Shrager's top 10 - Interesting

[Steamer86]

Schrager's top 10
1. Miami: Jake Long, OT, Michigan
2. St. Louis: Glenn Dorsey, DT, LSU
3. Atlanta*: Matt Ryan, QB, Boston College
4. Oakland*: Darren McFadden, RB, Arkansas
5. Kansas City*: Ryan Clady, OT, Boise State
6. New York Jets: Chris Long, DE, Virginia
7. New England: Keith Rivers, LB, USC
8. Baltimore: Vernon Gholston, DE, Ohio State
9. Cincinnati: Sedrick Ellis, DT, USC
10. New Orleans: Pat Sims, DT, Auburn

What do you think? Couldn't we trade down about 5-10 spots for Rivers? J Long at 1 is different than most mocks and Clady moving up to 5, since Long is gone. I'd like Ellis (can never have too many massive studs - see Giants) or Gholston and go corner and LB with next two picks. Just load up on D and then go OL next year. If they think Clady is real deal and he is there at 7, then I guess they will have to consider as they could use the giant punishing LT. The Jets would love this scenario, but they will not get C. Long.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

It also begs the question--who/what do the Pats value most? I think a fair number of people on this board would argue that the Pats would probably take Gholston over Rivers if both were available. . . . then again, they might drop down, and take a CB.

 

[BRiZ]

KC could be a very realistic trading partner for the Pats. We could give them our high 3rd rounder to move to their spot at 5 if someone like McFadden or Chris Long is there, and KC could fall back to 7 and take Clady there. The Jets will probably take Gholston not KC's lineman, this all depends on Jake Long going early though, theres no way KC will trade with us is Jake is on the board.

I would trade up with a 3rd for Chris Long or McFadden in a heartbeat. Would love for BB to stick it to Mangini too.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

KC could be a very realistic trading partner for the Pats. We could give them our high 3rd rounder to move to their spot at 5 if someone like McFadden or Chris Long is there, and KC could fall back to 7 and take Clady there. The Jets will probably take Gholston not KC's lineman, this all depends on Jake Long going early though, theres no way KC will trade with us is Jake is on the board.

I would trade up with a 3rd for Chris Long or McFadden in a heartbeat. Would love for BB to stick it to Mangini too.

Just remember that there's a 25% chance that KC picks at #4. . . .

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

That guy is an idiot to think that Keith Rivers will go that high. Also, he is coming from a team that runs a 4-3. Gholston would and will be the pick if he is available.

 

[BRiZ]

Just remember that there's a 25% chance that KC picks at #4. . . .

thats true we'll see how it comes out, i think they are doing the coin flip before Friday. I really hope KC stays at 5.

 

[sebman2112]

That guy is an idiot to think that Keith Rivers will go that high. Also, he is coming from a team that runs a 4-3. Gholston would and will be the pick if he is available.

Don't know about taking him so high, but I've wondered (at times) if Rivers could be an option for NE, especially if they were to trade down. I'm talking about Rivers at ILB, not OLB just in case someone is wondering...

PS: Don't be so sure about Gholston, at 7th overall. There are some realistic question marks concerning his ability to be an every down LB in a 3-4, and he's pretty raw. I'd rather trade down and pick up another second rounder anyways.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

Don't know about taking him so high, but I've wondered (at times) if Rivers could be an option for NE, especially if they were to trade down. I'm talking about Rivers at ILB, not OLB just in case someone is wondering...

PS: Don't be so sure about Gholston, at 7th overall. There are some realistic question marks concerning his ability to be an every down LB in a 3-4, and he's pretty raw. I'd rather trade down and pick up another second rounder anyways.

i too, would rather see them trade down, and pick up another second rounder. i see more value there. as much as i would like to see a stud linebacker, b.b. always does the opposite of what we think he should do. watch him draft a q.b., and f*** with everyones mind
i say trade down to around 15, and pick up a second as well.

 

[Seneschal2]

Who is Shrager or Schrager?

 

[nittanylions52]

Not the best mock I've seen. Kentwan Balmer is generally the consensus #3 DT, though we'll see after the combine. If Jake Long is gone by the time KC picks, then they'll probably go with Clady. They've got the top 9 or so guys right (except Rivers, what is he doing there?), but not in the right order imo.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Don't know about taking him so high, but I've wondered (at times) if Rivers could be an option for NE, especially if they were to trade down. I'm talking about Rivers at ILB, not OLB just in case someone is wondering...

PS: Don't be so sure about Gholston, at 7th overall. There are some realistic question marks concerning his ability to be an every down LB in a 3-4, and he's pretty raw. I'd rather trade down and pick up another second rounder anyways.

DeMarcus Ware and Shawne Merriman were pretty raw too. That worked out pretty well. Also, lot's of people were worried about Terrell Suggs after his horrible combine performance. I think he ran a 4.7-4.8. I just base Gholston's performance against top compitition (Long). However, Ohio State get's a pretty easy schedule every year and doesn't play very many tough schools. So if there is something to worry about, it would be that.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

I do not think there is any denying that Rivers had a really good week at the senior bowl, but the real question is how does he project in the 3-4? Where do you play him?

At OLB, can you see him coming up and sealing the end on running plays knowing that he has to beat a pulling OG or C or TE? Also I can not remember him blitzing a lot in college, but it is hard to imagine him as a Ware or Merriman type coming off the edge.

At ILB, I'm not sure he could cover a fire hydrant let alone an NFL RB. Since we play a lot of zone, that might help him. As a run defender, he has good technique and decent lateral mobility, but again it's hard to imagine him surviving 16 games in our defense knowing the pounding he is going to take.

