Jason Pierre-Paul, Everson Griffen and Carlos Dunlap

I think the knocks on Dunlap are a little unfair. First off real red flag is the DUI, granted that is a large red flag but the kid was only 20 years old. I don't know too many people who can look back at their late teens/early twenties and say I never made a stupid decision, maybe they didn't get caught, but everybody probably did something.

Secondly, Dunlap was considered a top 5 pick until about February. He was on TV nearly every week and played for one of the most well covered teams in the country. I never heard anyone question his work ethic until after the season, that seems suspicious to me. I may be way off base here but don't you think with all the attention the Gators get that his work ethic problems would have come out sooner?

Thirdly, he had back to back seasons of 9.5 sacks in the most talented conference in the country. One would think that would be pretty difficult to achieve if you weren't trying all the time.

Finally, when I see him on tape he is always around the pile and often around the ball. It also sure seemed like teams were not running his way when he was in the game. I personally believe him to be the closing thing to Willie McGinest that we have had a chance to draft in forever. I would be very happy to see him at 22.

Seneschal2 said:

All three are not on my board for one very sound reason.

First, to employ the annual draft quote - "There's no such thing as a sure thing." Just think about that for a moment...then consider this: If you're Belichick, wouldn't you select the surest thing in round one, and not those with questions/concerns about work ethic, smarts, and proven production? IMO, round one is not where you gamble and take a chance on greatness with players who are reportedly lacking the key criteria (especially effort and consistency) -- no matter how great the need. The first pick ought to be reserved for the prospect who clearly fits the Pats profile, not a player who needs to be coached up or resurrected. Surely there's at least one player who fits the Pats MO...

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As much as I love Carlos Dunlap, this is a GREAT post

Insomnia took over last night so I watched vidoe of all the OLB/DEs prospects projected to go in the top 45. What I was looking for was players that physically dominated the guy across from them on the line of scrimmage.
Morgan is a 4-3 DE that has the physical tools to be a 3 down guy, but not an explosive pass rusher.
JPP....slow first step, lacked agility, huge wing span, guy can jump like MJ...screamed project
Sapp, Hughes....looked great going around the edge, but weren't physical enough to get me to believe they could be dominant at the next level.
Kindle...a heck of an athlete that thrived in a Texas D that schemed more than any D I watched. He wasn't physically dominating, but played smart.
Graham...PHYSICALLY dominated his opponent, especially vs left tackle. What can I say, the guy is an unrelenting beast. He's not Freeney because of the speed, but the guy is a football player through and through. Insert him in the lineup his first year, and you know what kind of effort you will get. Can he cover a TE? Maybe not
Griffen....this guy intrigues me. He is built strong, he has the quicks, great spin move. I see a similar body structure in both Griffen and Morgan...sturdy bone structure with athleticism. Griffen got his times down into the 4.5s last week....He is the "Freak"

Based on my extensive (2 minute clips) YouTube midnight madness, my new 2 round Pats picks. I want BB to maneuver his picks to grab Graham, Griffen, the best TE remaining in the 2nd round( partial to Graham, Miami), and end up with a third.
Graham is worthy of the first, solid starter with no worries attached. Expect 5 years of solid play...much like Warren.
Griffen...Physically...best combo of size, strength speed....As far as attitude, seems just about every USC guy gets currupted a bit in the loosy goosy USC program. Time served at Patriots U could be just the answer.
Any TE that they want...what do I know. (this Graham kid is some target, but raw)
If the Pats can use the #1 and the 3 #2s to land Graham, Griffen, TE, and a third for a WR....I will be content.

Pats will not draft a project in round 1. First round pick is expected to play on 3 downs and ST so it is why I don't expect an OLB there except a prospect who can make the conversion easily or already played at OLB at college (Kindle for example).

Seneschal2 said:

All three are not on my board for one very sound reason.

If you're Belichick, wouldn't you select the surest thing in round one, and not those with questions/concerns about work ethic, smarts, and proven production? IMO, round one is not where you gamble and take a chance on greatness with players who are reportedly lacking the key criteria (especially effort and consistency) -- no matter how great the need. The first pick ought to be reserved for the prospect who clearly fits the Pats profile, not a player who needs to be coached up or resurrected. Surely there's at least one player who fits the Pats MO...

