Linebackers

I think by the end of the season we will have what is considered one of the best, or even the best LB group in the NFL.
Hightower has flown a little under the radar, but I think BB is going to use him in a variety of roles this year. I am expecting a huge breakout season from him where he is dominant in run defense, and a prolific pass rusher. I even think we may see him lining up as a sub DE in some cases.
Spikes of course is a top run defender, but in limited opportunities he has shown very strong blitzing skills. He did a lot of it this preseason. It will be interesting to see how much he is used as a blitzer in sub.
We already know that Mayo is one of the best LBs in the NFL.
Now Collins, is added as the 4th LB with a ton of versatility, showing cover and pass rush skills. We can use him in place of any of the 3 (and shuffle if necessary) and not having to be a full time player will probably allow BB and Patricia to be creative in using him in roles he is best suited for.
I am expecting our defense to be better than it has in many years, and I think the LBs will be dominant and be a huge reason.

AndyJohnson said:

I think by the end of the season we will have what is considered one of the best, or even the best LB group in the NFL.

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No. Just... no.

For this to happen, Collins needs to be a top-flight cover LB, and Spikes needs to shave .5 seconds off his 40 time.

I don't think it's unreasonable to assume an upgrade on defense, and there's certainly reason for optimism as it pertains to our LB's.

Hopefully they are better in coverage, because that goes a long way in today's pass happy NFL and was a serious problem lately.

Hard to beat the 49ers, but I think the Pats' group has the talent and depth to be the #2 LB group in the NFL if Hightower progresses. Definitely the most talent at LB they've had since the reloading of the defense started.

I already think we have one of the best linebacker cores in the NFL.

Notorious said:

I already think we have one of the best linebacker cores in the NFL.

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If Spikes could defend against the pass it isn't unreasonable to believe that New England could harbor the NFL's best linebacking corps by the end of season 2013. That said, it's difficult to look beyond the 49ers (Bowman, Willis, Smith, Brooks), a developing Panther group (Kuechly, Beason, Davis), Seahawks (Wagner, Wright, Smith/Irvin) and the Chiefs (Hali, Johnson, Houston).

Hopefully Dane Fletcher retains health in 2013. He's an excellent situational spell for Spikes.

Notorious said:

I already think we have one of the best linebacker cores in the NFL.

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I think Mayo is a little overrated and Spikes is kinda underrated, at least around here.

But mostly I'm posting a response so I can throw in 'oh by the way it is corps not cores' and not seem like a super douche.

Hightower is the X factor to me. Depending on his development, the LB core will be elite (top 1-3) if he takes the next step. I think that he will. He's looked pretty beastly so far, especially in the vanilla scheme of PS.

He and Jones look like they're ready to explode on the NFL.

And for the people who think Mayo is overrated, keep mind of perception versus reality. Jerod is one best ILBs in the NFL, but because he's played on some bad defenses he gets knocked for that.

For example, I think that he's better than NaVorro Bowman, but because of the fact that the Patriots defense is worse than the 49ers, Jerod is tasked to do more with less. While Bowman is tasked to do less with more. If you swapped players on their respective teams, how do you think the perception would be then? Do you still think people would be saying Bowman is one of the best ILBs in the league if he had as much responsibility to the defense that Mayo does and had less opportunities to make plays like he does for the 49ers?

Imagine the type of player Jerod would perceive to be by playing alongside the best linebacker of our generation in Patrick Willis on that 49ers defense. His role would be significantly different because he wouldn't have to do everything like he does for the Patriots' defense. Thus, he would be able to make more plays.

Perception isn't always reality

fnordcircle said:

I think Mayo is a little overrated and Spikes is kinda underrated, at least around here.

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I am probably one of those posters who tends to undervalue Brandon Spikes.

Hopefully he can continue his progression from last season and have another good year. I'm still not too sure about his odds of staying on next year, but that will be sorted out in the future one way or another.

supafly said:

I am probably one of those posters who tends to undervalue Brandon Spikes.

Hopefully he can continue his progression from last season and have another good year. I'm still not too sure about his odds of staying on next year, but that will be sorted out in the future one way or another.

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It all comes down to how they progress as pass defenders. For all the crap we give Spikes about his athleticism he seems to be good at sitting in the right zone at the right time. Mayo seems above average at manning up with RBs and TEs but not near as good as Patrick Willis. I'm curious as to how Hightower progresses in coverage. I expect him to be able to show a few more rushes this year though.

I'm really not that worried about Spikes' athleticism. It's only really a problem against certain teams and in certain formations.

When we trot out four LBs its less of a deal since there's less space to cover per LB.

Similarly a stronger safety position mitigates his weaknesses. Overall though its not THAT big if a deal - there just aren't very many good cover LBs in the league. They just have to not be totally inept and I see Spikes as being good enough this year.

VrabelJr said:

It all comes down to how they progress as pass defenders. For all the crap we give Spikes about his athleticism he seems to be good at sitting in the right zone at the right time. Mayo seems above average at manning up with RBs and TEs but not near as good as Patrick Willis. I'm curious as to how Hightower progresses in coverage. I expect him to be able to show a few more rushes this year though.

