Bill Simmons "hears" that Moss and AD are gone, BB is "blowing it up"

mb6592 said:

Like I said, anecdotal evidence aside. I never played football, but I would think it translates to this sport as well - some people embrace pressure (or convince themselves that it doesn't exist or it doesn't matter), while others, for all their talent, do not. If you don't know what I'm talking about, that's fine, my wife doesn't either. Maybe it doesn't translate to football... Like I said, even though I root against him, Jeter knows what I'm talking about, so does Welker and Rice - you don't disappear when it gets juicy. This is no knock on Moss. He was obviously injured the end of this year, but I do have reservations as he does appear to be a little needy.

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You never played any sport at the professional level so it really doesn't matter what you or others feel in your amateur leagues.

Jeter has no idea wtf you are talking about because his postseason stats are IDENTICAL to his regular season stats. These guys are PROFESSIONAL for a reason.

Look at Moss' career playoff numbers, they aren't "disappearing". And Welker's numbers would be pretty bad in the 2009 playoffs if he were healthy and Moss was out, so I don't know what exactly you think you know but you are wrong.

emoney_33 said:

You never played any sport at the professional level so it really doesn't matter what you or others feel in your amateur leagues.

Jeter has no idea wtf you are talking about because his postseason stats are IDENTICAL to his regular season stats. These guys are PROFESSIONAL for a reason.

Look at Moss' career playoff numbers, they aren't "disappearing". And Welker's numbers would be pretty bad in the 2009 playoffs if he were healthy and Moss was out, so I don't know what exactly you think you know but you are wrong.

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God, you are an idiot. Trust me, he does. I don't know about Moss, but have you never noticed how some athletes thrive on pressure (by either remaining unnaturally calm or unnaturally intense) while others seem to wilt under pressure?

teknos1s said:

I couldnt find 2009 WR salaries but just to name a few WRS whogot paid 4mil range or lower in 08

Donald driver
T.J Houz
greg jennings
roy williams
boldin
stokley
austin miles
brandon marshall
reggie wayne
derrick mason
roddy white
steve breaston
hines ward

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Now you are getting silly. You couldn't get any of these guys on the open market for $4M and to get them in a trade would be costly. So once again, you cannot get 2 $4M receivers to help the team more than Moss. Let's live in the real world not the fantasy world where we can pick and choose whoever we want from any team.

the list goes on and on - im gonna go out on a limb and say there are some effin quuualllliity WRs for that price and id take two of them over one moss any day - especially character guys like ward who bring in the intangibles and nitty gritty

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OK detail the exact 2 you would take, their current FA status, the likelihood of them accepting $4M and/or their trade value.

I know the contributions of moss all too well - however your lack of understanding of what welker brings to the table shows your lack of understanding of football because im sure patriots nation - along with NFL nation would pick wes over moss for their team any day because wes is a good football player who is a leader, tough as nails, doesnt ever put his head down and is inspiring to the locker the room and the guys he plays with - wes has got balls the size of a full grown elephant and makes the tough plays - i think your alone on this one

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You are just delusional if you think any NFL coach in the entire NFL, past or present, would ever pick Welker over Moss (unless Moss demanded huge money and Welker little which is different, we are talking about talent wise). For you to sit there and continuously argue that Welker is a better receiver than Moss is beyond ridiculous. EVERYONE (except you) knows that Moss helps Welker tremendously.

mb6592 said:

God, you are an idiot. Trust me, he does.

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lmfao 'Trust me, he does'. Yea I am the idiot Go check the numbers again, and tell THEN tell me why Jeter having 'it' got them knocked out of the playoffs 2001-2008. Tell me why Jeter couldn't help them close the deal when all they needed was ONE win in 2004 ALCS.

teknos1s said:

im not saying that at all but since your so hung up on stats - are you saying kelly washington is better than randy moss?

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teknos1s I have to wonder. Before you post, what exactly is it that you are thinking about?

mb6592 said:

I don't know about Moss, but have you never noticed how some athletes thrive on pressure (by either remaining unnaturally calm or unnaturally intense) while others seem to wilt under pressure?

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No it doesn't happen, they don't become "unnaturally calm" in pressure vs. other situations. They are who they are. Maybe a rare player or two had some anxiety issues and wilted but those are few and far between.

As has already been asked of you, why did Peyton or ARod all of a sudden stop wilting under pressure? Magic? They found 'it'? lol It's a delusional man's argument to point to some unproven magical phenomena to explain away happenstance.

emoney_33 said:

lmfao 'Trust me, he does'. Yea I am the idiot Go check the numbers again, and tell THEN tell me why Jeter having 'it' got them knocked out of the playoffs 2001-2008. Tell me why Jeter couldn't help them close the deal when all they needed was ONE win in 2004 ALCS.

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WTF is wrong with you, you geek. What I'm talking about has nothing to do with stats.

mb6592 said:

WTF is wrong with you, you geek. What I'm talking about has nothing to do with stats.

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I know it's magic. Jeter under pressure is equivalent to Jeter not under pressure. "geek" lol I love it

teknos1s said:

im not saying that at all but since your so hung up on stats - are you saying kelly washington is better than randy moss?

