Jets window is now shut

Rob0729 · Jan 24, 2011

condon84 said:
Ridiculous premise of a thread. The Jets have the two most important things that you need to be successful in this league: a good HC, and a good QB.

Rex has proven himself to be a good HC. And Sanchez has played well under the big lights. His two appearance in the playoffs have been pretty good and I see no reason why he should regress.

The Jets are a legit problem for us now and in the future.

Ryan is a good coach. Still to be determined if he is a great coach. Sanchez is average (has a horrible completion percentage, makes a lot of stupid throws), but can come through in the clutch. Problem for him is if his defense continues to decline from year to year, he won't have the opportunities to make clutch performances.

Right now, the Jets showed yesterday why they may not be in it for the long haul. The Jets never really played a great complete game all year. Every game this season, they have had one to three quarters where they just sucked royally (usually to start the game). Yes, yesterday Sanchez helped to almost get them back in it, but he wouldn't have been able to do that if the Jets defense couldn't stop the Steelers from scoring a point in the second half. You can't engineer a 21 point second half comeback without both sides of the ball playing near perfect.

Ring 6 · Jan 24, 2011

Rob0729 said:
Ryan is a good coach. Still to be determined if he is a great coach. Sanchez is average (has a horrible completion percentage, makes a lot of stupid throws), but can come through in the clutch. Problem for him is if his defense continues to decline from year to year, he won't have the opportunities to make clutch performances.

Right now, the Jets showed yesterday why they may not be in it for the long haul. The Jets never really played a great complete game all year. Every game this season, they have had one to three quarters where they just sucked royally (usually to start the game). Yes, yesterday Sanchez helped to almost get them back in it, but he wouldn't have been able to do that if the Jets defense couldn't stop the Steelers from scoring a point in the second half. You can't engineer a 21 point second half comeback without both sides of the ball playing near perfect.

Snachez has had a top 5 defense and top 5 running game. To give him credit for getting to 2 big games before failing is ignoring how the team won games.

condon84 · Jan 24, 2011

Tunescribe said:
Your theory will be put the test next season. We'll see how they do with 24 free agents and limited draft picks.

They could possibly have a down year next year. But my point was that to simply say that their window is now shut just because they have some FAs is being shortsighted especially when they have the two most important cogs in place who are pretty good. I can't stand them, but they have their OL intact, which is where it all begins on offense, they have a running game because of that OL, and they will have a legit #1 WR in Holmes, a good TE, and a perfect RB in Greene for what they want to do. Plus, Sanchez has proven that he can play under pressure and will not wilt.

On defense, Rex has done a good job patching up their DL both years when their most dominant guy (Jenkins) has been out. Plus, they have a shut down CB who can take out opposing offenses #1 receiver. Most important thing with his defense is that it doesn't seem to be too difficult and guys who are not superstars seem to thrive in it.

Again, I can't stand them, but they have a legit operation going on over there now and they no longer will be pushovers.

goheels22002 · Jan 24, 2011

condon84 said:
Ridiculous premise of a thread. The Jets have the two most important things that you need to be successful in this league: a good HC, and a good QB.

Rex has proven himself to be a good HC. And Sanchez has played well under the big lights. His two appearance in the playoffs have been pretty good and I see no reason why he should regress.

The Jets are a legit problem for us now and in the future.

I agree. The Jets, like this year, are a very attractive place for top-tier FAs to go, even at a discount. A chance to win, definitely in the spotlight, NYC as a place where all sorts of endorsements are available, a coaching staff that knows the path to the playoffs, no issues with speaking your mind. The Jets will do well in free agency, especially if the rosters are expanded under the CBA in preparation for a longer season.

This is not bad for the Patriots. A well-stoked rivalry between quality teams begets more quality players and coaches. Think about the difference between the Chiefs-Raiders and the Colts-Patriots over the past 10 years. As the Chiefs and Raiders declined the media coverage and TV schedule dropped off the map while the Pats - Colts annual prime time regular season game became a national event. As the Colts evolve to who knows what, a Jets-Pats feud on the order of the Yankees-Red Sox is all good.

The Taylor twins are a great example. Jason Taylor bolted the Redskins to get on the big stage and Fred Taylor left Jacksonville to take a shot at extending his career with the Patriots and maybe win a SB. Neither made that big a difference to their new teams at the ends of their careers, but the choice of the Jets or Pats for them was way better than more money in Cleveland or Buffalo, or at a discount with their former teams.

