Is WELKER Traded before the season starts?

ausbacker said:

Given the Patriots have tendered the franchise designation at 9.5 million, your opinion is null and void in regards to Welker's worth.

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Welker has that value to the team going into the next season, he might not have it afterwards. If Lloyd and someone else really come online then the Patriots will have a lot less need for Welker.

Snake Eyes said:

Welker has that value to the team going into the next season, he might not have it afterwards. If Lloyd and someone else really come online then the Patriots will have a lot less need for Welker.

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That's exactly the point. Assuming he signs his tender, he is worth 9.5 million in 2012. To say he's not worth 10 million is an idiotic comment given what's been observed.

Given nobody knows what the contract demands are, it's unwise to chastise either party. We're also blissfully unaware of what season 2012 holds at this point in time.

FoxboroFlyer said:

Welker is over playing this thing! BIG TIME! You're not an Elite wr! Period! Really? Miami let you go for a 3rd cause you were so damn scary?! Peace out and move on!
Just because you do a depends diaper commercial with big names doesn't make you entitled.
The simple thought that so many here wash this guys balls in their mouths makes me sick! He's a decent SLOT receiver...that is it,and certainly isn't worth 10 mill.
Big time in small games.... all but gone when it comes time to seal the big one.
Takes alot of nerve to demand the money this guy is, who also virtually cost us a SB!

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So the 12 players in NFL HISTORY who combined to have the only 18 seasons with more receiving yards than Welker had in 2011, are the only elite receivers ever?
Only 2 active WRs have ever had more. So Calvin and Andre Johnson are the only elite receivers in the NFL because everyone else gets outproduced by a 'decent slot receiver'?
Your post lacks intellect.

AndyJohnson said:

Right, who would want the guy who just had the 19th most receiving yards of anyone in a season in NFL history. I mean, afterall, he fell an entire yard short of Jerry Rices 2nd best year of his career. Who would want him?

Your first 20 have been an epic fail. Hopefully your posting improves and we can find some trade value for you.

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I've only been here for a few weeks, but it seems to me that you have arrogant, sarcastic and snide comments for almost everyone you enter into a conversation with. It seems, from what I can observe over this short period of time, that you think that you sh it ice cream and that you are, over and above all others, the only one with any understanding of the Patriots and all that happens to them.

Why is that?

Tell me that I am incorrect in my observations.

ausbacker said:

You're telling me Wes Welker wouldn't put up big numbers with Aaron Rodgers, Peyton Manning or Drew Brees throwing him the ball given their systems?

These boards make me laugh at times. They truly do.

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You just named three QBs who make good receivers look great much like Brady does to our receivers in this offense. Thanks for proving my point.

condon84 said:

The system that we have on offense plays a huge part in Welker's success. He's a good player, but the system makes him an even better player. Brady makes him a great player. Take him out of our system and have someone else throw him the ball, he's not going to be putting up the same numbers.

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ausbacker said:

You're telling me Wes Welker wouldn't put up big numbers with Aaron Rodgers, Peyton Manning or Drew Brees throwing him the ball given their systems?

These boards make me laugh at times. They truly do.

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condon84 said:

You just named three QBs who make good receivers look great much like Brady does to our receivers in this offense. Thanks for proving my point.

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It's as if you're not even trying to think at this point.

condon84 said:

The system that we have on offense plays a huge part in Welker's success. He's a good player, but the system makes him an even better player. Brady makes him a great player. Take him out of our system and have someone else throw him the ball, he's not going to be putting up the same numbers.

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ausbacker said:

You're telling me Wes Welker wouldn't put up big numbers with Aaron Rodgers, Peyton Manning or Drew Brees throwing him the ball given their systems?

These boards make me laugh at times. They truly do.

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condon84 said:

You just named three QBs who make good receivers look great much like Brady does to our receivers in this offense. Thanks for proving my point.

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Remind me how you making a silly comment easily refuted proves your point? Wes Welker is a great player. End of discussion.

ausbacker said:

Remind me how you making a silly comment easily refuted proves your point? Wes Welker is a great player. End of discussion.

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So those three QBs and the offense they are in don't help their receivers inflate their numbers

AndyJohnson said:

Just when I think you are ready for Guiness under stupidest posts,you top yourself.

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Actually, there are many others, including some alleged experts, that believe the same thing.

He might be a decent player on another team but he will not be able, IMO, to come anywhere near close to what he has accomplished in this particular
offense and with Brady.

Personally, I believe that your arrogance and belief that you are never wrong is actually far more stupid.

