Make tapin' legal

[Sivy]

Coudlnt the nfl just make taping the signals legal, then this would all go away? Cant investigate the"cheating" if its within the rules.

ohhhhh.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Re: Make tapin legal

Coudlnt the nfl just make taping the signals legal...

It is legal, within walls and with a roof overhead, at least that's what I have heard.

This is "roof-less-gate"

 

[Sivy]

Re: Make tapin legal

It is legal, within walls and with a roof overhead, at least that's what I have heard.

This is "roof-less-gate"

Yea, next thing you know its going to be

radiocontrolledfootballgate

how else can that brady moss connection be so good.

 

[Gainzo]

Coudlnt the nfl just make taping the signals legal, then this would all go away? Cant investigate the"cheating" if its within the rules.

ohhhhh.

Either that or just have the NFL tape the end zone/sideline views and not allow teams to tape anything.

I sit on the visitors side of the field at Gillette and have seen many people with video cameras not wearing the red vests that media people are required to wear.

 

[dante828]

This is one of the biggest questions that I have. Why is taping legal only from certain specified locations at game time? What's wrong with allowing taping of public acts that all people see (namely signals from the sidelines and such)? Is the competative advantaged gained from such taping so great that it necessitates limitation of the location of taping? And if the competative advantage gained not so great, what is the big deal in the first place? I have not read one good argument why sideline videotaping should be illegal, I am not saying that there isn't one, I just haven't heard it. Can someone point something out that is helpful?

 

[Gainzo]

This is one of the biggest questions that I have. Why is taping legal only from certain specified locations at game time? What's wrong with allowing taping of public acts that all people see (namely signals from the sidelines and such)? Is the competative advantaged gained from such taping so great that it necessitates limitation of the location of taping? And if the competative advantage gained not so great, what is the big deal in the first place? I have not read one good argument why sideline videotaping should be illegal, I am not saying that there isn't one, I just haven't heard it. Can someone point something out that is helpful?

This is the biggest non-story that has become a "story" in my lifetime following professional sports.

The media hatred for BB existed long before the spygate story broke.

Lets not fool ourselves on the public perception (outside of New England) of Boston sports. The dominance of the Red Sox & Pats has fueled the hatred of all things Boston.

The media is now piling on KG and the Celtics.

 

[JR4]

......

The media is now piling on KG and the Celtics.

yep ... and refs are making so many bad calls on the C's
it makes you really wonder what's going on.

 

[Gainzo]

yep ... and refs are making so many bad calls on the C's
it makes you really wonder what's going on.

Is that meant to be sarcasm? I hope it is.

I'm not talking about the games I'm talking about the media calling out KG.

 

[Sivy]

I'm telling you, next time the jets are at the razor, Im dressing in green with a camera, and jumping over to the jets side line, and am tapin the patriots signals, and im gonna SWEAR THAT I WAS HIRED BY THE JETS TO DO IT. And if anyone on the jets say other wise, I'm just gonna say they are trying to cover it up.

 

[Peytonsbetter]

Re: Make tapin legal

It is legal, within walls and with a roof overhead, at least that's what I have heard.

This is "roof-less-gate"

Video taping coaches signals is ILLEGAL, REGARDLESS of where its taped from.

The rule that you quote is on game film, NOT coaches signals. Every team films every game, they just can't film coaches signals.

This is the rule the Pats broke.

There seems to be a lot of confusion on this issue.

 

[nelly57]

Re: Make tapin legal

Video taping coaches signals is ILLEGAL, REGARDLESS of where its taped from.

The rule that you quote is on game film, NOT coaches signals. Every team films every game, they just can't film coaches signals.

This is the rule the Pats broke.

There seems to be a lot of confusion on this issue.

Dunno.... below is the link to Goodell' press conference, at 7:03 mark he states it is to NFL policy permissible to scout coaching signals. And he furthers adds that teams go to great lengths to protect against that during games.

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d8084c814

If the league memo issue sep 6 2006 makes it clear that filming of signaling is not allowed. IMO, 2006 memo implies the previous rule was ambiguous.

 

[dante828]

Re: Make tapin legal

Video taping coaches signals is ILLEGAL, REGARDLESS of where its taped from.

The rule that you quote is on game film, NOT coaches signals. Every team films every game, they just can't film coaches signals.

This is the rule the Pats broke.

There seems to be a lot of confusion on this issue.

Can you quote the actual rule that says its illegal to tape coaches signals? I haven't seen any rule that says this, but if you can point it out that would be very helpful.

I mean, I am sure you wouldn't come on another teams board and make a factual proclamation without the facts to back it up, so I would like to see the rule for myself.

 

[nelly57]

This what I have found so far, the problem I see is that the 2006 memo was not published in it completion thus it may or may not show any ambiguity, nor the context.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d802456c2&template=with-video&confirm=tr... 5/10/2008


BTW, IMO, this rule interpretation and lack of public disclosure is one of the reason for this mess.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Look at the 3rd stickied thread above at the top of the page. The relevant rules and memo parts are posted there.

The memo uses stronger language against taping signals than the rules and field guide, but still specifies the areas from which taping is illegal, implying to most anyway that other areas are legal. There is lots of room to interpret meaning though.

