The "Need" At Tight End

THE POSITIONS
Gronk - The best TE in the game
Hernandez - a top WR and h-back
Blocking TE - Solder or one of the other OL's.
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We have no backups. We have no one available if there is an injury.

We have 12 OL/TE positions, which seems about right.
We almost set at OL
Light, Mankins, Connolly/Koppen/draftee, Waters, Vollmer, Solder, Wendell, Thomas, Cannon
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CONSIDER
If one considers Hernandez a combination WR/h-back, then we clearly have a need at TE.

mgteich said:

CONSIDER
If one considers Hernandez a combination WR/h-back, then we clearly have a need at TE.

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It is actually kind of funny that the Pats have a prototypical TE in Gronk and a position-defying hybrid in Hernandez. You really can't get an effective backup for either...their physical gifts alone (not even including their obvious high football IQ) make them unique.

That being said, you are absolutely correct. A 3rd TE (not just an athletic backup OT) on the active roster is a really good idea. There are 4 TEs in the draft that sit firmly in the middle of the Gronk/AHern skill set:

Allen (Clemson) has the size to play inline and speed to attack defenses, but he won't make it out of the 1st round. Charles (UGA) and Egnew (Mizzou) are very athletic but may not be beefy enough to play inline. Fleener (Stanford) definitely looks the part and played in a pro style offense, but he was more of a big WR than a true TE for Luck.

None of them should slip to a range where the Pats would be interested. However if one of them made in to the late 3rd or 4th (most likely Egnew) and the Pats get their high priority shopping done with their earlier choices, I could definitely see that being the pick.

I definitely agree and BB obviously agrees with his selection of Lee Smith and bringing in Will Yateman last year

The player I think is most likely is Michael Williams from Alabama. Elite blocking TE who is underrated in the passing game. It also doesn't hurt that he played for Nick Saban.

Another player to look out for is Emil Igwenagu from Umass. I think someone, although I can't remember who, posted a link saying that the Patriots were talking to him a lot at the Shine Game practices.

Metaphors said:

It is actually kind of funny that the Pats have a prototypical TE in Gronk and a position-defying hybrid in Hernandez. You really can't get an effective backup for either...their physical gifts alone (not even including their obvious high football IQ) make them unique.

That being said, you are absolutely correct. A 3rd TE (not just an athletic backup OT) on the active roster is a really good idea. There are 4 TEs in the draft that sit firmly in the middle of the Gronk/AHern skill set:

Allen (Clemson) has the size to play inline and speed to attack defenses, but he won't make it out of the 1st round. Charles (UGA) and Egnew (Mizzou) are very athletic but may not be beefy enough to play inline. Fleener (Stanford) definitely looks the part and played in a pro style offense, but he was more of a big WR than a true TE for Luck.

None of them should slip to a range where the Pats would be interested. However if one of them made in to the late 3rd or 4th (most likely Egnew) and the Pats get their high priority shopping done with their earlier choices, I could definitely see that being the pick.

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I've got to disagree on a number of your assumptions.

The first is that the Pats wouldn't look at a TE until the late 3rd/early 4th. They'll look at a player, regardless of position, based on the best value available.

The next is that Fleener is more a big WR than true TE. Yes, he's a better receiver than blocker, but that doesn't mean he can't block. Fleener is the one guy who I think the Pats could draft early in the 2nd because he's similar to Hernandez, though a better blocker.

The PROBLEM with using a pick on a TE that high is that you expect him to be a starter, not just a back-up. But, with him and Hernandez having the ability to play like a WR, one could easily make the argument that you could get him on the field and create even more mismatches..

DaBruinz said:

I've got to disagree on a number of your assumptions.

The first is that the Pats wouldn't look at a TE until the late 3rd/early 4th. They'll look at a player, regardless of position, based on the best value available.

The next is that Fleener is more a big WR than true TE. Yes, he's a better receiver than blocker, but that doesn't mean he can't block. Fleener is the one guy who I think the Pats could draft early in the 2nd because he's similar to Hernandez, though a better blocker.