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Sounds like POUNCEY to me....no flaws...no risks !! .......and I couldn't agree more with your thesis.

It isn't so much that I'm a Dunlap fan as much as I'm curious to why this player is being overly criticized for a DUI strike. Perhaps, he's no longer a first round prospect but surely he holds value in subsequent rounds.

See, I don't get the analyst below... I mean didn't New England draft Brandon Meriweather in the first round despite him being involved in the Florida International and Miami brawl incident.

Oftentimes, you've to consider the teams and coaching staffs in the league. Can these players improve with better coaching? Also, teams do conduct interviews before the draft when they come in to visit. I think New England got some insight on the incident and of his character once they'd had an opportunity to interview Meriweather.

Player:
Carlos Dunlap- DE- FLA.

BUST-O-METER:
7 out of 10

Thoughts:
Carlos Dunlap is one of those players that when you see in the gym or at workouts you are left with that special tingling feeling. Dunlap has that rare size and athletic ability that makes you believe that he will be a dominate pass rusher. The problem arises when Dunlap tries to put it all together. Dunlap often negates his physical abilities with poor technique and lack of concentration. Dunlap also character concerns. Dunlap was arrested for a DUI just a few days before the SEC championship game against Alabama. This poor decision has many NFL teams questioning his maturity and commitment to the game.

These issues have lead to a slide in Dunlap’s draft stock, which lead to his 7 out of 10 on the Bust-O-Meter. Dunlap’s draft position will have a lot to do about his bust potential. It’s obvious that Dunlap has the talent to succeed at the next level but does he have the drive and maturity? I have a feeling that as draft day nears teams will focus more on the ability and less on the character which could lead to a team over drafting Dunlap.

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#6 BUST-O-METER: Carlos Dunlap | NFL Mocks | Covering the 2010 NFL Draft & Your #1 NFL Mock Draft Database

DW Toys said:

It will take around $4.5m to sign RFA Ray Edwards. It will cost us #22 for his Team the Vikes. Young 26, NFL experienced, 11 sacks the last eleven games. I say again...No brainer! The Vikes use that pick for Clausen. Who is better for us at that #22?
Answer? NADA.
DW Toys

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You are delusional if you think there is any chance that Clausen is available at or anywhere near 22.

eagle eye said:

You are delusional if you think there is any chance that Clausen is available at or anywhere near 22.

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No, he's not. There's a lot of teams that will pass on him.

The Seahawks traded for Whitehurst and still have Hasselback.
The Browns have said they're not that interested in Clausen (but this may be a smoke screen).
The Bills have 3 possible starting QBs on their roster right now, and a major need at LT.
The 49ers want to see what Alex Smith can do with a proper OC.

If he gets past the 49ers at 13/17, who's taking him?

Giants have Manning. Titans have Young. Steelers have Big Ben. Falcons have Ryan. Texans have Schuab. Bengals have Palmer. Whoops....it's the Patriots on the clock now, at 22.

Seneschal2 said:

All three are not on my board for one very sound reason.

First, to employ the annual draft quote - "There's no such thing as a sure thing." Just think about that for a moment...then consider this: If you're Belichick, wouldn't you select the surest thing in round one, and not those with questions/concerns about work ethic, smarts, and proven production? IMO, round one is not where you gamble and take a chance on greatness with players who are reportedly lacking the key criteria (especially effort and consistency) -- no matter how great the need. The first pick ought to be reserved for the prospect who clearly fits the Pats profile, not a player who needs to be coached up or resurrected. Surely there's at least one player who fits the Pats MO...

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Just to clarify: None of the three are on your board at all or do you mean not on your board in round 1?

I have no issues with your line of thinking if it is solely for the first round. However that line of thinking would probably prevent the Patriots from ever drafting an OLB in round 1. It is very unlikely that their will be a player with proven production in a 3-4 defense similar to what the Patriots run available in the draft. It's likely always going to be a projection pick taking a guy who was a 4-3 end or played in a different scheme in college and projecting them to the OLB position.

The effort/consistency questions have me wary of Dunlap and Griffen and the lack of experience has me wary of Pierre-Paul. Those questions collide with my desire to vastly upgrade the pass rush and overall athleticism at OLB. Guys who fit the profile are few and far between and I'd hate to pass on the next DeMarcus Ware or Willie McGinest.

