Belichick's DB draft history...

[Seneschal2]

Ochmed posted a CB analysis of the qualities BB looks for at the position. Thought I'd post the numbers of each DB (CBs and Safeties) drafted by BB since 2000. Size/Speed does indeed matter at most positions...and this list may give us some insight as to which draft prospects to consider (or not) at the DB position:

C = Combine
PD = Pro Day
OC = On Campus
U = Unconfirmed

FS Brandon Meriweather 5105 195  4.47C
CB Mike Richardson 5103 188  4.48PD
SS Willie Andrews [B]5093[/B] 193  4.43C
CB Ellis Hobbs [B]5092[/B] 186  4.45C  4.38PD
SS James Sanders 5106 214  4.65PD
SS Guss Scott 5103 204  4.46C
FS Dexter Reid 5107 203  4.56C
CB Christian Morton 6003 188  4.46OC
CB Eugene Wilson 5103 192  4.48C
CB Asante Samuel 5107 185  4.49C
CB Brock Williams [B]5095[/B] 183  4.46C
FS Hakim Akbar 6004 210  4.55U
CB Leonard Myers 5102 190  4.65C
CB Antwan Harris [B]5091[/B] 186  4.32C

Note: All numbers from NFLdraftscout.com

 

[NePatriots]

Interesting... doesn't seem to care about height -- Morton was the only six-footer and he was cut as a 7th rounder out of Illinois.

 

[WhiZa]

I remember Andrews running a 4.3 Not sure where they're getting these numbers from.

 

[NePatriots]

I remember Andrews running a 4.3 Not sure where they're getting these numbers from.

Was that pro-day or combine though?

 

[WhiZa]

combine: http://nfldraft.rivals.com/cviewplayer.asp?Player=2429&type=scoutingreport#scouting

 

[patchick]

Just to throw one more log on the fire, here's something I wrote last February (in one of my periodic anti-Chris Houston posts ) about the Pats' DB draft history.
http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...howthread.php?t=50753&highlight=wilson&page=2


The Patriots are kind of funny in evaluating d-backs. Tight hips? Not a problem. Short enough to qualify for reduced fares? Step right up. Small school with low level of competition? It's all cool. Questionable ball skills? Weak in run support and tackling? Ah, hold on a minute.

Ellis Hobbs draft report excerpts: "Has a good nose for the ball and is especially active in run support...Solid tackler who will break down, face up, wrap and secure, showing aggression making the hit...Made very good improvements with his hands in 2004, extending away from the frame to snatch and pluck the ball..."

James Sanders draft report excerpts: "Good open field tackler…Ball-hawk type with that “go up and get it” attitude to the thrown pass…looks natural looking the ball in, extending for the pigskin at its high point with hands extended away from the frame…Plays with good functional strength and hits with explosion as a tackler…

Guss Scott draft report excerpts: "Plays with good awareness and instincts…Quick to react to the ball and anticipate the pass, consistently making good decisions…Has very good hands and ball skills, doing a good job of extending to get to the pigskin away from the body’s frame…Active in run force, coming up quickly while taking good angle..."

Dexter Reid draft report excerpts: "Quick to recognize and locate the ball…Plays alert and is very aware of the receiver’s drop in the zone…Tracks the ball properly and readily adjusts to it when combating for the pigskin…Catches the ball in his hands and away from his body…Will meet the ball carrier with aggression at the line of scrimmage..."


In short, there appears to be a clear profile for a Pats-drafted DB. It's not a physical profile, it's an on-the-field profile. Good hands, strong in run support, excellent field awareness and read-and-react/ball-tracking skills. Speedster or no, Chris Houston just doesn't seem to fit the profile.

 

[NePatriots]

Ball tracking -- agree with you there. Now if Merriweather could catch the balls he is tracking... Gotta love him though.

 

[hobbsownscoles]

Just to throw one more log on the fire, here's something I wrote last February (in one of my periodic anti-Chris Houston posts ) about the Pats' DB draft history.
http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...howthread.php?t=50753&highlight=wilson&page=2


The Patriots are kind of funny in evaluating d-backs. Tight hips? Not a problem. Short enough to qualify for reduced fares? Step right up. Small school with low level of competition? It's all cool. Questionable ball skills? Weak in run support and tackling? Ah, hold on a minute.

Ellis Hobbs draft report excerpts: "Has a good nose for the ball and is especially active in run support...Solid tackler who will break down, face up, wrap and secure, showing aggression making the hit...Made very good improvements with his hands in 2004, extending away from the frame to snatch and pluck the ball..."