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I am confused, are you lost?

emoney_33 said:

You are just delusional if you think any NFL coach in the entire NFL, past or present, would ever pick Welker over Moss (unless Moss demanded huge money and Welker little which is different, we are talking about talent wise). For you to sit there and continuously argue that Welker is a better receiver than Moss is beyond ridiculous. EVERYONE (except you) knows that Moss helps Welker tremendously.

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You sir, are in idiot. Is moss a better WR than welker? YES! Does welker help the TEAM more?! YES! Just because someone is more talented doesn't mean they are better for the TEAM - You should LOVE the redskins - If more people on the patriots had welkers ethic grit we'd still be in the playoffs right now. If i could would i take marshall and boldin to long term contracts for 4-7 mill over moss? yea, i would

emoney_33 said:

I am confused, are you lost?

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if your confused...doesnt make that YOU lost?

emoney_33 said:

No it doesn't happen, they don't become "unnaturally calm" in pressure vs. other situations. They are who they are. Maybe a rare player or two had some anxiety issues and wilted but those are few and far between.

As has already been asked of you, why did Peyton or ARod all of a sudden stop wilting under pressure? Magic? They found 'it'? lol It's a delusional man's argument to point to some unproven magical phenomena to explain away happenstance.

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Yeah, pressure is a non-issue? Because everyone handles pressure the same way? Right? I'm not going to get into an argument with you because you were clearly not an athlete if you think pressure doesn't play a huge part in sports - momentum swings are primarily based on confidence and how pressure is handled - and because I hate you.

teknos1s said:

You sir, are in idiot. Is moss a better WR than welker? YES! Does welker help the TEAM more?! YES! Just because someone is more talented doesn't mean they are better for the TEAM - You should LOVE the redskins - If more people on the patriots had welkers ethic grit we'd still be in the playoffs right now. If i could would i take marshall and boldin to long term contracts for 4-7 mill over moss? yea, i would

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1.) Moss is better for the TEAM than Welker, this is fact. 2009 Patriots - Welker > 2009 Patriots - Moss. That's not even debateable.

2.) You cannot sign either one of Marshall or Boldin to $4M, and if you could put ONE of them opposite Moss for $7M this offense may have a chance to beat 2007.

teknos1s said:

if your confused...doesnt make that YOU lost?

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You pointed to ONE stat that has Washington ahead of Moss and then asked ME if it proved Washington better than Moss... I never said that stat proved anything. Are you so simple minded to believe that every single "stat" has equal meaning?

emoney_33 said:

1.) Moss is better for the TEAM than Welker, this is fact. 2009 Patriots - Welker > 2009 Patriots - Moss. That's not even debateable.

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id love to debate that actually

mb6592 said:

I'm not going to get into an argument with you because you were clearly not an athlete if you think pressure doesn't enter the picture and because I hate you.

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lol I am not a PROFESSIONAL athlete, and neither are you. "pressure" effects the amateurs (although not so much me, I guess I have 'it') far more than it effects professionals. But yea continue to think you know me so you can stay in your pretend world of magical pressure powers.

Man do people love to get on Moss because of the reputation he brought from the Raiders. Alot of us seem to forget that in 999 of 1,000 universes, Randy Moss caught the Super Bowl winning, 19-0 making, game winning touchdown in Super Bowl 42. THAT is getting it done when the pressure is on.

If our defense had any balls and/or good hands at all on that last drive, this argument would be moot and Randy would be regarded in New England as a hero.

emoney_33 said:

You pointed to ONE stat that has Washington ahead of Moss and then asked ME if it proved Washington better than Moss... I never said that stat proved anything. Are you so simple minded to believe that every single "stat" has equal meaning?

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This all stemmed from the fact that you were hung up on stats and i said stats dont tell the whole story. and since you wanted to push otherwise i'd play your game and chose a few important stats such as 1st down catches in crucial situations i.e 3rd down or catching percentage which your daddy randy moss doesn't have a catch percentage in the top 20 in the nfl - and me saying that id prefer 2 hypothetical WRs which were decent to good over 1 randy moss due to the fact that randy is too specialized to one aspect of the game - the deep ball. and that the deep ball has a low percentage completion rate and that i would prefer WRs who could generate 15-25 yard gains per reception and gain some YAC. I can see this is going no where because it boils down to simple preference of having one really good thing or having two good things. Obviously our preferences are different and i tend to like to spread my assets around more and you like to put all your eggs into one basket - good day sir

blackglass3 said:

Man do people love to get on Moss because of the reputation he brought from the Raiders. Alot of us seem to forget that in 999 of 1,000 universes, Randy Moss caught the Super Bowl winning, 19-0 making, game winning touchdown in Super Bowl 42. THAT is getting it done when the pressure is on.

If our defense had any balls and/or good hands at all on that last drive, this argument would be moot and Randy would be regarded in New England as a hero.

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Or if Mike Carey understood the concept of "in the grasp". . . .

blackglass3 said:

Man do people love to get on Moss because of the reputation he brought from the Raiders. Alot of us seem to forget that in 999 of 1,000 universes, Randy Moss caught the Super Bowl winning, 19-0 making, game winning touchdown in Super Bowl 42. THAT is getting it done when the pressure is on.

If our defense had any balls and/or good hands at all on that last drive, this argument would be moot and Randy would be regarded in New England as a hero.

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That is without a doubt true. And there is no doubt that he was injured this year. And yet, at least for me, there's just something - I guess it is his reputation that gives me pause. That's my Moss' wife (her handle is emoney_33) and I have argued some.