OT: How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the Hall of Fame?

[upstater1]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

More Earl.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5790651215508220810

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

http://www.hickoksports.com/history/hbsayers.shtml

Thee above link answers your question. On a cold day in his rookie year, Sayers made his reputation. In a game in which he had 14 touches, he had 6 Touchdowns, the last on a ridiculous punt return in which most of the other team missed tackles.

 

[Wotan_the_Wanderer]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

When it comes to what wins NFL (as opposed to college) games Earl is second only to Brown.

I personally prefer the big, bruising power backs, but in all fairness, the above strikes me as an overstatement. Obviously, three 200lb smurfs who've succeeded in the league and who've won are Walter Payton, Tony Dorsett and Marcus Allen. And if we are to consider Campbell a winner, then the smurf Thurman Thomas needs to also be considered a winner and introduced into the list of winning RBs. But again, no way in hell would I take the helmetless one to Campbell if I'm building a team. This, however, is a personal, subjective preference toward a certain type of runner and a certain brand of football and I'm not so sure there really is an objective formula as to which style of runner or which brand of football is more conducive to winning in the NFL.

Now, Sayers was way before my time and I regret that I never got a chance to see him play. But I know many people who have lived through that era as football fans and invariably, Jim Brown and Gale Sayers are two names that come up time and time again when an argument on the greatest RB is instigated. This in turn tells me that Sayers, despite the short career and relatively weak career stats he put up, played the game in such a manner that he either changed the game to a certain extent or at the very least left an indelible, lasting impression on the fans. I can't imagine a RB today single-handedly scoring 36 points as did Sayers. And as important as total career stats are when reflecting on a certain player's career, I think it's nearly important to reflect on a certain player's impact on the game itself or a certain era in which he played. Thus, I've no problem with the mercurial Sayers having been enshrined. But you're right. I am somewhat biased because I've seen Brian's Song.

Lastly, I hope you get around to posting, if you've not done so already, why Lee Roy Selmon or Howie Long are in the Hall over Andre Tippett.

 

[texpat]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

It's a shame he could never stay healthy, but Bo Jackson was a helluva back.

5.4 yards per carry.

In 3 different years, a 88 yd run, 91 yd TD, 92 yd TD.

http://www.nfl.com/players/bojackson/profile?id=JAC631960

 

[Wotan_the_Wanderer]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

^Yeah, and my favorite Bo Jackson memory: out running a Seahawks defense then bowling over the biggest fraud pro football has ever seen in Brian Bosworth.

 

[kriskanos]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

The Hall of Fame is a joke. Case in point there is a QB in the hall with these stats Career Stats
TD-INT 173-220
Yards 27,663
QB Rating 65.5
Plus he wore panty hose

 

[RayClay]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

I personally prefer the big, bruising power backs, but in all fairness, the above strikes me as an overstatement. Obviously, three 200lb smurfs who've succeeded in the league and who've won are Walter Payton, Tony Dorsett and Marcus Allen. And if we are to consider Campbell a winner, then the smurf Thurman Thomas needs to also be considered a winner and introduced into the list of winning RBs. But again, no way in hell would I take the helmetless one to Campbell if I'm building a team. This, however, is a personal, subjective preference toward a certain type of runner and a certain brand of football and I'm not so sure there really is an objective formula as to which style of runner or which brand of football is more conducive to winning in the NFL.

Now, Sayers was way before my time and I regret that I never got a chance to see him play. But I know many people who have lived through that era as football fans and invariably, Jim Brown and Gale Sayers are two names that come up time and time again when an argument on the greatest RB is instigated. This in turn tells me that Sayers, despite the short career and relatively weak career stats he put up, played the game in such a manner that he either changed the game to a certain extent or at the very least left an indelible, lasting impression on the fans. I can't imagine a RB today single-handedly scoring 36 points as did Sayers. And as important as total career stats are when reflecting on a certain player's career, I think it's nearly important to reflect on a certain player's impact on the game itself or a certain era in which he played. Thus, I've no problem with the mercurial Sayers having been enshrined. But you're right. I am somewhat biased because I've seen Brian's Song.