I do think you have to be willing to take chances on guys with outstanding athletic ability at some point in the draft or you end up with a team that won't have enough difference makers to win a championship. If the idea is to avoid questions in round 1 while taking a good football player, I can see value in that. However, that should be balanced out by looking at guys with high upsides in later rounds (maybe a Ricky Sapp in round 2 or a Clifton Geathers or Jimmy Graham later on).

Nonentity said:

No, he's not. There's a lot of teams that will pass on him.

The Seahawks traded for Whitehurst and still have Hasselback.
The Browns have said they're not that interested in Clausen (but this may be a smoke screen).
The Bills have 3 possible starting QBs on their roster right now, and a major need at LT.
The 49ers want to see what Alex Smith can do with a proper OC.

If he gets past the 49ers at 13/17, who's taking him?

Giants have Manning. Titans have Young. Steelers have Big Ben. Falcons have Ryan. Texans have Schuab. Bengals have Palmer. Whoops....it's the Patriots on the clock now, at 22.

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Well he is never getting past the Bills, you say they have 3 possible starters, which one would you call a top QB or close to it? None of them imo.
And if by some ridiculous fortune he gets as far as the Steelers they will deffo take him given Big Ben's current troubles but he won't be available when the top 10 have picked.

eagle eye said:

Well he is never getting past the Bills, you say they have 3 possible starters, which one would you call a top QB or close to it? None of them imo.

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I didn't say that any of them were top QBs. But you don't know that Clausen is either. Don't even bother to bring up his Pro Day - QB pro days are the most ridiculous thing ever, full of easy scripted throws and receivers that the QB has been throwing to for years.

I think they will take a LT and see if one of their QBs can make it behind a decent offensive line. It looks like a good draft class for QBs next year.

eagle eye said:

And if by some ridiculous fortune he gets as far as the Steelers they will deffo take him given Big Ben's current troubles but he won't be available when the top 10 have picked.

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You really think they're going to dump the QB who has led them to 2 Lombardi Trophies? Not a chance.

eagle eye said:

Well he is never getting past the Bills, you say they have 3 possible starters, which one would you call a top QB or close to it? None of them imo.
And if by some ridiculous fortune he gets as far as the Steelers they will deffo take him given Big Ben's current troubles but he won't be available when the top 10 have picked.

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Point is that the Bills can use him, but they have so many needs on offensive line, it's hard to justify taking Clausen. Their best OL Wood is coming off major surgery and just started walking in January. Their other guard had a pretty good rookie season. The other three are journeymen/trash with no depth behind them. There's no reason to take a quarterback if you don't have a hope in hell of protecting him. If Bulaga or Williams is on the board when Buffalo is on the clock, they'd be absolute fools not to draft him and either target McCoy later in the draft, or sign/trade a vet free agent for a year or two and wait until next year. I'll bet a guy like Jason Campbell could probably be had for a 6th round pick, and it's definitely worth kicking the tires on Marc Bulger. At least he's used to being hit 15 times a game.

I don't know if Clausen lasts until 22, but he'll probably fall outside of the top 15, and 19-25 seems plausible.

Jason Worilds and O'Brien Schofield (before he tore his ACL) are both interesting players that could be worthwhile in later rounds.



Defensive drafting: Top end rushers - Rotoworld.com

Neither Griffen or Dunlap went in the late first round.

I'd a feeling Kindle's stock would drop after reading this but not out of the first round.

In 2007, Kindle was arrested for drunken driving and suspended three games. His license was suspended, he attended mandatory Alcoholics Anonymous meetings and he performed 60 hours of community service.

Last June, Kindle suffered a concussion when the car he was driving in Austin, Texas, slammed into an apartment building. He didn't report the incident to police until the next morning.

At the combine, Kindle said the accident occurred because he was texting. Also at the combine, he told the Journal Sentinel that he no longer used alcohol.

Several sources said Kindle also suffers from narcolepsy, a disorder in which he would fall asleep in meetings and Longhorn coaches wondered what was wrong with him. He takes medication that has controlled the narcolepsy and an attention-deficit issue.

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Jerry Hughes an option if elite offensive linemen are taken - JSOnline