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I can't tell if you're being serious or funny. Because I laughed when I first read this but then I started to wonder....
Its totally serious.
Being aggressive is big risk and big reward. We are getting burned frequently by being aggressive and not executing.
 
Don't worry guys, it really is a just a rope a dope with the rest of the league, just wait and see the number of Int we will get in the second half of the season.

Just joking though, I just wonder if the OL of Jaguars and the Bucs just plainly suck or they just did not want to play
 
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Don't worry guys, it really is a just a rope a dope with the rest of the league, just wait and see the number of Int we will drop in the second half of the season

Fixed it for you :cool:
 
Don't worry guys, it really is a just a rope a dope with the rest of the league, just wait and see the number of Int we will get in the second half of the season.

Just joking though, I just wonder if the OL of Jaguars and the Bucs just plainly suck or they just did not want to play

There is no question there is enough talent, coaching brainpower and experience for this defense to be excellent. It just hasn't been, and the change of scheme from what has worked for years is the heart of the problem, IMO.
How the defense played yesterday will be irrelevant in January, unless it never improves.
 
There is no question there is enough talent, coaching brainpower and experience for this defense to be excellent. It just hasn't been, and the change of scheme from what has worked for years is the heart of the problem, IMO.
How the defense played yesterday will be irrelevant in January, unless it never improves.

I may have the profiled wrongly. I thought you would have been among those calling for BB's head.
 
I may have the profiled wrongly. I thought you would have been among those calling for BB's head.
No. I don't usually overreact.
I try to have reasonable expectations and keep things in perspective.
My biggest concern right now is that we abandoned a philosophy that has worked for BB for 30 years, and the results are not good, so I want us to go back to what is proven.
 
No. I don't usually overreact.
I try to have reasonable expectations and keep things in perspective.
My biggest concern right now is that we abandoned a philosophy that has worked for BB for 30 years, and the results are not good, so I want us to go back to what is proven.

So you want a return to a primary 3-4 then?
 
So you want a return to a primary 3-4 then?
I don't care if its 34 or 43, thats just an alignment thing.
I want a 2gap run defense and primarily zone coverage.
 
You can be aggressive and blitz all you want. If you have the kinds of deficiencies in personnel that we do, you're still not going to be able to get to the quarterback and will eventually get burned. Haynesworth, Dowling, and Chung returning will certainly help. But the secondary was dealt a blow by our own coach when we let go of it's quarterback (Sanders) and most talented safety (Meriweather). You can complain about Meriweather freelancing all you want, but he looked like Rodney in this defense compared to the way Barrett and Brown have looked so far this season. So you take the near complete inability to pressure the quarterback and combine it with a shoddy secondary (I'm also looking at you, McCourty and Bodden) along with key injuries, and the results speak for themselves. I actually laughed out loud last week when people were trying to defend the kind of yardage that the defense had been giving up lately. Hopefully those same people were watching this game...
 
I don't care if its 34 or 43, thats just an alignment thing.
I want a 2gap run defense and primarily zone coverage.


Ummmmm, you do realize Fat Al don't like 3-4 and the reason why he punched his ticket out of DC

On the other hand you've got the fearsome foursome of Ninkovich, Cunningham/Spikes/JAG, Anderson, Carter as your 4-3 OLB/DE where all hope lies for pass rush. Then for DT you got a former NT now after 8 yrs being asked to put pressure, and another DT that is a ticking timebomb and plays when/if he wants to.

This is the opportunity for Mayo & Wilfork to stand up and be the vocal leaders of this D and both are nowhere to be seen

A rudderless, leaderless, clueless ship on Defense.
 
Andy can talk all he wants about his 2-gap run defense and his zone coverage in the secondary to limit big plays and "make the other team earn it."

