Colvins release

[Ring 6]

I dont know why anyone is surprised.
We had 3 starting caliber OLBs, Thomas, Vrabel and Colvin.
Colvin had a huge cap number, a history of injuries, and averaged 5.3 sacks a year while he was here.
There was no sense keeping him at what it would cost.
I think the information we get from this is that neither Thomas or Vrabel will play out of position this year.

This cut was determined the day we signed AD last year.

 

[BradyManny]

Probably all true...but I still wouldn't mind seeing Colvin re-signed at a cheaper price. Vrabel's effectiveness really dipped when Colvin went down, unless its injury related, then I imagine Colvin's production - like many other players on this team - was not completely indicative of the strength of his play. IMO, he was the best at pressuring the QB when healthy last season.

 

[Rob0729]

Personally, I always thought it was a real possibility that he was going to be released, but I figured he would be willing to renegotiate to a number the Pats would be happy with. Apparently, the Pats are more concerned about his injuries than I thought.

 

[Jimke]

Personally, I always thought it was a real possibility that he was going to be released, but I figured he would be willing to renegotiate to a number the Pats would be happy with. Apparently, the Pats are more concerned about his injuries than I thought.

Your last sentence may tell the story. Would he have started training camp on PUP?

 

[Rob0729]

Probably all true...but I still wouldn't mind seeing Colvin re-signed at a cheaper price. Vrabel's effectiveness really dipped when Colvin went down, unless its injury related, then I imagine Colvin's production - like many other players on this team - was not completely indicative of the strength of his play. IMO, he was the best at pressuring the QB when healthy last season.

I think Vrabel's production dip was a bit overrated. One of his best games IMHO happened after Colvin went down. I thought Vrabel was huge in the Pittsburgh game eventhough stats wise, he was so-so (granted that was because he was blatantly held on every play). He almost single-handily shutdown Roethlisberger. He also had three sacks vs. Miami. Granted he wasn't all that productive in the playoffs.

I also think that Vrabel's production was in part because the Pats had to weaken three positions when Colvin went down. They moved Thomas outside where he wasn't as familiar with the Pats' schemes. They moved Bruschi from weakside to strong side which is his weaker position. They forced both Bruschi and Seau to play full time. I am not sure how much Colvin's production affected Vrabel's play or that the fact that we didn't have enough bodies in the LB corp.

 

[BradyManny]

I think Vrabel's production dip was a bit overrated. One of his best games IMHO happened after Colvin went down. I thought Vrabel was huge in the Pittsburgh game eventhough stats wise, he was so-so (granted that was because he was blatantly held on every play). He almost single-handily shutdown Roethlisberger. He also had three sacks vs. Miami. Granted he wasn't all that productive in the playoffs.

I also think that Vrabel's production was in part because the Pats had to weaken three positions when Colvin went down. They moved Thomas outside where he wasn't as familiar with the Pats' schemes. They moved Bruschi from weakside to strong side which is his weaker position. They forced both Bruschi and Seau to play full time. I am not sure how much Colvin's production affected Vrabel's play or that the fact that we didn't have enough bodies in the LB corp.

Good points, and I'm guessing the FO sees it this way too.

 

[Pats726]

I think maybe PUP...I think THAT might have been the problem..needing money now as opposed to having it tied up..Holley really believes he is gone for good..and that is sad, but I am not surprised by his being released..if one looked at teh money saved and where he was..it was hardly a shock..SURE would have been nice to have 3, but AD is more an OLB..

 

[d.finn.patsfan.]

i'm not sure how i would feel with 2 new guys at ILB (maybe Bruschi or Seau come back). But Thomas did look solid at OLB.

 

[Deus Irae]

I dont know why anyone is surprised.
We had 3 starting caliber OLBs, Thomas, Vrabel and Colvin.
Colvin had a huge cap number, a history of injuries, and averaged 5.3 sacks a year while he was here.
There was no sense keeping him at what it would cost.
I think the information we get from this is that neither Thomas or Vrabel will play out of position this year.

This cut was determined the day we signed AD last year.

I give Belioli credit for being smarter than your theory would make them out to be in my eyes, so I don't buy that theory. With Seau and Bruschi having a combined age in the neighborhood of 534 years, focusing on OLB replacement rather than ILB is counterproductive, and very non-BB like. Given how poor the free agent market is this season, this release makes no sense at all to me, because Colvin is now one of the best 2-3 linebackers on the market, and the best one with experience in the 3-4. Frankly, my theory is that the loss to the Giants has caused them to lose their minds and make hasty and uncharacteristically bad decisions. I look forward to the next 2 weeks proving that theory wrong.