But, who am I to disagree with the Grand Poobah.

condon84 said:

So those three QBs and the offense they are in don't help their receivers inflate their numbers

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You made a ill advised comment, were caught out and are now attempting to confuse the issue. Whether or not individual receivers have their stats padded is an irrelevant point to your initial claim about Wes Welker, systems and Quarterbacks.

Mystery Pats Fan said:

He might be a decent player on another team but he will not be able, IMO, to come anywhere near close to what he has accomplished in this particular offense and with Brady.

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He had just one fewer catch and 10 fewer yards in 2008 with Cassel compared to 2007 with Brady. . . .

Oh, and BTW:

ESPN Video: Welker

@ 1:30

Sciz said:

...or someone who's worried about the long-term cap room of the team. How many more years do you think he'll be an elite WR?

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Fair enough. But then again, none of us know what he wants and what the Pats are offering him. All I'm saying is he deserves a payday whether it's from us or another team.

ctpatsfan77 said:

He had just one fewer catch and 10 fewer yards in 2008 with Cassel compared to 2007 with Brady. . . .

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That is true but has Cassel ever come even close to that in Kansas City? No, he has not because it was the patriots offensive philosophy that made the difference, along with Cassel running it in much the same manner as Brady did. It would be the same for Welker with another team, just like Cassel.... huge dropoff in performance.

Mystery Pats Fan said:

That is true but has Cassel ever come even close to that in Kansas City? No, he has not because it was the patriots offensive philosophy that made the difference, along with Cassel running it in much the same manner as Brady did. It would be the same for Welker with another team, just like Cassel.... huge dropoff in performance.

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Cassel 2008: 516 327 3,693 21 11 89.4
Cassel 2010: 450 262 3,116 27 7 93.0

Mystery Pats Fan said:

That is true but has Cassel ever come even close to that in Kansas City? No, he has not because it was the patriots offensive philosophy that made the difference, along with Cassel running it in much the same manner as Brady did. It would be the same for Welker with another team, just like Cassel.... huge dropoff in performance.

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What are you talking about? He had a great 2010 season with the chiefs.

Welker had 67 receptions for 700 yards for a 6-10 Dolphins team that was shuffling QBs along the likes of Cleo Lemon,Harrington and Culpepper.

To say that Welker would suck on other teams is just ridiculous. It doesn't take a ******* genius to find a use for him and i'm pretty sure any QB would love to have a target that is as smart,consistent and reliable as he is.

ctpatsfan77 said:

Oh, and BTW:

ESPN Video: Welker

@ 1:30

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What's that ***got Polian doing on TV?

ausbacker said:

You made a ill advised comment, were caught out and are now attempting to confuse the issue. Whether or not individual receivers have their stats padded is an irrelevant point to your initial claim about Wes Welker, systems and Quarterbacks.

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Which part of this comment do you not agree with?

condon84 said:

The system that we have on offense plays a huge part in Welker's success. He's a good player, but the system makes him an even better player. Brady makes him a great player. Take him out of our system and have someone else throw him the ball, he's not going to be putting up the same numbers.

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Do you think he'll be the number one target in the Packers' or Saints' system if he were to go over there? IMO I don't think so. He'll still be a good player, but he's not going to get the same numbers. I don't know what Denver is going to run with Manning so I'm not going to predict that situation, but if Wes joined the Manning Colts' offense, there's no way he would be the number 1 target in that offense.

Much as you would like to deny, systems and QBs for the most part are a huge determining factor in receiver's production.

randomk1 said:

What are you talking about? He had a great 2010 season with the chiefs.

Welker had 67 receptions for 700 yards for a 6-10 Dolphins team that was shuffling QBs along the likes of Cleo Lemon,Harrington and Culpepper.

To say that Welker would suck on other teams is just ridiculous. It doesn't take a ******* genius to find a use for him and i'm pretty sure any QB would love to have a target that is as smart,consistent and reliable as he is.

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You convinced me. My bad.

Patjew said:

If WWW gets traded I might kill myself.

Also, if I ever see his dropped SB pass on TV (I only saw it live), I might kill myself.

Also, if that Mystery troll keeps posting I will definitely kill myself.

Don't worry, I'll continue my front-running posting from beyond the grave.

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Have a nice afterlife.

This debate is premature. Until he signs his tender, there will be no movement and Welker has no leverage until he does. I think this goes the way of Mankins and Wilfork. It will be interesting to see what contract he does sign as it will set the market for slot receivers. I doubt he settles for the franchise tender and re-enters free agency the way Asante Samuel did, though he continues to command top dollar.

The NFL and NFLPA should agree to a SR position for franchise tag and market setting purposes. Welker is the best ever at that niche position but doesn't have the value of a true WR.

How many teams routinely line up two wideouts, a slot receiver and a TE (or two) with an empty backfield or one-back set regardless of down and distance?