The fact of the matter is that both "styles" of defense have been destroyed by opponents. Trying to be more aggressive this year, the defense has been absolutely abysmal. But Andy seems to forget that last year this defense was absolutely putrid as well. 31st ranked defense against the pass. Dead last in third down defense. Couldn't get a big stop against the Jets when they needed it. That beloved 2-gap run defense that limits those "big plays" was the defense that got absolutely gashed for 230 yards on the ground by the Ravens in the playoffs. That 2-gap run defense is the defense that couldn't stop the Jets from going over 100 yards in the 2010-11 playoffs and couldn't get off the field late in the game when it needed to.

Of course this will all be countered with "yards don't matter only points do" and "that was just a bad day at the office against Baltimore, a total system failure."

This defense has not been a top unit since 2006. 2007 was a pretty good unit. They were carried by the offense for most of the year, but they also stepped up in some games like vs Philly and Baltimore to keep the undefeated streak alive when the Pats offense wasn't at its best.

It's amazing how when the defense was so good in 03/04, the coach gets so much of the credit. But now when it sucks, he gets none. It's the players, it's the scheme, it's the new rules. The blame is squarely on Belichick's shoulders. It's easy to look like a genius when you have LT, Rodney, McGinest, Law, Vrabel, Bruschi.

How is it even remotely acceptable for the "greatest defensive mind of all time" to have a subpar defense from 2008 on? He's been outschemed by Rex Ryan and Tom Coughlin in huge playoff games. John Harbaugh had his team much more ready to play than Bill did in the 09/10 playoffs.

People will say Bill is rebuilding and doesn't have the personnel to do what he wants. Ok, well then that's his fault too. He's the one PICKING THE PLAYERS. He's the one with the final say in the draft, he's the one with pseudo-GM duties in terms of trades/signings.

Any way you slice it, whether it's his ineptness as a defensive coach or his ineptness as a talent evaluator/talent acquirer, he's the one to blame. Tom Brady can only carry you so far, Bill.
 
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Andy can talk all he wants about his 2-gap run defense and his zone coverage in the secondary to limit big plays and "make the other team earn it."

The fact of the matter is that both "styles" of defense have been destroyed by opponents. Trying to be more aggressive this year, the defense has been absolutely abysmal. But Andy seems to forget that last year this defense was absolutely putrid as well. 31st ranked defense against the pass. Dead last in third down defense. Couldn't get a big stop against the Jets when they needed it. That beloved 2-gap run defense that limits those "big plays" was the defense that got absolutely gashed for 230 yards on the ground by the Ravens in the playoffs. That 2-gap run defense is the defense that couldn't stop the Jets from going over 100 yards in the 2010-11 playoffs and couldn't get off the field late in the game when it needed to.

Of course this will all be countered with "yards don't matter only points do" and "that was just a bad day at the office against Baltimore, a total system failure."

This defense has not been a top unit since 2006. 2007 was a pretty good unit. They were carried by the offense for most of the year, but they also stepped up in some games like vs Philly and Baltimore to keep the undefeated streak alive when the Pats offense wasn't at its best.

It's amazing how when the defense was so good in 03/04, the coach gets so much of the credit. But now when it sucks, he gets none. It's the players, it's the scheme, it's the new rules. The blame is squarely on Belichick's shoulders. It's easy to look like a genius when you have LT, Rodney, McGinest, Law, Vrabel, Bruschi.

How is it even remotely acceptable for the "greatest defensive mind of all time" to have a subpar defense from 2008 on? He's been outschemed by Rex Ryan and Tom Coughlin in huge playoff games. John Harbaugh had his team much more ready to play than Bill did in the 09/10 playoffs.

People will say Bill is rebuilding and doesn't have the personnel to do what he wants. Ok, well then that's his fault too. He's the one PICKING THE PLAYERS. He's the one with the final say in the draft, he's the one with pseudo-GM duties in terms of trades/signings.

Any way you slice it, whether it's his ineptness as a defensive coach or his ineptness as a talent evaluator/talent acquirer, he's the one to blame. Tom Brady can only carry you so far, Bill.

Out-schemed in SB 42? Really? REALLY? REALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ignoring your forever now.
 
