Should we expect the defense to rely on the offense?

defense is not important and boring we score lots of points to win games.

Are you saying that Belichick had our #1 MLB inactive, even though he was healthy? Did Fletcher get all the reps at MLB?

AndyJohnson said:

Anderson and Cunningham are DEs now.
Ninkovich is SOLB and Mayo is WOLB. I suppose Fletcher would back up Ninkovich and Guyton would back up Mayo. Really Mayo, Guyton, Fletcher can play multiple positions with Spikes seemingly only a MLB and Ninko a SOLB.
I think you have to be careful with 4 corners in the nickel, because one area we have struggled for a few years now is run D from the nickel.

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Rob0729 said:

yeah, people look at Henne's numbers and just automatically assume the Pats' defense is just as bad or worse than last year. Definitely not the case. The Pats had the Dolphins under 300 yards going into garbage time in the last six minutes of the game. That is where the Dolphins padded their stats.

The defense wasn't great, but not nearly as bad as people make it out to be.

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Well, Miami was able to pass the ball and were only down 14 points. They hit on a couple of plays and its only a 7 point game. I wasnt comfortable assuming NE had the game in the bank at all.

Having said that, BB experimented with different coverages and players because he had the lead. Dowling and Barrett were totally new the secondary and Bodden was shaking off rust. I dont think BB showed everything with DL being aggressive either.

The real test is tomorrow because Rivers is an elite QB and SD has weapons: Gates, Floyd, Jackson.

I think our defensive line will do something this game. The dolphins spent their off season building up a good offensive line and they gave Henne some time throw last Monday. I dont see that happening with the Chargers.

2/3's of the secondary didn't play (much) last year...Bodden, Dowling, Barret, Brown.
3/5's of the DT/DEs didn't play on the Patriots last year...Haynesworth, Ellis, Carter, Anderson
Give the newbies a chance to get used to each other, learn their roles, get the rotation settled.
And give the coaches a chance to figure out what they have.
Remember....1st game of the year, on the road , Prime Time Monday night football, lots of new parts, short preseason. Barring injury, BB will fine tune these guys and have a top ten D ready to handle the meat of the schedule midseason. Besides, Brady will have 3,000 yds and 24 TDs by week 6

mgteich said:

Are you saying that Belichick had our #1 MLB inactive, even though he was healthy? Did Fletcher get all the reps at MLB?

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You seemingly didn't even read what he said. He simply stated who was playing what position and where else they would be suited to slide to depending on the situation. You stated that they are relying on Ninkovich, Anderson, and Cunningham at OLB, which is not true in the new defensive scheme. Why in the world would you act like Anderson is playing OLB when he's been exclusively playing DE? Mayo is now playing on the outside. Guyton started in the middle and Fletcher rotated in in that spot. Spikes will be the middle run stopper probably starting this week. Spikes won't slide to the outside but Guyton can slide out there to play in coverage and Fletcher can slide to the strong side.

Mayo, Guyton, Ninkovich, Fletcher, and Spikes are the LBs. Anderson and Cunningham are DE.

mgteich said:

Are you saying that Belichick had our #1 MLB inactive, even though he was healthy? Did Fletcher get all the reps at MLB?

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I don't know what Spikes health or game readiness was. I do know we played nickle base and barely had a 43 snap.
I am saying Anderson and Cunningham are not OLBs in the 43.
That Ninko appears to be the SOLB, and if were out it would seem that Fletcher would take his spot.
That Mayo is the WILL and if he went out Fletcher or Guyton would take his spot
That Spikes appears to only be a MLB.
I'll wait until Spikes is 100%, practices, is game ready and we have a game where we actually plan to use the 43 before I assess who is #1 on the depth chart there

The-Hooded-One said:

You seemingly didn't even read what he said. He simply stated who was playing what position and where else they would be suited to slide to depending on the situation. You stated that they are relying on Ninkovich, Anderson, and Cunningham at OLB, which is not true in the new defensive scheme. Why in the world would you act like Anderson is playing OLB when he's been exclusively playing DE? Mayo is now playing on the outside. Guyton started in the middle and Fletcher rotated in in that spot. Spikes will be the middle run stopper probably starting this week. Spikes won't slide to the outside but Guyton can slide out there to play in coverage and Fletcher can slide to the strong side.

Mayo, Guyton, Ninkovich, Fletcher, and Spikes are the LBs. Anderson and Cunningham are DE.

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And at some point we will figure out where Edds fits in

Triumph said:

Well, Miami was able to pass the ball and were only down 14 points. They hit on a couple of plays and its only a 7 point game. I wasnt comfortable assuming NE had the game in the bank at all.

Having said that, BB experimented with different coverages and players because he had the lead. Dowling and Barrett were totally new the secondary and Bodden was shaking off rust. I dont think BB showed everything with DL being aggressive either.

The real test is tomorrow because Rivers is an elite QB and SD has weapons: Gates, Floyd, Jackson.

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But there is no doubt you play different style up 14 than up 7, 3, tied etc. Especially with 8 minutes left.
I never understand why people try to take situations where our #1 objective is burning the clock and think the results that scheme gets are the same it would get if we were up a TD or less.