 

[scout]

I wasn't shocked. Some posts on the board are all over the place. BB and Pioli have a plan and they can't do anything until Friday at the earliest. Then we might see hear more screaming as Asante signs elsewhere. Meanwhile, the Pats have made a nice defensive move by hiring Capers.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

I give Belioli credit for being smarter than your theory would make them out to be in my eyes, so I don't buy that theory. With Seau and Bruschi having a combined age in the neighborhood of 534 years, focusing on OLB replacement rather than ILB is counterproductive, and very non-BB like. Given how poor the free agent market is this season, this release makes no sense at all to me, because Colvin is now one of the best 2-3 linebackers on the market, and the best one with experience in the 3-4. Frankly, my theory is that the loss to the Giants has caused them to lose their minds and make hasty and uncharacteristically bad decisions. I look forward to the next 2 weeks proving that theory wrong.

Let me see here:

(A) BB/SP have a plan.
(B) BB/SP have lost their minds.
(C) BB/SP just got a "gift" from Ricky Williams (or Willie Andrews).

Hmmm . . . I think I'm going to go with (A) here.

 

[Rob0729]

I give Belioli credit for being smarter than your theory would make them out to be in my eyes, so I don't buy that theory. With Seau and Bruschi having a combined age in the neighborhood of 534 years, focusing on OLB replacement rather than ILB is counterproductive, and very non-BB like. Given how poor the free agent market is this season, this release makes no sense at all to me, because Colvin is now one of the best 2-3 linebackers on the market, and the best one with experience in the 3-4. Frankly, my theory is that the loss to the Giants has caused them to lose their minds and make hasty and uncharacteristically bad decisions. I look forward to the next 2 weeks proving that theory wrong.

According to Karen Guerrigian, the Pats are concerned about his foot and hip and whether he can rebound. In his interview on WEEI on Monday, Colvin seemed to imply that he is not all that close to being able to play. There seems to be a lot of doubts on whether Colvin will be ready for the start of the season and what type of player he will be when he comes back. That doesn't seem to be uncharacteristic for the Pats to cut ties in that place.

I don't think the free agent market is all that bad. There aren't a lot of big name guys, but there are some solid LBs out there. People have to remember that when the Pats added guys like Vrabel, Phifer, and even Seau that people didn't have a lot of hope for those guys. They turned out pretty good for the Pats.

Say the Pats add Calvin Pace and Victor Hobson to the middle and keep Thomas outside, Bruschi and/or Seau come in to rotate, the Pats add Gholston and/or another rookie. I think the Pats may have actually improved their LB corp.

 

[Deus Irae]

Let me see here:

(A) BB/SP have a plan.
(B) BB/SP have lost their minds.
(C) BB/SP just got a "gift" from Ricky Williams (or Willie Andrews).

Hmmm . . . I think I'm going to go with (A) here.

I've always given Belioli the benefit of the doubt. It doesn't mean I can't have a pet theory to toy with for the next couple of weeks. Colvin's release makes no sense in a vacuum.

According to Karen Guerrigian, the Pats are concerned about his foot and hip and whether he can rebound. In his interview on WEEI on Monday, Colvin seemed to imply that he is not all that close to being able to play. There seems to be a lot of doubts on whether Colvin will be ready for the start of the season and what type of player he will be when he comes back. That doesn't seem to be uncharacteristic for the Pats to cut ties in that place.

I don't think the free agent market is all that bad. There aren't a lot of big name guys, but there are some solid LBs out there. People have to remember that when the Pats added guys like Vrabel, Phifer, and even Seau that people didn't have a lot of hope for those guys. They turned out pretty good for the Pats.

Say the Pats add Calvin Pace and Victor Hobson to the middle and keep Thomas outside, Bruschi and/or Seau come in to rotate, the Pats add Gholston and/or another rookie. I think the Pats may have actually improved their LB corp.

Even if the release is being done due to injury concerns, the team has freed up enough cap space that it didn't need to be done now, and could have waited on progress updates or other subsequent developments. As for Pace and Hobson, you're looking at one player (Pace) who's a contract year 'wonder', and another who's not effective enough in the 3-4 for the Jets to focus on keeping. That's a pair of solid red flags.

