The more you think about it and see photos, it was a dirty hit..

Doggin94it said:

Folks, lunging at a QBs legs in order to tackle him is legal, just like lunging at a RBs legs in order to make a tackle is legal.

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No, no it is not

emoney_33 said:

No, no it is not

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Yes it is, so long as you aren't diving at the legs when you have other options to make a play - i.e. you blitz untouched and instead of hitting the QB high, you dive at his knees. If you are blocked to the ground, you don't need to stand up before trying to tackle the opposing QB.

it is what it is and it cant be changed but hell yah i think it looked dirty sure go ahead and grab at the legs but no need to put your helmet to the knee. And after it all he walked away happy. One word (Dink)

Doggin94it said:

Yes it is, so long as you aren't diving at the legs when you have other options to make a play - i.e. you blitz untouched and instead of hitting the QB high, you dive at his knees. If you are blocked to the ground, you don't need to stand up before trying to tackle the opposing QB.

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show me the rule that states it is OK to hit a QB in the knees as long as you start from the ground.

I'm going to try a nice excuse if I get caught drinking and driving, " I was just tryna make a play and get home not hurt anyone. "

How the hell was Wilfork's path to the QB last year any less "restricted" than Pollard's? Wilfork was pushed into Losman, Pollard had Morris on his back.

Wilfork hit Losman while falling down and trying to break his fall.

Pollard lunged from the ground helmet first into Brady's knee.

If what Wilkford did was against the rules, and apparently it was because he was fined, then what Pollard did is against the rules as well. Wilfork was restricted by a lineman pushing him, Pollard was restricted by Morris. What is the difference?

What does this rule only cover completely unblocked blitzers? Thats not how they enforced it against Wilfork.

Roy Williams' horse collar tackles were dirty before they outlawed them and will always be dirty. That doesn't mean he necessarily WANTS to break ankles or hurt receivers.

KontradictioN said:

Did you even watch the game? Morris took him to the ground and Pollard had to dig and claw at the turf with his hands and feet just to get in a crawling position to get to Brady, all the while with Morris on his back. Go to NFL.com and watch the actual play. Keep your eye on #34.

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Did you watch the game? Pollard chopped Morris who landed on him, Morris got off and pollard lunged at Brady's legs! Seen it over and over. I also think it was dirtier than VW's hit! I think it was "just football" and according to the rules, pollard should be fined.

emoney_33 said:

No, no it is not

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Can someone please post the rule against hitting below the knees. And not the one previously listed, as this rule was not broken.

lusdawg said:

Can someone please post the rule against hitting below the knees. And not the one previously listed, as this rule was not broken.

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Dirty Dirty Dirty!

emoney_33 said:

You are actually arguing stuff that doesn't matter. Trying to prove futile points with STILL pictures as if momentum and real-time has nothing to do with anything.

THe fact is he was blocked to the ground, Sammy got off him, he got to all 4's and LUNGED at Brady's legs... He didn't attempt to tackle anywhere, he just LUNGED at the knees. At best you can say is that it was a horrible decision by him without intent to injure. Regardless of intent, he should NOT have lunged at Brady's legs.

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Gross hyperbole is not going to win you this argument.

Morris took him to the ground and once Pollard was down, Morris was allowing him to get up because you can't lay on a blocked player. Morris wasn't allowing him to get up, stand up, he just wasn't laying on him. Pollard was knocked down and had a 230 pound RB badgering him. All the while, Brady still held the ball. Pollard, having to do his job, never relented and attempted to tackle Brady by reaching his arms out and hooking his legs. Brady, unfortunately, got injured on a play that has happened to him and countless other quarterbacks countless times without injury. It sucks.

But that doesn't make it illegal or dirty.

lusdawg said:

Can someone please post the rule against hitting below the knees. And not the one previously listed, as this rule was not broken.

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Post the rule that Wilfork broke last year.

bradmahn said:

Gross hyperbole is not going to win you this argument.

Morris took him to the ground and once Pollard was down, Morris was allowing him to get up because you can't lay on a blocked player. Morris wasn't allowing him to get up, stand up, he just wasn't laying on him. Pollard was knocked down and had a 230 pound RB badgering him. All the while, Brady still held the ball. Pollard, having to do his job, never relented and attempted to tackle Brady by reaching his arms out and hooking his legs. Brady, unfortunately, got injured on a play that has happened to him and countless other quarterbacks countless times without injury. It sucks.