James Sanders draft report excerpts: "Good open field tackler…Ball-hawk type with that “go up and get it” attitude to the thrown pass…looks natural looking the ball in, extending for the pigskin at its high point with hands extended away from the frame…Plays with good functional strength and hits with explosion as a tackler…

Guss Scott draft report excerpts: "Plays with good awareness and instincts…Quick to react to the ball and anticipate the pass, consistently making good decisions…Has very good hands and ball skills, doing a good job of extending to get to the pigskin away from the body’s frame…Active in run force, coming up quickly while taking good angle..."

Dexter Reid draft report excerpts: "Quick to recognize and locate the ball…Plays alert and is very aware of the receiver’s drop in the zone…Tracks the ball properly and readily adjusts to it when combating for the pigskin…Catches the ball in his hands and away from his body…Will meet the ball carrier with aggression at the line of scrimmage..."


In short, there appears to be a clear profile for a Pats-drafted DB. It's not a physical profile, it's an on-the-field profile. Good hands, strong in run support, excellent field awareness and read-and-react/ball-tracking skills. Speedster or no, Chris Houston just doesn't seem to fit the profile.

Antoine Cason?

 

[Mr.Muhozi]

Antoine Cason?

bingo my friend

 

[Dom]

Some other DBs from this draft who fit the description above. Some of them may not suit the Patriots in other ways (several have questionable character) but all of them represent the sort of defensive back BB usually looks for:

Brandon Flowers: "Physical, aggressive and a big hitter...Good instincts and awareness...A playmaker with nice hands, body control and ball skills...Aggressive in run support...Lacks the height scouts prefer at the position"

Chevis Jackson: "Instinctive...Tough, physical and aggressive...Good hands and ball skills...Reliable tackler...Solid against the run...Timed speed is merely average"

Jack Williams: "Good hands and ball skills...Solid instincts and awareness...Tough and physical...Willing to come up and support the run"

DeJuan Tribble: "Strong and tough...Physical and will support the run...Reliable tackler...Pretty good hands and ball skills...Nice instincts and awareness"

Simon Castille: "Excellent instincts...Great ball skills...Tough and physical...Solid versus the run...A reliable tackler"

DaJuan Morgan: "Nice instincts and awareness...Physical and aggressive...Pretty good hands and ball skills...Isn't afraid to come up and support the run"

Tom Zbikowski: "Very strong and is tough as nails...Smart and has terrific instincts...Does a great job versus the run...Good hands and ball skills...Likes to hit and is a reliable tackler"

Craig Steltz: "Excellent instincts...Tough and physical...Sure tackler but can also lay the lumber...Does a nice job against the run...Good hands and ball skills"

Josh Barrett: "Reliable tackler who can also deliver the knockout blow...Tough and physical...Excellent against the run...Nice instincts and awareness"

Caleb Campbell: "A reliable tackler who can deliver the big hit...Physical and aggressive...Does an excellent job against the run...Has good instincts"

 

[cstjohn17]

Ochmed posted a CB analysis of the qualities BB looks for at the position. Thought I'd post the numbers of each DB (CBs and Safeties) drafted by BB since 2000. Size/Speed does indeed matter at most positions...and this list may give us some insight as to which draft prospects to consider (or not) at the DB position:

C = Combine
PD = Pro Day
OC = On Campus
U = Unconfirmed

[B]FS Brandon Meriweather 5105 195  4.47C[/B]
CB Mike Richardson 5103 188  4.48PD
SS Willie Andrews [B]5093[/B] 193  4.43C
[B]CB Ellis Hobbs [B]5092[/B] 186  4.45C  4.38PD
SS James Sanders 5106 214  4.65PD[/B]
SS Guss Scott 5103 204  4.46C
FS Dexter Reid 5107 203  4.56C
CB Christian Morton 6003 188  4.46OC
[B]CB Eugene Wilson 5103 192  4.48C
CB Asante Samuel 5107 185  4.49C[/B]
CB Brock Williams [B]5095[/B] 183  4.46C
FS Hakim Akbar 6004 210  4.55U
CB Leonard Myers 5102 190  4.65C
CB Antwan Harris [B]5091[/B] 186  4.32C

Note: All numbers from NFLdraftscout.com

Good breakdown, I looked at the 2006 roster and had the following breakdown.
http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/showpost.php?p=402542&postcount=1

As far as styles and size the Patriots are much more fluid in their analysis than the fans. Most fans want someone 6'1 because they al tall, regardless of their ability to cover. In general they seem to like their CBs smaller and quicker keeping most of the bulk closer to the line of scrimmage.