The Jets will figure this cap stuff out and may be able to add pieces if the owners don't screw the pooch with the CBA. Remember, a rookie cap changes a lot of the equation, as does expanded rosters and a higher cap if the players get a bigger bite of the revenue apple.

SVN · Jan 24, 2011

Deus Irae said:
We can't really make sure claims about any team until we've got the new financial parameters of the next CBA. There are just too many unknowns. For example: Kris Jenkins is due over $3.5 million. Does anyone expect the Jets to keep him around at that price if the cap is an issue? It's not as if they were unable to get by without him over the past two seasons, after all.

This. And they may actually find good replacements for gholtston and jason taylor and improve their pass rush. No two teams are same every yr anyway. We will never know until september if their window is shut because they have young players still @QB RB etc. So they are going to be around IMO.

SVN · Jan 24, 2011

AndyJohnson said:
Snachez has had a top 5 defense and top 5 running game. To give him credit for getting to 2 big games before failing is ignoring how the team won games.

he has ways to go before being in the top class but manning /brady/rothlisberger all needed help from their D's and running in getting to the SB in the last 7-8 yrs.

Mangold74 · Jan 24, 2011

The Jets knew that some of these players were probably not going to be coming back. They also don't know what the new CBA will be. No question that the under the old CBA that the Pats are in a better situation then the Jets.

With that being said they will re-sign either Braylon or Santonio and Harris. Cromatie and I believe Santonio will be let go because you just can't have that much money tied into WR/CB.

The players that concern me are Brad Smith, Eric Smith and Brodney Pool. The Smith's aren't anything more then average from scrimmage but their overall ability on special teams and to the roles they play on defense are offense are important to what the Jets do. Someone will probably offer Brad Smith more money then he's worth.

Taylor, Tomlinson, Ellis, Jenkins, Woody, Bryan Thomas, Richardson and Pryce may all see the door as well. They will get cap savings from players being cut, retiring or being restructed.

They will have to do a mini rebuild on the front 7 on defense over the next 2 off seasons. That's the only area on the team that will really be hurt by aging and the salary cap.

You guys love to trash our draft class from 2010 but Ducasse should be the starting right tackle in 2011, Kyle Wilson should take over for Cromatie, Mcknight should be splitting carries with Greene and John Connor will be playing fullback.

No question that Belicheck has put the Pats in a better situation going into 2011 but Ryan and Sanchez are only going to get better. They are 24-14 overall and 3-2 versus the Pats. They might take a slight step back in talent in 2011 but the Jets aren't going anywhere and neither are the Pats. The division is going to be a war for a long time.

MoLewisrocks · Jan 24, 2011

ivanvamp said:
So is the link that was given (NFL Salaries 2010, NFL Salaries Cap, NFL Salaries By Position, Team.) their payroll or salary cap number?

Neither. This is likely the total of base 2010 salaries. Cap would include pro rated portion of any amortized bonuses. Payroll would include everything the team actually paid out in the current season, including bonuses. Some sites that that a step further and include bonus money that is guaranteed even if it isn't paid out this season. That is why reports seemingly are conflicting, they are often comparing apples and oranges.

WhiZa · Jan 24, 2011

jsull87 said:
other factor that people aren't talking about we had about 14 million in cap space taken up by moss and adalius who we cut and traded this year... that will be put to use next year.

and 11 million on bodden and warren who'll return... so there is money going to use right there... now that i am taking a closer look at the numbers here i honestly can see no reason why BB if he sees anyone he likes that he shouldn't go get them. We have the cap room, draft picks and Seasoned Vet starters coming back.

I can't believe it but i this is the 1st time i have felt better NFL wise since the jets loss laying all that out infront of me

I'm pretty sure the fact that Moss was traded means there is no cap hit. AT would have one tho

Rob0729 · Jan 24, 2011

Mangold74 said:
You guys love to trash our draft class from 2010 but Ducasse should be the starting right tackle in 2011, Kyle Wilson should take over for Cromatie, Mcknight should be splitting carries with Greene and John Connor will be playing fullback.

Considering many Jets fans were trashing the Pats 2010 draft as a bust before the 2010 season, you should be surprised that we trash your 2010 draft after the season when that draft class showed absolutely nothing their first year?

The idea that Wilson will replace Cromartie at starting CB should petrify you at this point. The guy can barely get playing time as a back up and looks lost when he does play.

Ducasse can't even dress most games. What makes you so sure that he can start at RT? Again, him taking over the starting spot might not be a good thing.