 

[groundgame]

Back when Colvin was injured, it was interesting when analyst Scott Zolak thought the Patriots would hardly even notice the loss of Colvin as the season would further unfold. He was not impressed with Colvin's play.

 

[spacecrime]

focusing on OLB replacement rather than ILB is counterproductive, and very non-BB like. Given how poor the free agent market is this season, this release makes no sense at all to me, because Colvin is now one of the best 2-3 linebackers on the market,

un-BB like? When was BB noted for over-paying? Colvin had one-year left at about $6 mil, and we don't even know if his foot is healed. If it was such a big mistake to cut him, why do you think no one has yet given him a one-year $6 mil deal?

Answer: because he isn't worth $6 mil for 2008. BB knows it, and so do all the other FO's.

 

[Deus Irae]

un-BB like? When was BB noted for over-paying? Colvin had one-year left at about $6 mil, and we don't even know if his foot is healed. If it was such a big mistake to cut him, why do you think no one has yet given him a one-year $6 mil deal?

Answer: because he isn't worth $6 mil for 2008. BB knows it, and so do all the other FO's.

He overpaid for Ty Law, just to name one. Sometimes, you overpay, no matter who you are. As for the rest of your post, get back to me when you realize that the man hasn't even been on the market for 24 hours.

 

[WhiZa]

People were surprised because you will not find someone like Colvin in FA for 5.5m. If Colvin is healthy enough to play a full year next year I'd be surprised too. I think the real issue is the injury. The pats must of thought he would miss camp or be put on PUP. So why not spend the money on someone younger and who can contribute right away then to wait a year for Colvin to get healthy, comeback slowly, and just leave in FA right after?

 

[JoeSixPat]

I dont know why anyone is surprised.
We had 3 starting caliber OLBs, Thomas, Vrabel and Colvin.
Colvin had a huge cap number, a history of injuries, and averaged 5.3 sacks a year while he was here.
There was no sense keeping him at what it would cost.
I think the information we get from this is that neither Thomas or Vrabel will play out of position this year.

This cut was determined the day we signed AD last year.

There are a lot of factors at play - not the least of which is his injury and whether he'll be ready for the season.

Bringing back a perfectly healthy Colvin in his last, albeit expensive, season under contract wouldn't have been a surprise - especially given the need for LBs this offseason.

Letting him go indicates two things:

1. Colvin's injury might not have him fully healthy for the start of the season and

2. The Patriots have a plan to address LB needs that might or might not include Colvin if he signs elsewhere.

In either case I have confidence that BB will address the LB position in the offseason.

 

[PatsFan37]

Even if the release is being done due to injury concerns, the team has freed up enough cap space that it didn't need to be done now, and could have waited on progress updates or other subsequent developments.

I thought Colvin was due a $300,000 option bonus. I don't know when it was due, but that may have been a factor. A hundred thousand here, a hundred thousand there, pretty soon you're talking real money.

The other factor, and I think this is the important one, is they like Colvin. He's smart, tough and came back from a really bad injury. Releasing him several days before the start of free agency is doing him a favor. Hanging onto him until all the good money is gone and then releasing him is the kind of thing that pisses off the locker room a lot more than any of those high-profile holdout disputes. Players remember that sort of thing.

 

[Rob0729]

Even if the release is being done due to injury concerns, the team has freed up enough cap space that it didn't need to be done now, and could have waited on progress updates or other subsequent developments. As for Pace and Hobson, you're looking at one player (Pace) who's a contract year 'wonder', and another who's not effective enough in the 3-4 for the Jets to focus on keeping. That's a pair of solid red flags.

Hobson had 100 tackles, 6 sacks, and an INT in the Jets defense Mangini's first year. Not too shabby. The Jets let go of Pete Kendall over $1 million which totally destroyed their o-line. They may end up doing the same thing with Coles. The Jets haven't exactly made a lot of great decisions over there especially about paying their players.

As for Pace, it may be because he was a DE under Dennis Green's system and when Whisenhunt came in this past year, they moved him to OLB. It seems like he was misused by the Green regime.

The Pats let go of Colvin. Shouldn't that be as solid as a red flag as Pace and Hobson. At least the Pats have a much longer track record of knowing what they are doing than the Mangini/Tanenbaum Jets. I certainly trust Belichick and Pioli with their personal decisions over Man-not so-genius and Tanebaum.