The PROBLEM with using a pick on a TE that high is that you expect him to be a starter, not just a back-up. But, with him and Hernandez having the ability to play like a WR, one could easily make the argument that you could get him on the field and create even more mismatches..

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Or you could just play Hernandez at running back . Fleener makes a really good luxury pick for teams picking at the bottom of the first. I could see the 49'ers taking him, particularly as their needs are at WR and CB, both of which are fairly deep classes.

I want them to take a TE with a high pick! I want another on the field. 3 TE sets with Wes and Woodhead. Wow what issues teams would have!!

SaCaCh said:

I want them to take a TE with a high pick! I want another on the field. 3 TE sets with Wes and Woodhead. Wow what issues teams would have!!

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Five safety sets on defense.

Get some wrs!!Enough with this tight end run oriented offense.If they had some deep speed on the outside then this offense would be hard to stop.

D-Money said:

Get some wrs!!Enough with this tight end run oriented offense.If they had some deep speed on the outside then this offense would be hard to stop.

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5,000+ yards from our QB not enough? I think most Def coordinators will tell you that this offense is pretty hard to stop right now.

I do get your point though.

D-Money said:

Get some wrs!!Enough with this tight end run oriented offense.If they had some deep speed on the outside then this offense would be hard to stop.

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Get Fleener and a WR or 2, there's no reason why we can't have our cake and eat it this draft

Our defense has huge needs. Why should we spend any resources at all backing up the deepest position on the team? Any resources spent on a backup TE means resources that cannot be spent elsewhere.

This 2 TE offense is working great for us. But I think some of us are overestimating it's importance. I don't think this offensive system is a matter of "Aha, this is what I've had in mind all along". One of BBs best traits has historically been to win with whatever cards he's dealt.

You're able to trade for one of the GOAT WRs (Moss)? Adapt and win...and set records. The aforementioned GOAT WR wigs out on you? Adapt and keep winning. Polian changes the rules? Adapt and keep winning. Have two amazing TEs drop into your lap? Adapt and keep winning. So if one of our TEs were out for any amount of time wouldn't BB just adapt and keep winning?

Peachhead said:

Our defense has huge needs. Why should we spend any resources at all backing up the deepest position on the team? Any resources spent on a backup TE means resources that cannot be spent elsewhere.

This 2 TE offense is working great for us. But I think some of us are overestimating it's importance. I don't think this offensive system is a matter of "Aha, this is what I've had in mind all along". One of BBs best traits has historically been to win with whatever cards he's dealt.

You're able to trade for one of the GOAT WRs (Moss)? Adapt and win...and set records. The aforementioned GOAT WR wigs out on you? Adapt and keep winning. Polian changes the rules? Adapt and keep winning. Have two amazing TEs drop into your lap? Adapt and keep winning. So if one of our TEs were out for any amount of time wouldn't BB just adapt and keep winning?

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This true but this TE phenomenon is not limited to NE. I think that since so many other TEs are dominating defenses, people are right on how important they are.

Peachhead said:

Our defense has huge needs. Why should we spend any resources at all backing up the deepest position on the team? Any resources spent on a backup TE means resources that cannot be spent elsewhere.

This 2 TE offense is working great for us. But I think some of us are overestimating it's importance. I don't think this offensive system is a matter of "Aha, this is what I've had in mind all along". One of BBs best traits has historically been to win with whatever cards he's dealt.

You're able to trade for one of the GOAT WRs (Moss)? Adapt and win...and set records. The aforementioned GOAT WR wigs out on you? Adapt and keep winning. Polian changes the rules? Adapt and keep winning. Have two amazing TEs drop into your lap? Adapt and keep winning. So if one of our TEs were out for any amount of time wouldn't BB just adapt and keep winning?

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Umm, we havent won since the 04 season. As far as our defense goes, which player do you want to draft in the 2nd round that will have a bigger impact on the team than Fleener? I'd like a DT, Alameda Ta'amu is still a binkie of mine (and he might slip) but I'm not seeing a bunch of guys who will likely be available and will also provide big upgrades.