McKinight may be splitting time with Greene, but that doesn't mean he will be effective.

Hey, Darius Butler started for the Pats in his second year. Does that mean he was a good pick. He started right? Great pick.

Not one of the Jets' 2010 draft picks have yet to show they can be a good role player, nevermind a starter. They might all turn it around in 2011, but right now they are in the disapointment to bust range.

Ice_Ice_Brady · Jan 24, 2011

Mangold74 said:
The Jets knew that some of these players were probably not going to be coming back. They also don't know what the new CBA will be. No question that the under the old CBA that the Pats are in a better situation then the Jets.

With that being said they will re-sign either Braylon or Santonio and Harris. Cromatie and I believe Santonio will be let go because you just can't have that much money tied into WR/CB.

The players that concern me are Brad Smith, Eric Smith and Brodney Pool. The Smith's aren't anything more then average from scrimmage but their overall ability on special teams and to the roles they play on defense are offense are important to what the Jets do. Someone will probably offer Brad Smith more money then he's worth.

Taylor, Tomlinson, Ellis, Jenkins, Woody, Bryan Thomas, Richardson and Pryce may all see the door as well. They will get cap savings from players being cut, retiring or being restructed.

They will have to do a mini rebuild on the front 7 on defense over the next 2 off seasons. That's the only area on the team that will really be hurt by aging and the salary cap.

You guys love to trash our draft class from 2010 but Ducasse should be the starting right tackle in 2011, Kyle Wilson should take over for Cromatie, Mcknight should be splitting carries with Greene and John Connor will be playing fullback.

No question that Belicheck has put the Pats in a better situation going into 2011 but Ryan and Sanchez are only going to get better. They are 24-14 overall and 3-2 versus the Pats. They might take a slight step back in talent in 2011 but the Jets aren't going anywhere and neither are the Pats. The division is going to be a war for a long time.

Wow, that is some great kool-aid you are drinking there. A "slight step back in talent" could only be mustered by some of the bigger homers in the league. All offseason Jets fans acknowledged that the team was going all-in and the future be damned. Now that the gamble has not paid off, I like how Jets fans now want to have their cake and eat it, too.

The fact is the Jets are screwed, and deep down you know it. Without an upper echelon quarterback, this isn't a team that can count on a minimum of ten wins every year. You guys treaded a very thin line between 11-5 and 8-8 with some last second miracles this season. That was with a team that was built for the present.

Which players on the Jets do you expect to improve, and how will the Jets improve from where they are now? You mention some weak draft picks this year and seem to think it's a good thing that they'll be starting next season, despite their below average stature in the NFL. The Jets have decisions to make on whether to cut some veterans or risk them continuing to decline with age, with no backup plan in place. It's too late to hail your draft talk about developing young players; you guys already sold that out two years ago.

Have fun at 6-10 next year while still believing you are close. The Jets went for a nine-man overload blitz and got burned.

Mangold74 · Jan 24, 2011

SVN said:
he has ways to go before being in the top class but manning /brady/rothlisberger all needed help from their D's and running in getting to the SB in the last 7-8 yrs.

Rob0729 said:
Considering many Jets fans were trashing the Pats 2010 draft as a bust before the 2010 season, you should be surprised that we trash your 2010 draft after the season when that draft class showed absolutely nothing their first year?

The idea that Wilson will replace Cromartie at starting CB should petrify you at this point. The guy can barely get playing time as a back up and looks lost when he does play.

Ducasse can't even dress most games. What makes you so sure that he can start at RT? Again, him taking over the starting spot might not be a good thing.

McKinight may be splitting time with Greene, but that doesn't mean he will be effective.

Hey, Darius Butler started for the Pats in his second year. Does that mean he was a good pick. He started right? Great pick.

Not one of the Jets' 2010 draft picks have yet to show they can be a good role player, nevermind a starter. They might all turn it around in 2011, but right now they are in the disapointment to bust range.

I liked your draft, most of you guys thought your first round pick was a special teams player and he seems to be a heck of a cornerback. You guys had enough picks and it seems like at least the first 4 picks were all good picks not to mention Hernandez and Mesko. Great job by your front office.

If Ducasse and Wilson suck it will be a major set back but Ducasse was a project from Umass and Wilson got caught up in the Revis mess playing inside and outside in one of the more difficult schemes for a rookie to learn.

You can't make excuses but neither one played enough to say that they are good or aren't good.