Out-schemed in SB 42? Really? REALLY? REALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ignoring your forever now.


He's been outschemed since 2005. Just look at the playoffs

2005 - Spanked in Denver
2006 - lucked out with Chargers imploding after fumbled INT. Then got smoked by Manning in AFCC after taking 21-0 lead.
2007 - limped past Jags and Chargers after unstoppable offense. Blueprint was shown by Eagles QB, yea the HOF'er AJ Feely putting up 350 yards, and then eeked out W's vs Ravens and Giants, only to be spanked by Steve Spagnuolo Defense in SB
2008 - No playoffs
2009 - One & Done. Ravens
2010 - One & Done . Jets

So, that's zip for last 6 years, having no consistency in keeping O or D stability. Going from Reche Caldwell and Doug Gabriel to Moss and Welker, no succession plan to replace Vrabel, Bruschi, Rodney. Lousy FA signings, letting go of players like Seymour, Samuel, and to top it off pathetic drafting despite collecting boat load of draft picks.

But hey, he can live off 2001, 2003, 2004, heck might as well live off of 1986 and 1991 also.
 
Out-schemed in SB 42? Really? REALLY? REALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ignoring your forever now.

Good for you.

You don't think that Spags/Coughlin/Giants coaches outschemed Belichick? What game did you watch?

Just over a month ago, you had put up 38 points on the Giants on their home turf. You had two weeks to prepare and were playing in warm weather, and the "greatest offense of all time" only put up 14 points in the biggest game of the year?

It's the same thing with the Jets. You put up 45 on them a month before hand and you can only score 14 "real" points on them with an extra week to prepare at home?

If you seriously think Belichick did a better job than Spags/Coughlin, then you're so far gone I don't even know what to tell you.

So then you must agree with the premise that Belichick did not out-scheme Martz and Vermeil when the Pats upset and shutdown the Greatest Show on Turf? I guess Martz and Vermeil out-schemed Belichick and had the better gameplan, but it just didn't work out for some reason.

That's virtually what you're saying. The Giants shutdown the best offense EVER and held them to SEVEN points late in the 4th quarter. How does that not constitute being out-schemed?
 
1st and 10 at NE 20 (7:54) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short right to W.Welker to NE 25 for 5 yards (K.Mitchell).
2nd and 5 at NE 25 (7:19) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short right to R.Moss to NE 35 for 10 yards (C.Webster).
1st and 10 at NE 35 (6:39) L.Maroney left end pushed ob at NE 44 for 9 yards (Ja.Butler).
2nd and 1 at NE 44 (6:14) T.Brady pass short right to W.Welker to NYG 43 for 13 yards (A.Pierce, Ja.Butler).
1st and 10 at NYG 43 (5:27) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short left to K.Faulk pushed ob at NYG 39 for 4 yards (A.Pierce).
2nd and 6 at NYG 39 (5:01) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short left to W.Welker to NYG 29 for 10 yards (Ja.Butler).
1st and 10 at NYG 29 (4:15) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass incomplete short right to D.Stallworth.
2nd and 10 at NYG 29 (4:12) T.Brady pass short right to R.Moss to NYG 18 for 11 yards (A.Pierce).
1st and 10 at NYG 18 (3:31) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short middle to K.Faulk to NYG 6 for 12 yards (Ja.Butler). NYG-F.Robbins was
injured during the play.
1st and 6 at NYG 6 (2:55) T.Brady pass incomplete short left to R.Moss.
2nd and 6 at NYG 6 (2:49) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass incomplete short right to W.Welker. NYG-Ja.Butler was injured during the play.
3rd and 6 at NYG 6 (2:45) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short right to R.Moss for 6 yards, TOUCHDOWN. 10 13
S.Gostkowski extra point is GOOD, Center-L.Paxton, Holder-C.Hanson.


14-10 Patriots LEAD the game with 2:40 left.