But that doesn't make it illegal or dirty.

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WATCH THE PLAY AGAIN. He did not "reach his arms out", he LUNGED his entire body in a direct stream to Brady's knee.

So you are saying that Morris HAD to get off him and that he SHOULD have lunged at Brady's knees and not get up? Yea that's not friggin asking for more QB injuries or anything. Seriously, listen to yourself. IT WAS DIRTY...

Lunging at the knees, whether starting from standing or lying, is dirty period.

pheenix11 said:

How the hell was Wilfork's path to the QB last year any less "restricted" than Pollard's? Wilfork was pushed into Losman, Pollard had Morris on his back.

Wilfork hit Losman while falling down and trying to break his fall.

Pollard lunged from the ground helmet first into Brady's knee.

If what Wilkford did was against the rules, and apparently it was because he was fined, then what Pollard did is against the rules as well. Wilfork was restricted by a lineman pushing him, Pollard was restricted by Morris. What is the difference?

What does this rule only cover completely unblocked blitzers? Thats not how they enforced it against Wilfork.

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I'm fairly certain the league ruled Wilfork's hit dirty not because of the actual hit, but because the hit happened after Losman threw the ball (although not very long after). You can argue unnecessary roughness with Wilfork's, you can't with Pollard's (as per the NFL Rule Book).

bradmahn said:

I'm fairly certain the league ruled Wilfork's hit dirty not because of the actual hit, but because the hit happened after Losman threw the ball (although not very long after). You can argue unnecessary roughness with Wilfork's, you can't with Pollard's (as per the NFL Rule Book).

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You are being irrational by trying to force yourself to be rational so as to not look biased.

Maybe Goodell should post a memo stating that tackling (or attempting to do so) after being blocked/held is illegal. That would straighten all this out.

Ok, sarcasm aside, Pollard did not give up on the play and lunged at Brady from a low psoition because he had no other choice. Morris was draped all over him and Brady received the contact while stepping into his throw. It was an accident and part of the game.

If Manning was hit in this fashion by Rodney Harrison, I can almost guarantee that you all would be saying it was not dirty. The defender was just trying to get to the QB after being almost continuously held. What was he supposed to do? Certainly he should not give up on the play and allow an undefended pass.

I know that people's minds are already made up, and it is hard to change that. We are all Pats fans and love our team to the end.

emoney_33 said:

WATCH THE PLAY AGAIN. He did not "reach his arms out", he LUNGED his entire body in a direct stream to Brady's knee.

So you are saying that Morris HAD to get off him and that he SHOULD have lunged at Brady's knees and not get up? Yea that's not friggin asking for more QB injuries or anything. Seriously, listen to yourself. IT WAS DIRTY...

Lunging at the knees, whether starting from standing or lying, is dirty period.

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Whatever. Continue to argue "dirtiness," which assumes knowledge of intent and in doing so you allow for interpretation. I am arguing legality and defining dirty as illegal.

How many times must I point to the actual rule book, actual visual evidence, or actual reasoning for you to realize that the play was in no way illegal and will, therefore, have no repercussions aside from the terrible one of losing a league MVP in week one?

That poster is right, Pollard chopped Morris, Morris fell on him, and then Pollard lunged at Brady's knee. Pollard might be a nice guy but he's an idiot if he didn't think this would injure Brady.

When running backs have the ball they are trying to run over and through guys. They're not trying to plant their legs. When a QB plants his leg to throw the leg is a lot more vulnerable to injury than that of a RB going through or around the pile. The QB is as exposed as a kicker or punter.

emoney_33 said:

You are being irrational by trying to force yourself to be rational so as to not look biased.

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You are being ignorant by trying to assume only you are rational.

bradmahn said:

Whatever. Continue to argue "dirtiness," which assumes knowledge of intent and in doing so you allow for interpretation. I am arguing legality and defining dirty as illegal.

How many times must I point to the actual rule book, actual visual evidence, or actual reasoning for you to realize that the play was in no way illegal and will, therefore, have no repercussions aside from the terrible one of losing a league MVP in week one?

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You must be a lawyer...


Was the horse collar tackle dirty, or even wrong, before it was made a rule against it?

These plays have happened hundreds of times without injury (even to our Tom Brady), stop with completely unfounded assertions to the contrary.