SVN · Jan 24, 2011

Mangold74 said:
The Jets knew that some of these players were probably not going to be coming back. They also don't know what the new CBA will be. No question that the under the old CBA that the Pats are in a better situation then the Jets.

With that being said they will re-sign either Braylon or Santonio and Harris. Cromatie and I believe Santonio will be let go because you just can't have that much money tied into WR/CB.

The players that concern me are Brad Smith, Eric Smith and Brodney Pool. The Smith's aren't anything more then average from scrimmage but their overall ability on special teams and to the roles they play on defense are offense are important to what the Jets do. Someone will probably offer Brad Smith more money then he's worth.

Taylor, Tomlinson, Ellis, Jenkins, Woody, Bryan Thomas, Richardson and Pryce may all see the door as well. They will get cap savings from players being cut, retiring or being restructed.

They will have to do a mini rebuild on the front 7 on defense over the next 2 off seasons. That's the only area on the team that will really be hurt by aging and the salary cap.

You guys love to trash our draft class from 2010 but Ducasse should be the starting right tackle in 2011, Kyle Wilson should take over for Cromatie, Mcknight should be splitting carries with Greene and John Connor will be playing fullback.

No question that Belicheck has put the Pats in a better situation going into 2011 but Ryan and Sanchez are only going to get better. They are 24-14 overall and 3-2 versus the Pats. They might take a slight step back in talent in 2011 but the Jets aren't going anywhere and neither are the Pats. The division is going to be a war for a long time.

most important player the jets need back is david harris

Mangold74 · Jan 24, 2011

SVN said:
most important player the jets need back is david harris

Assuming they have a franchise tag it will probably go to him.

I want back:
Harris
Braylon
Eric Smith

I expect to lose:
Santonio
Baby maker
Brad Smith

PatsDeb · Jan 24, 2011

Forget the Jets. Who cares if their window is shut. I just want to know that ours isn't. On to next year!! I know I am recovering from this year's heartbreak because I am starting to look forward to the draft.

Deus Irae · Jan 24, 2011

Mangold74 said:
Assuming they have a franchise tag it will probably go to him.

I want back:
Harris
Braylon
Eric Smith

I expect to lose:
Santonio
Baby maker
Brad Smith

If the Jets decide to keep Edwards instead of Holmes, Tannenbaum should be fired before the ink dries on the Edwards contract.

MoLewisrocks · Jan 24, 2011

NEGoldenAge said:
My bad on the link, but there's plenty of articles they write where they quote "league sources" and don't throw it in the rumor section. There is a reason it is in that section.

Just to try and clarify this for you, payroll and salary and cap are three different things and media often get them muddled.

Brady, Bodden and Wilfork counted $27.5M against the cap this season. There combined "salaries" were $14.4M. But they were paid almost $45M between them in 2010(including signing and roster bonuses as well as base salary), although Brady had $10M of his $16M signing bonus deferred to be paid in August of 2011 (so it's debatable whether that guaranteed amount would count as payroll in 2010 or 2011...). Either way there is no way we had a $99M payroll... although technically we probably didn't have a $148M one either. What we probably had was close to the cap # Miguel projected us at of $135M.

You cannot exceed cap in "payroll" continually (cash over cap which will be amortized over 4-6 seasons) or you won't remain at or below the cap functionally without wholesale cap cuts. What generally happens is exceeding for a year or two (in which you pay some stiff signing bonuses to add expensive draft or FA talent to the roster) followed by falling well below for a year or two (when you simply are maintaining the roster and adding just low level FA and draft picks).

MrTibbs · Jan 24, 2011

naf stap said:

lmao!!!!!!!!!

MoLewisrocks · Jan 24, 2011

Deus Irae said:
If the Jets decide to keep Edwards instead of Holmes, Tannenbaum should be fired before the ink dries on the Edwards contract.

Oh, I don't know. The Steelers did OK letting him go...

Santonio Holmes not happy with playing time, game plan | ProFootballTalk

And so it begins...the JETS 2011 off season may be the real hard knocks offseason.

Deus Irae · Jan 24, 2011

MoLewisrocks said:
Oh, I don't know. The Steelers did OK letting him go...

Santonio Holmes not happy with playing time, game plan | ProFootballTalk

And so it begins...the JETS 2011 off season may be the real hard knocks offseason.

The Steelers already had Ward and struck gold with Wallace. The Jets don't have receivers like that lying around to pick up the slack.

Jets window is now shut

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