The defense? Lets check the drives:

First drive 84 yards, TD.
3-and-out
6-and-out
3-and-out
4-and-out
Halftime
9 yards TD off INT
FG
3-and-out
3-and-out (-4 yards)
Downs
TD
Gameover

Summary: 6 Punts, 3 TDs (1 off INT), and an FG.

Miami was successful in one of three ways. 1) Brandon Marshall out physical McCourty. 2) Fasano taking advantage of the safeties (Chung included) and Guyton. 3) Henne escaping the pocket.

This week only item 2) is a potential problem. Rivers won't run for 59 yards and Jackson isn't as strong as Marshall. I hope BB has an effective solution for interior passes defense.

During 2001-2005, we used to see very physical but very creative defense that would confuse even very experienced QBs. Since 2007 or so we have become very vanilla defense where even Kyle Orrin, Matt schaub type QBs, rookie QBs were rearing us apart.

Now that we added so much talent to DT/DE position, will there be change our defensive schemes, formation and plan?

AndyJohnson said:

But there is no doubt you play different style up 14 than up 7, 3, tied etc. Especially with 8 minutes left.
I never understand why people try to take situations where our #1 objective is burning the clock and think the results that scheme gets are the same it would get if we were up a TD or less.

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I will never understand people who think the NE secondary hasnt been the Achilles heel of this team for years.

Triumph said:

I will never understand people who think the NE secondary hasnt been the Achilles heel of this team for years.

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The defense is a part of the problem, but keep in mind the defense is a system of 11 guys and when any one guy or group of guys is not executing,then the system fails.

Say everything you want about the lack of talent in our secondary, I won't disagree with you too much, but in my mind it is the lack of talent at OLB that is the root cause of ALL the defenses issues and the real reason we switched to a 4-3 this year.

BB has passed on countless hundreds of players in the passed 10 drafts and failed to develop anybody at this position. Something is just not right about this and it needs to be a bigger media story than it has to date.

How sad is it that the only player he has drafted even fairly high to date is Cunningham and he is slow as paint drying out there.

We need BB to explain what his thinking is on this position, because clearly it has led to our decline and was especially evident in our loss to the Jets in the playoffs last year.

"Bend but don't break" is turning into a contortionist routine with these goal line stands. Thankfully start at the 1 doesn't have to mean moving the ball far enough out for a punt. Two weeks in a row with 99 yard TD drives. :rocker:

The Chargers are a very good football team. solid on the OL, good Rb's, good receivers, and a top QB. Their defense is also very good.
The Patriots defense made the plays when they had to, so I don't think it's really fair to be critical of them after this game.

PATSNUTme said:

The Chargers are a very good football team. solid on the OL, good Rb's, good receivers, and a top QB. Their defense is also very good.
The Patriots defense made the plays when they had to, so I don't think it's really fair to be critical of them after this game.

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Agreed.

The Chargers were the best offense in the NFL last year, and really have not lost anything this year. Holding that offense to 21 points is not exactly a defensive meltdown.

Jackson made several catches when the coverage was there. Even the best secondaries cannot stop receivers making circus catches.

There is still work to be done, but this defense will only improve as the year goes on. And it is apparent the starting point is nowhere near where the defense was at this point last year.

PATSNUTme said:

The Chargers are a very good football team. solid on the OL, good Rb's, good receivers, and a top QB. Their defense is also very good.
The Patriots defense made the plays when they had to, so I don't think it's really fair to be critical of them after this game.

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The funny thing is if you said before the game that the Pats would hold the Chargers to 21 points, you would say the defense had a good game. Now people are biatching how bad they are because they gave up 21 points to one of the best offenses in the league.

The Pats defense was far from perfect, but nearly as bad as people make it. I think Belichick is waiting to unleash the front seven and once he does, this pass defense will improve exponentially. All the passing turnovers came off good pressure on Rivers.

PATSNUTme said:

The Chargers are a very good football team. solid on the OL, good Rb's, good receivers, and a top QB. Their defense is also very good.
The Patriots defense made the plays when they had to, so I don't think it's really fair to be critical of them after this game.

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I respectfully disagree.

The defense performed yesterday similar to how they performed too often last year: like a sieve,
bailed out of trouble only by the generosity & stupidity of its opponent.

They were terrible on 3rd down, had only 1 garbage-time sack, and unlike last Monday had almost no hits - or even pressures - on CryMeARivers after that awful RTQB call against Carter. Sound familiar?

Hell, they couldn't even cover that bowling ball Tolbert. I've never seen a fat tub of goo completely uncovered (and running away from coverage) so often in one game ever.

The defense took a step back yesterday. They now need to take 2 steps forward Sunday.

Kid~Brady said:

Until they gel, Brady and that offense will have to basically carry the load until they do.

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Carry the load? The defense forced 5 turnovers yesterday.

captain stone said:

They were terrible on 3rd down, had only 1 garbage-time sack, and unlike last Monday had almost no hits - or even pressures

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Do you just make **** up? They had 2 sacks, not one. They also had 2 INTs, both on plays where the QB was pressured, and hit.


The had a significant number of pressures, and hit rivers quite a few times. Do you even watch the games?