Other notes:
- pretty much scrub city, a lot of day 2 picks, seems to suggest they don't value the position (which also means a CB in round 1 just to mess with our brain)
- 5 out of 14 (players in bold) have turned into soild NFLers (giving Merrimweather the benefit of the doubt), so expect 2 to get drafted and 1 to become an OK player
- some very poor picks at Safety

 

[DaBruinz]

Some other DBs from this draft who fit the description above. Some of them may not suit the Patriots in other ways (several have questionable character) but all of them represent the sort of defensive back BB usually looks for:

Brandon Flowers: "Physical, aggressive and a big hitter...Good instincts and awareness...A playmaker with nice hands, body control and ball skills...Aggressive in run support...Lacks the height scouts prefer at the position"

Chevis Jackson: "Instinctive...Tough, physical and aggressive...Good hands and ball skills...Reliable tackler...Solid against the run...Timed speed is merely average"

Jack Williams: "Good hands and ball skills...Solid instincts and awareness...Tough and physical...Willing to come up and support the run"

DeJuan Tribble: "Strong and tough...Physical and will support the run...Reliable tackler...Pretty good hands and ball skills...Nice instincts and awareness"

Simon Castille: "Excellent instincts...Great ball skills...Tough and physical...Solid versus the run...A reliable tackler" Struggles in the classroom from lack of effort.... Likes to free lance too much... Not a natural hands catcher....

DaJuan Morgan: "Nice instincts and awareness...Physical and aggressive...Pretty good hands and ball skills...Isn't afraid to come up and support the run"

Tom Zbikowski: "Very strong and is tough as nails...Smart and has terrific instincts...Does a great job versus the run...Good hands and ball skills...Likes to hit and is a reliable tackler"

Craig Steltz: "Excellent instincts...Tough and physical...Sure tackler but can also lay the lumber...Does a nice job against the run...Good hands and ball skills" Just adequate zone coverage skills and worse in man coverage...Needs time to read and diagnose plays...

Josh Barrett: "Reliable tackler who can also deliver the knockout blow...Tough and physical...Excellent against the run...Nice instincts and awareness"

Caleb Campbell: "A reliable tackler who can deliver the big hit...Physical and aggressive...Does an excellent job against the run...Has good instincts"

Which ones have the questonable characters?

 

[Dom]

I can't remember who had the character flaws, and I didn't do too much investigation into other undesirable characteristics, all I wanted to do was to get a very broad list of the players who seem to match the qualities outlined above.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Which ones have the questonable characters?

Simeon was definitely involved in an incident last season, but I do not think Saban punished him for it.

Steitz - Watch the South Carolina - LSU game and you will see that Spurrier spent the whole game isolating a WR on Steitz and having tremendous success throwing on him.

Campbell - just think how much better this kid could have been if he had received D1 level coaching in college.

 

[captain stone]

Other notes:
- pretty much scrub city, a lot of day 2 picks, seems to suggest they don't value the position (which also means a CB in round 1 just to mess with our brain)
- 5 out of 14 (players in bold) have turned into soild NFLers (giving Merrimweather the benefit of the doubt), so expect 2 to get drafted and 1 to become an OK player
- some very poor picks at Safety

Either the FO doesn't value the position, or just doesn't do a good enough job evaluating the position.

Some very poor picks at Safety, indeed. Buncha effin midgets, which is OK for CB, but unacceptable for SS.

I still consider the jury "out" in the case of Meriweather & Sanders v. Captain Stone.

 

[cstjohn17]

Either the FO doesn't value the position, or just doesn't do a good enough job evaluating the position.

Some very poor picks at Safety, indeed. Buncha effin midgets, which is OK for CB, but unacceptable for SS.

I still consider the jury "out" in the case of Meriweather & Sanders v. Captain Stone.

I am sold on Sanders, steady, young, improving. I would even try to lock him up for cheap money to keep some continuity in the secondary. If someone comes along who is special, fine let him have Sanders spot, but I will take steady every time.

 

[jeffbiologist]

I think these numbers show you .....nothing. Look at the numbers comparing Brock Williams, Samuel and Wilson, almost exactly the same. They were all different players, different positions with different results.
I like Sanders, but I dont think he has major upside. Merriweather is going to be best at FS if he ever picks up the system and gets out of his own way. My idea is to draft my binkie Wesley Woodyard and give him a year to try and convert to SS from LB. He has the size,speed and nose for the ball and is the best tackler in the SEC. If he doesnt work out you can resign Sanders, but if he does he has that potential to be GREAT.