Spagnolo really schemed the crap out of that drive to take the lead...just like he schemed four uncalled tackles of Pats defensive line players while Eli scrambled out of a three count in the grasp and threw up a wounded duck that some JAG made a once in a lifetime one handed catch on. Just like Spagnolo schemed those two sure INT's dropped by the secondary, the Samuel gaffe being a sure game ender. Yeah, you're not a ridiculous idiotic troll...Spagnolo outschemed the entire Patriots offense and defense in the Super Bowl!!!! You'd think some smart, savvy NFL GM would give a genius like Spags a head coaching job.
 
That SB loss was the result of p*ssing off the football gods. They decided early in the game, that they were not going to let us win.

As for the rest of those playoff losses,,,,,,,,ummm, yeah we sucked. Although BB has forgotten more about football than I will ever know, he's still ultimately responsible for the current situation. With that said, i'm not saying the team sucks, and I do believe in time, they will get their sh*t together on defense............though I said that last year to :(
 
I posted before the Bills game that I felt this would be a loss...38-35...there were 170 Pats fans posting their pregame picks...roughly 95% were pro-Pats winning. I am a long time fan from the start and I'm a PROUD homer. Still, trying to get a feel for this game beforehand I felt they would lose and posted THAT.

I'm not disagreeing with anyone else in this thread...Pats fans have any number of opinions and that is what this board is for.

My point is that THIS clown is an undercover troll...read the history of his posts. He NEVER joins in anything that a normal fan of the Pats would, like the pregame prediction thread...just read his posts...they ALL are always ripping, tearing, vicious shots at Belichick, the team ,the offense, the defense or whatever else has Pats fans riled up that week. He USES BillBelichickFan79 as a handle because it easily blends into the landscape with BillBelichickFan74, BillBellichickFan82 and other close facimiles.He is obviously pretty ignorant since the archived posts he's made here are 100% open attacks on Bill Belichick, over a span of three years. Who in their right mind logs onto a Patriots message board with THAT handle and then proceeds to rattle off hundreds of vicious ad hominem attacks on Belichick and his record as Patriot head coach?

Read the first page of his posting history and what you see is high praise for the Jets, for Revis, for Sanchez's play against the Cowboys in the first game, literally dozens of Jet admiration and praise references...I'm betting if I ever wanted to bathe myself in excrement and log on to J.I. or Gang Green, I could do a simple search and pull up posts that mirror the ones he makes here verbatim. To that end I would also search Giants boards to the same end, just in case these stupid forays onto this board are borne of a NY Metro area bias...another common trait of the undercover troll.
 
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I posted before the Bills game that I felt this would be a loss...38-35...there were 170 Pats fans posting their pregame picks...roughly 95% were pro-Pats winning. I am a long time fan from the start and I'm a PROUD homer. Still, trying to get a feel for this game beforehand I felt they would lose and posted THAT.

I'm not disagreeing with anyone else in this thread...Pats fans have any number of opinions and that is what this board is for.

My point is that THIS clown is an undercover troll...read the history of his posts. He NEVER joins in anything that a normal fan of the Pats would, like the pregame prediction thread...just read his posts...they ALL are always ripping, tearing, vicious shots at Belichick, the team ,the offense, the defense or whatever else has Pats fans riled up that week. He USES BillBelichickFan79 as a handle because it easily blends into the landscape with BillBelichickFan74, BillBellichickFan82 and other close facimiles.He is obviously pretty ignorant since the archived posts he's made here are 100% open attacks on Bill Belichick, over a span of three years. Who in their right mind logs onto a Patriots message board with THAT handle and then proceeds to rattle off hundreds of vicious ad hominem attacks on Belichick and his record as Patriot head coach?

Read the first page of his posting history and what you see is high praise for the Jets, for Revis, for Sanchez's play against the Cowboys in the first game, literally dozens of Jet admiration and praise references...I'm betting if I ever wanted to bathe myself in excrement and log on to J.I. or Gang Green, I could do a simple search and pull up posts that mirror the ones he makes here verbatim. To that end I would also search Giants boards to the same end, just in case these stupid forays onto this board are borne of a NY Metro area bias...another common trait of the undercover troll.

