negate what he has done.

You don't like McDaniels and I do not think you will. Why is still a mystery but I am moving on from this thread. The reasons you come up seem to be reasons you could assign to any coach.

Robdude said:

And then he was brought back to be our Offensive Coordinator again...He must have done a few things correct. If you want to say you liked O'Brien more. Or you think O'Brien was better that is fine. I do not have an opinion about that. To say McDaniels isn't any good because Brady had his best years (in your opinion I assume) with a different coordinator makes no sense. That does not negate what he has done.

You don't like McDaniels and I do not think you will. Why is still a mystery but I am moving on from this thread. The reasons you come up seem to be reasons you could assign to any coach.

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I like McDaniel’s a lot better his first go around, I believe he developed some bad habits in his time away and that has been problematic since he returned last season both in terms of personnel and play calling.