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My concerns for Spikes run a bit deeper than just the coverage issues, but at least I can admit that I may be too hard on him at times. I'm not yet convinced of his consistency, his health, his attitude, and some other minor things that were shown prior to this past year, but perhaps it just took him a little while to get going. Bill Belichick may feel entirely differently. I just worry that Spikes may not be the kind of player that they normally target for that all-important 2nd deal here. Of course a lot of that will come down to specific monetary demands, so it's almost impossible to project at this time.

I do think that it's an important season for him individually, as he's obviously in a contract year. He could make a good play for being a highly sought after FA, he could fall somewhere in the middle as a good 2 down LB, or he could show some of the concerns that I mentioned earlier which would bring his value down a bit.

I definitely think that he does some great things, brings a very physical presence to the defense, is awesome vs the run game, and would actually LOVE to have him continue his career here. I'm just concerned that he may go for the bigger money and that's why I feel that the odds are better that he'll move on as opposed to keeping him.

VrabelJr said:

I'm curious as to how Hightower progresses in coverage. I expect him to be able to show a few more rushes this year though.

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I'm a bit disappointed at how slow Hightower seemed last season too, although it's hard to fault either player when they're matched up one on one with speedy backs etc. I am excited about Hightower's future here and am definitely glad that we used both 1st rd picks in 2012.

Hopefully we see a very nice progression in his 2nd season, for he did some very nice things as a rookie and while he was at Alabama.

DocHoliday said:

I'm really not that worried about Spikes' athleticism. It's only really a problem against certain teams and in certain formations.

When we trot out four LBs its less of a deal since there's less space to cover per LB.

Similarly a stronger safety position mitigates his weaknesses. Overall though its not THAT big if a deal - there just aren't very many good cover LBs in the league. They just have to not be totally inept and I see Spikes as being good enough this year.

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Yeah, that is definitely a very solid point, and as I said--I can readily admit to possibly being incorrect about Brandon Spikes and being too hard on him. I think that he had a terrific year last year. I will fully "buy in" with another solid showing this season.

In the meantime, I certainly do appreciate a lot of things that he does and I'm sure Belichick does too. I'm sure he'll offer him what he feels as a reasonable price. My only concern is that I'd like to see Spikes continue towards a nice progression from last year, and that he'll find Belichick's offer reasonable enough to stay.

He's definitely a player who I'd like to see retained.

supafly said:

Yeah, that is definitely a very solid point, and as I said--I can readily admit to possibly being incorrect about Brandon Spikes and being too hard on him. I think that he had a terrific year last year. I will fully "buy in" with another solid showing this season.

In the meantime, I certainly do appreciate a lot of things that he does and I'm sure Belichick does too. I'm sure he'll offer him what he feels as a reasonable price. My only concern is that I'd like to see Spikes continue towards a nice progression from last year, and that he'll find Belichick's offer reasonable enough to stay.

He's definitely a player who I'd like to see retained.

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I love the attitude and toughness Spikes brings and his strength inside. His lack of speed in coverage is part of the package though, and his overall value (and contract offer) will depend in part on the ability of the coaches to leverage his strengths while masking his limitations.

They should be good but if they are associated with a 30th ranked pass defense it will be hard to call them the best in the league.

I like all our starting linebackers individually, big fan of Spikes particularly, but i wonder how they fit in a 4-3 defense.

We have speedy cover guys on the bench, but you need to take someone out to get them in, particularly difficult when the opponent is in hurry up.

RayClay said:

I like all our starting linebackers individually, big fan of Spikes particularly, but i wonder how they fit in a 4-3 defense.

We have speedy cover guys on the bench, but you need to take someone out to get them in, particularly difficult when the opponent is in hurry up.

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It's so damn hard to make any evaluation of anybody's fit in Bill's defense since it changes so often and isn't based on any clear cut principles accessible to us fans.

If we were a pure 3-4 I'd say our LBs were one of the best in the league, but that's just not the case.

Fletcher was pretty solid in 3rd down coverage towards the end of the 2011 season. Interested to see how much he plays.

DocHoliday said:

It's so damn hard to make any evaluation of anybody's fit in Bill's defense since it changes so often and isn't based on any clear cut principles accessible to us fans.

If we were a pure 3-4 I'd say our LBs were one of the best in the league, but that's just not the case.

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I'll go with that and I assume there is a role for Collins and/or Fletcher, but the fact is you can only play 11 at a time. If you have Jones, Nink and the two tackles in, you either have three LBs or extra DBs. Or we can substitute a lb for a DL. WE have the players to cover any type of offense, but when they are different players you stand the risk of getting caught with the wrong personnel on the field.

andrewgarrr said:

Fletcher was pretty solid in 3rd down coverage towards the end of the 2011 season. Interested to see how much he plays.

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Fletcher fan here, but he "looked" just awful pre-season. I watched him specifically. Out of position, bad angles, late to the play. Could be rust from losing a full year.