We had a big scheme change this past year, I'm thinking that with more time the defense improve quite a bit. I think hiring Spags (we'll find a place for him) to assist with coaching duties would be a big help.

jr_3421 said:

This true but this TE phenomenon is not limited to NE. I think that since so many other TEs are dominating defenses, people are right on how important they are.

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I think the "TE phenomenon" is one part confirmation bias and one part flavor of the month. A short term blip, not necessarily the wave of the future.

Peachhead said:

Our defense has huge needs. Why should we spend any resources at all backing up the deepest position on the team?

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You say this, but last draft BB took Lee Smith and signed Yeatman as a free agent. I think BB continues to look for yet another TE. But rest assured, that third TE must be able to block.

If BB does do some wheeling and dealing and secures some late round picks, I think Byran of NC State might be a guy that would interest BB. I think his blocking is better than he is given credit for and with Brady throwing, he should have much more opportunity to show his hands.

I think we need an in-line tight end to back up Gronkowski. If he went down, there isn't anyone with the size needed to block. Others have mentioned Mike Williams from Alabama. I think he'd make a good backup. Should be able to get him at 95.

If Aaron Hernandez went down. We need a wr to replace his skill set. We have to re-up Welker. I'd kick Ocho to the curb. We don't save much. And, replace him with Brandon Lloyd. Try to keep D. Branch for another year at a similiar salary(2m) and draft a wr in the 2nd.

Peachhead said:

Our defense has huge needs. Why should we spend any resources at all backing up the deepest position on the team? Any resources spent on a backup TE means resources that cannot be spent elsewhere.

This 2 TE offense is working great for us. But I think some of us are overestimating it's importance. I don't think this offensive system is a matter of "Aha, this is what I've had in mind all along". One of BBs best traits has historically been to win with whatever cards he's dealt.

You're able to trade for one of the GOAT WRs (Moss)? Adapt and win...and set records. The aforementioned GOAT WR wigs out on you? Adapt and keep winning. Polian changes the rules? Adapt and keep winning. Have two amazing TEs drop into your lap? Adapt and keep winning. So if one of our TEs were out for any amount of time wouldn't BB just adapt and keep winning?

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Deep? Really? The Pats have TWO, they work as a tandem, and there is no backup for either. How is that "deep"?

I'm reminded of the 2009 playoff game against the Ravens. The Pats offense had had another very good season with Moss and Welker working as a tandem. Then Moss got hurt (but continued to play through his injury), then Welker was lost entirely. And then who did Brady have to throw to against BAL? An injured Moss, Edelman (rookie QB conversion project), Sam Aiken (special teamer) and Faulk.

Yeah, I'm very much in favor of drafting a third high-quality TE, even as high as the 2nd round. I really don't want to see what happens with this offense if they lose Gronk or Ahern or both for an extended period or even for a short time at a critical juncture and there's only Solder and some special teamer trying to fill in.

Any idea how Smith and Yeatman wound up doing this year?

patsfaninpa said:

I think we need an in-line tight end to back up Gronkowski. If he went down, there isn't anyone with the size needed to block. Others have mentioned Mike Williams from Alabama. I think he'd make a good backup. Should be able to get him at 95.

If Aaron Hernandez went down. We need a wr to replace his skill set. We have to re-up Welker. I'd kick Ocho to the curb. We don't save much. And, replace him with Brandon Lloyd. Try to keep D. Branch for another year at a similiar salary(2m) and draft a wr in the 2nd.

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Has Branch's production fallen off because he is the 4th option in our attack or because he has really slowed down this year? Clearly he has lost the burst coming out of cuts that he had before the knee injury. The speed is down a step or two.

The hands still appear reliable.

TE Juan Redmon Interview | Buffalo Bills Draft

This kid played at the same college that I played at. I still follow/watch all the games online and communicate with coaches and players at the school. Since we are talking about TE's in this thread I thought it was appropriate to post this here. He is a hell of an athlete that can block catch and has a ridiculous vertical jump where he blocked 5 FG's in the past 2 seasons that I can remember, 2 of them were to help MNU win the game. He could be a sleeper that the Pats could take a chance on in the later rounds (if we trade back and get some picks). I would love to see Juan as a part of the pats for years to come.