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Poor Bills- Moving a 2nd game to Toronto


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Please, oh please, let it be a Pats game!
 
Get your popcorn ready! :)
 
Please, oh please, let it be a Pats game!

amen to that. Its a nice two hour flight for me. I'd be circling that date on my calendar.
 
Patriots will rule the games!!! Git ya popcorn ready!! TO will be arguing with Edwards then the collapse of the "Buffalo" Bills.
 
Patriots will rule the games!!! Git ya popcorn ready!! TO will be arguing with Edwards then the collapse of the "Buffalo" Bills.

Man if that went down in the Dome under the Needle, I would be a joyful boy!
 
So the Pats could play in three different countries next year......


Four if you count the Meadowlands... ;)
 
Can Toronto really support 2 football teams? I'm unaware of the population there.
 
Can Toronto really support 2 football teams? I'm unaware of the population there.

Easily. The Leafs haven't tried to win for years and people don't care and still attend every game. There's tons of people and a lot of money. It's the perfect environment for the Bills. (Heck Raptors, Jays, Argos, Leafs, et al.)

Winning Not Required + Money = Bills Destination

I'll be surprised if the move doesn't happen.

-Rob-
 
Easily. The Leafs haven't tried to win for years and people don't care and still attend every game. There's tons of people and a lot of money. It's the perfect environment for the Bills. (Heck Raptors, Jays, Argos, Leafs, et al.)

Winning Not Required + Money = Bills Destination

I'll be surprised if the move doesn't happen.

-Rob-




It would be better for the franchise...Toronto is an incredible city and the longterm benefits of being their far outweigh Buffalo, NY.
On the other hand, I feel bad for Buffalo - the city has nothing to offer. The fans live for the Bills and the only thing worse than having a losing team is no team at all.
 
So apparently the conversion to the Toronto Bills will be a slow transition of adding one game per year. So in 7 more years the transition will be done. The league can deny it all they want, but they are definitely trying to build a strong fan base in Toronto to possibly make a permanent transition. Buffalo is a dying city. They just can't continue to support the Bills as long as players salaries continue to spiral upwards.
 
Can Toronto really support 2 football teams? I'm unaware of the population there.

I don't think the Argos and the NFL draw from the same fan base, generally speaking. Regardless, the NFL would trump the CFL.

The GTA (Greater Toronto Area) has a population of 5.5 million people.
 
It would be better for the franchise...Toronto is an incredible city and the longterm benefits of being their far outweigh Buffalo, NY.
On the other hand, I feel bad for Buffalo - the city has nothing to offer. The fans live for the Bills and the only thing worse than having a losing team is no team at all.

Buffalo, since I moved here four years ago, is a much better city than people make it out to be. I could go on and on. I was ignorant about it before I moved here for a job, and most people speak out of ignorance about it. It really is a beautiful city unlike so many I've been to in the US.
 
Just for some context as to what the money people are thinking in linking up Toronto and Buffalo: The Buffalo Mega-Region: Bigger Than We Know : Opinion : The Buffalo News

The Bills in Toronto is a novelty right now. They didn't sell out the first game, and even the Canadian fans said they preferred the games in Orchard Park (I think I know why, fully 50% of the DUI arrests after a Bills game are Canadians, even though they only make up 20% of the season ticket base in Buffalo).
 
Just for some context as to what the money people are thinking in linking up Toronto and Buffalo: The Buffalo Mega-Region: Bigger Than We Know : Opinion : The Buffalo News

The Bills in Toronto is a novelty right now. They didn't sell out the first game, and even the Canadian fans said they preferred the games in Orchard Park (I think I know why, fully 50% of the DUI arrests after a Bills game are Canadians, even though they only make up 20% of the season ticket base in Buffalo).

Well, they were charging a ridiculous amount for that one game (something like $200 a ticket even for average seats) because they guaranteed a certain amount of money to the Bills. It wasn't sold out because people in Toronto don't have $800 to bring the family to one game.

If Toronto was in the US, it would be the fourth largest city. I bet that a non-sold out game in Toronto generates more revenue than a typical game in Orchard Park. It may not be an overnight thing, but Toronto could be a major NFL town over time.

The fact is that the Bills' days in Buffalo are probably numbered. The Bills' average ticket price (about $51) is the lowest in the NFL (and they can't sell out every game because the economy can't support it) and more than half of what the Pats charge per ticket (about $121). It will be impossible for the Bills to stay in Buffalo whether they go to Toronto or Los Angeles or somewhere else. The local economy cannot support an NFL team going forward especially if their is no salary cap. Well, they could survive like teams like the Pirates survive in MLB baseball basically being eliminated from playoff contention before the season even starts because their entire payroll couldn't even fund the Red Sox's infield. I don't think the NFL wants a MLB system where there is at least 5 or 6 teams that have absolutely no shot every year and they will force small market teams to relocate even if it is out of the country to avoid this especially if there is no cap.
 
Well, they were charging a ridiculous amount for that one game (something like $200 a ticket even for average seats) because they guaranteed a certain amount of money to the Bills. It wasn't sold out because people in Toronto don't have $800 to bring the family to one game.

If Toronto was in the US, it would be the fourth largest city. I bet that a non-sold out game in Toronto generates more revenue than a typical game in Orchard Park. It may not be an overnight thing, but Toronto could be a major NFL town over time.

The fact is that the Bills' days in Buffalo are probably numbered. The Bills' average ticket price (about $51) is the lowest in the NFL (and they can't sell out every game because the economy can't support it) and more than half of what the Pats charge per ticket (about $121). It will be impossible for the Bills to stay in Buffalo whether they go to Toronto or Los Angeles or somewhere else. The local economy cannot support an NFL team going forward especially if their is no salary cap. Well, they could survive like teams like the Pirates survive in MLB baseball basically being eliminated from playoff contention before the season even starts because their entire payroll couldn't even fund the Red Sox's infield. I don't think the NFL wants a MLB system where there is at least 5 or 6 teams that have absolutely no shot every year and they will force small market teams to relocate even if it is out of the country to avoid this especially if there is no cap.

The Bills average more than 70,000 a game, and they do sellout now. The stadium is perhaps too large, but 70,000 a game ain't bad. Buffalo is top 10 in attendance. If you look at income, they are not at the bottom. Their gross revenues are small, but since Ralph pays nothing for a stadium, gets tax money for its upkeep, they actually do well.

I agree with you that lack of a salary cap will kill Buffalo in the future, but that's a problem for the NFL. You have 32 franchises, some franchises are worse off than Buffalo--Jacksonville, Oakland, Cincinnati, etc.

You're going to find places for these teams to MOVE to. Maybe Toronto is one, though I have my doubts about a stadium that seats 50k MAX. More like in the 40k range.

What about the other teams? Where are they moving to? I think the NFL will have to get used to parity being a thing of the past, because the mega earning teams are now well beyond the half of the league.

Within 45 miles of downtown Buffalo, you still have over 3 million people living here. This doesn't include ANY of the Toronto metro area. That's still a substantial population base.
 
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