Forget undercover troll. This guy is clearly Eric Mangini, and he's trying to get fans to revolt on Belichick so he can have his job.:bricks:
 
Forget undercover troll. This guy is clearly Eric Mangini, and he's trying to get fans to revolt on Belichick so he can have his job.:bricks:

more likely Ron Borges.......either this guy or DonBlackmon55 are Ron Borges I am certain of it.
 
1st and 10 at NE 20 (7:54) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short right to W.Welker to NE 25 for 5 yards (K.Mitchell).
2nd and 5 at NE 25 (7:19) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short right to R.Moss to NE 35 for 10 yards (C.Webster).
1st and 10 at NE 35 (6:39) L.Maroney left end pushed ob at NE 44 for 9 yards (Ja.Butler).
2nd and 1 at NE 44 (6:14) T.Brady pass short right to W.Welker to NYG 43 for 13 yards (A.Pierce, Ja.Butler).
1st and 10 at NYG 43 (5:27) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short left to K.Faulk pushed ob at NYG 39 for 4 yards (A.Pierce).
2nd and 6 at NYG 39 (5:01) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short left to W.Welker to NYG 29 for 10 yards (Ja.Butler).
1st and 10 at NYG 29 (4:15) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass incomplete short right to D.Stallworth.
2nd and 10 at NYG 29 (4:12) T.Brady pass short right to R.Moss to NYG 18 for 11 yards (A.Pierce).
1st and 10 at NYG 18 (3:31) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short middle to K.Faulk to NYG 6 for 12 yards (Ja.Butler). NYG-F.Robbins was
injured during the play.
1st and 6 at NYG 6 (2:55) T.Brady pass incomplete short left to R.Moss.
2nd and 6 at NYG 6 (2:49) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass incomplete short right to W.Welker. NYG-Ja.Butler was injured during the play.
3rd and 6 at NYG 6 (2:45) (Shotgun) T.Brady pass short right to R.Moss for 6 yards, TOUCHDOWN. 10 13
S.Gostkowski extra point is GOOD, Center-L.Paxton, Holder-C.Hanson.


14-10 Patriots LEAD the game with 2:40 left.

Spagnolo really schemed the crap out of that drive to take the lead...just like he schemed four uncalled tackles of Pats defensive line players while Eli scrambled out of a three count in the grasp and threw up a wounded duck that some JAG made a once in a lifetime one handed catch on. Just like Spagnolo schemed those two sure INT's dropped by the secondary, the Samuel gaffe being a sure game ender. Yeah, you're not a ridiculous idiotic troll...Spagnolo outschemed the entire Patriots offense and defense in the Super Bowl!!!! You'd think some smart, savvy NFL GM would give a genius like Spags a head coaching job.

If you don't think that the Giants had a better gameplan and that the Giants were more prepared/ready to play that game, then I don't know what to tell you. Even your beloved Randy Moss said "they had a better gameplan" when he was interviewed after the loss.

Whether you want to call it out-schemed, losing the adjustment battle, or just not having your team playing at its best in the biggest game of the season, the blame falls on the coach, just like the coach gets the credit when he shuts down the greatest show on turf in the Super Bowl.

Ironic how when the Pats shut down the Rams great offense, BB was a defensive mastermind and was a genius who crafted up an amazing gameplan to shut down that offense. But when the Giants hold the greatest offense of all time to 14 points in the Super Bowl, Spagnuolo gets absolutely no credit. Coughlin gets no credit. The Patriots just had an off day, right? Well how come no one says that the Rams just had an off day? Because you're not being objective and you're in denial of the fact that Belichick has been out-coached in three of his last playoff games. The other teams have been better prepared and have had the better gameplans. That's just a fact if you look at it somewhat objectively, which is obviously hard for you to do.
 
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