 

[DaBruinz]

KC could be a very realistic trading partner for the Pats. We could give them our high 3rd rounder to move to their spot at 5 if someone like McFadden or Chris Long is there, and KC could fall back to 7 and take Clady there. The Jets will probably take Gholston not KC's lineman, this all depends on Jake Long going early though, theres no way KC will trade with us is Jake is on the board.

I would trade up with a 3rd for Chris Long or McFadden in a heartbeat. Would love for BB to stick it to Mangini too.

That's why BB is the GM of the Patriots and NOT you or I. There is no way he'd move up to 5 at the cost of a High 3rd round AND several million buck to take the wildly over-rated McFadden. There is no need. McFadden certainly doesn't fit in the Best VALUE available at #5 or even #7 for the Pats. The NEED part of the value equation is LOW for RB.

 

[BRiZ]

That's why BB is the GM of the Patriots and NOT you or I. There is no way he'd move up to 5 at the cost of a High 3rd round AND several million buck to take the wildly over-rated McFadden. There is no need. McFadden certainly doesn't fit in the Best VALUE available at #5 or even #7 for the Pats. The NEED part of the value equation is LOW for RB.

You need 2 good backs in this league. Morris and Faulk are both over 30 they dont have much time left. Plus they are no where even near the level of McFadden anyway. There is a need for another RB or will be very soon. We can keep patching away like we do at linebacker but if you have the opportunity to get a franchise RB or a franchise LB you dont pass it up because those opportunities dont come around often. We are picking top 10 in the draft we never pick there and probably wont again for awhile, you got to not waste this opportunity. Studs = McFadden, Jake Long, Chris Long you take anyone of them if they are there. If they are all there then you can go by highest need out of those positions.

If you think McFadden is overated thats your opinion doesnt make it fact. I dont think he is but that isnt a fact either, so we will see what he does in the NFL. I can usually spot studs easily i dont go on hype. You want to know who is overated? Vernon Gholston.

 

[midwestpatsfan]

I actually like Rivers for the Patriots. You have to believe that Adalius Thomas is moving back inside next year, so that leaves OLB with ????

Rivers has a great pass rush and is underated in the running game. He is very fast and can make guards miss. He is just okay in pass coverage, but not near as bad as a guy like connor, who is one dimensional.

I, like many of you, would love to trade down to get him, or gholston, or anybody for that matter, because there is really no one at 7 that I like. The problem is that it is easier said than done. It is great to sit here and say "oh the patriots can just trade down and take him 6-7 spots later." The problem is finding another team that wants to trade up for someone, and I do not see that type of player, except maybe Ellis if he slips, but I do not think we can just assume that trading down is going to be possible.

 

[otis p. driftwood]

You need 2 good backs in this league. Morris and Faulk are both over 30 they dont have much time left. Plus they are no where even near the level of McFadden anyway. There is a need for another RB or will be very soon. We can keep patching away like we do at linebacker but if you have the opportunity to get a franchise RB or a franchise LB you dont pass it up because those opportunities dont come around often. We are picking top 10 in the draft we never pick there and probably wont again for awhile, you got to not waste this opportunity. Studs = McFadden, Jake Long, Chris Long you take anyone of them if they are there. If they are all there then you can go by highest need out of those positions.

If you think McFadden is overated thats your opinion doesnt make it fact. I dont think he is but that isnt a fact either, so we will see what he does in the NFL. I can usually spot studs easily i dont go on hype. You want to know who is overated? Vernon Gholston.

So which team is it you GM for these days, Cinci? Arizona? Texans?

McFadden is a pretty small guy. The whole year people were bashing Maroney for "dancing" and "not hitting the hole", and saying things like "we need dillon back".
So you pick up a bruising back in the 3rd to complement Maroney, but why take a guy who's overrated and small, especially when you'll have to break the bank (draft wise and cash wise) to do it...especially when the Pats running game was pretty good, and the offense as a whole wasn't bad.

 

[BionicPatriot]

Evertyime I hear raw pass rusher I think Merriman or Ware. A guy like Gholston could really elevate this D.

 

[DaBruinz]

You need 2 good backs in this league. Morris and Faulk are both over 30 they dont have much time left. Plus they are no where even near the level of McFadden anyway. There is a need for another RB or will be very soon. We can keep patching away like we do at linebacker but if you have the opportunity to get a franchise RB or a franchise LB you dont pass it up because those opportunities dont come around often. We are picking top 10 in the draft we never pick there and probably wont again for awhile, you got to not waste this opportunity. Studs = McFadden, Jake Long, Chris Long you take anyone of them if they are there. If they are all there then you can go by highest need out of those positions.

You clearly didn't watch Morris this year because Morris still has a TON left in his tank. As does Faulk. In fact, I was amazed that Faulk was able to stay healthy the entire year.

While a team does need 2 good backs, when they already have 3, they don't need to add a 4th. There are positions on this team that are much bigger priorities than an over-rated RB who disappears in key situations.

You so grossly over-rate McFadden, I don't even know where to begin. McFadden is going to be no better than Reggie Bush. The guy who disappears when he's pressed to carry the team.

The Patriots draft by best VALUE available, since you've forgotten. And that value is based on THEIR scouting, not that of NFLDraftScout, NFLDraftCountdown, Scouts,INC, or anyone else. Part of their value equation is team NEED. But it is only part of it.

If you think McFadden is overated thats your opinion doesnt make it fact. I dont think he is but that isnt a fact either, so we will see what he does in the NFL. I can usually spot studs easily i dont go on hype. You want to know who is overated? Vernon Gholston.

No, its my opinion. But its backed up by Razorback fans who laugh and don't understand all they HYPE that people like yourself give him.

As for you "usually spotting studs", BS.

As for Gholston, You don't see me saying to draft him, do you?