 

[dante828]

Look at the 3rd stickied thread above at the top of the page. The relevant rules and memo parts are posted there.

The memo uses stronger language against taping signals than the rules and field guide, but still specifies the areas from which taping is illegal, implying to most anyway that other areas are legal. There is lots of room to interpret meaning though.

Thanks, I was pretty familiar with those rules, and the memo, which do not state that taping signals is illegal, just that it is illegal in certain areas.

Peytonsbetter claims that the rules say that taping signals is illegal everywhere. I personally don't believe this because it would have come up on this board previously, but I wanted to see if he, or someone else, could point to a rule that says this. If he, or someone else can, that would be great, but I doubt it.

 

[Frezo]

This is one of the biggest questions that I have. Why is taping legal only from certain specified locations at game time? What's wrong with allowing taping of public acts that all people see (namely signals from the sidelines and such)? Is the competative advantaged gained from such taping so great that it necessitates limitation of the location of taping? And if the competative advantage gained not so great, what is the big deal in the first place? I have not read one good argument why sideline videotaping should be illegal, I am not saying that there isn't one, I just haven't heard it. Can someone point something out that is helpful?

Here is how I see it.

Taping from legal locations which are the endzones and other special enclosures: Cameras in these locations can be blocked. Their line of sight to signal callers is fixed. People can be stratigically placed to block that line of sight. Also it becomes difficult if not impossible to include the play and the signals in the same frame. Cameras in fixed locations are easier to inspect and monitor by NFL security.

Taping from the sidelines: This camera would be mobile and can be placed directly in line with the formation and the signal caller making blocking it impossible. When the signals are given, the camera can easily pick up any signals further given in the formation by players. This is especially true if the camera is equipped with a good microphone and is also recording the audio.

In summary: Sideline recordings contain much more information than what can be recorded from fixed locations. This also makes editing the recording(s) much easier and faster. It also allows immediate playback via the camera's monitor giving access to the coaching staff which is prohibited.

 

[dante828]

Here is how I see it.

Taping from legal locations which are the endzones and other special enclosures: Cameras in these locations can be blocked. Their line of sight to signal callers is fixed. People can be stratigically placed to block that line of sight. Also it becomes difficult if not impossible to include the play and the signals in the same frame. Cameras in fixed locations are easier to inspect and monitor by NFL security.

Taping from the sidelines: This camera would be mobile and can be placed directly in line with the formation and the signal caller making blocking it impossible. When the signals are given, the camera can easily pick up any signals further given in the formation by players. This is especially true if the camera is equipped with a good microphone and is also recording the audio.

In summary: Sideline recordings contain much more information than what can be recorded from fixed locations. This also makes editing the recording(s) much easier and faster. It also allows immediate playback via the camera's monitor giving access to the coaching staff which is prohibited.

Thanks, it seems logical that the NFL would want to make it more difficult to video signals, but if this was their main concern, wouldn't it be easier to prohibit the practice altogether rather then rely on limitations of camera location. This is not to say that if taping signals was illegal, keeping the cameras in fixed locations would be helpful in enforcement, I see a combination of the rules as rather effectice. But with no prohibiton to taping signals, why not allow someone to tape from the sidelines and make it easier? Maybe the NFL is concerned that teams will spend too much time coming up with ways to hide signals that it will distract them from the game, though this seems like a flimsy justification to me.

The NFL should make it illegal to tape signals or allow everyone to tape from everywhere, that makes the most sense to me. I have no problems with either rule, just as long as it is clearer then the current one.

 

[dryheat44]

Re: Make tapin legal

Video taping coaches signals is ILLEGAL, REGARDLESS of where its taped from.

The rule that you quote is on game film, NOT coaches signals. Every team films every game, they just can't film coaches signals.

This is the rule the Pats broke.

There seems to be a lot of confusion on this issue.

I think you're mistaken. Otherwise, every video tape/cd shot by everyteam would be at the disposal of the commish upon every accusation that someone shot coaches from a legal location. And believe me, if this past few months has taught me nothing else, every coach that loses that day will accuse the other team of filming his signals. I doubt the Commish wants to deal with that.

 

[Frezo]

Thanks, it seems logical that the NFL would want to make it more difficult to video signals, but if this was their main concern, wouldn't it be easier to prohibit the practice altogether rather then rely on limitations of camera location. This is not to say that if taping signals was illegal, keeping the cameras in fixed locations would be helpful in enforcement, I see a combination of the rules as rather effectice. But with no prohibiton to taping signals, why not allow someone to tape from the sidelines and make it easier? Maybe the NFL is concerned that teams will spend too much time coming up with ways to hide signals that it will distract them from the game, though this seems like a flimsy justification to me.

The NFL should make it illegal to tape signals or allow everyone to tape from everywhere, that makes the most sense to me. I have no problems with either rule, just as long as it is clearer then the current one.

They have pretty much done away with this all by allowing electronic communication between the CS and defensive players. This makes the physical calling of signals obsolete and video recordings moot.

 

[reflexblue]

I'm sure alot of you saw the tapes in question the other day. All i can say is i could have done jus as good a job, they looked like amature home movies. And what anyone could have gotten out of them is beyond me.