Lastly, I hope you get around to posting, if you've not done so already, why Lee Roy Selmon or Howie Long are in the Hall over Andre Tippett.

When you throw in less talented guys like Csonka, John Riggins and Bettis, I don't think it's an overstatement.

Marcus Allen was 6'2" 210, so I wouldn't call him a smurf.

Dorsett and Payton certainly stood up to the beating and were great backs. I'll still take a guy who can hurt you inside and out.

I'd take Dillon in his prime (we didn't see nearly his prime yet he's our all time season rushing record holder) over either of them.

Before you laugh, let me put Corey in our fantasy time machine on the Dallas or Chicago teams and let Dorsett or Payton toil in misery in Cincinnati

 

[RayClay]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

The Hall of Fame is a joke. Case in point there is a QB in the hall with these stats Career Stats
TD-INT 173-220
Yards 27,663
QB Rating 65.5
Plus he wore panty hose

Point well taken, although I probably would have voted for him. TD/ int ratio was bad but percentages weren't for the time.

They had Boozer and Snell accounting for 10-12 TDs a year too.

They didn't dump off short like they do now.

No doubt his stats don't hold up but despite two bad knees he did throw for a lot of yards and yards per game.

I agree you're right just on stats. I would say it's arguable.

I can't say the same for Sayers. Projecting he would have more than doubled his rushing totals seems a stretch to me.

 

[QuiGon]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

The Hall of Fame is a joke. Case in point there is a QB in the hall with these stats Career Stats
TD-INT 173-220
Yards 27,663
QB Rating 65.5
Plus he wore panty hose

Not to mention the complete lack of pure kickers and/or punters in there. I agree it's a joke.

 

[RayClay]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

Not to mention the complete lack of pure kickers and/or punters in there. I agree it's a joke.

All hall of fames are a joke for this and other reasons. Still, you hope the bad decisions are the exception, not the rule.

Speaking of which, did you know there is a Boston/New england Patriot on the All AFL team (only a first team) in the Pro Football Hall of fame?

And he wasn't even nominated for the Patriots hall??

Houston Antwine, best DL in Patriots history up to the present squad.

2008 Patriot Hall of fame!!:rocker:

 

[Wotan_the_Wanderer]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

When you throw in less talented guys like Csonka, John Riggins and Bettis, I don't think it's an overstatement.

Marcus Allen was 6'2" 210, so I wouldn't call him a smurf.

Allen was hardly a bruiser in the Campbell, Csonka, Riggins and Bettis mold though and one of his great talents aside from his running ability was his uncanny ability to glance tackles and not take a head-on pounding rush after rush. Also, let's throw in Roger Craig, Ricky Waters and Terrell Davis. Yes, they're bigger than 200lbs, but none were the typical power backs in the mold of Campbell, Csonka or Riggins. You're trying to make a case that one type of runner, the power back, is more conducise to winning in the league. Obviously, there's much more to it then that. Will the Pats not win this year because we have Laurence Maroney rather than Dillon or Antowain?

 

[RayClay]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

Allen was hardly a bruiser in the Campbell, Csonka, Riggins and Bettis mold though and one of his great talents aside from his running ability was his uncanny ability to glance tackles and not take a head-on pounding rush after rush. Also, let's throw in Roger Craig, Ricky Waters and Terrell Davis. Yes, they're bigger than 200lbs, but none were the typical power backs in the mold of Campbell, Csonka or Riggins. You're trying to make a case that one type of runner, the power back, is more conducise to winning in the league. Obviously, there's much more to it then that. Will the Pats not win this year because we have Laurence Maroney rather than Dillon or Antowain?

Well, we're picking nits now. A good running back has to be able to go inside and outside, or just go inside (Bettis Csonka etc.)

The curtis martins, Payton's etc. could do both and so could Sayer or M. Allen, though elusiveness was their strong point.

All except sayers proved durable too. I'm not knocking Sayers or saying you need a bruising back, but one thing is for sure, many great college backs couldn't hit it inside enough to last in the NFL.

Hell, Franco Harris was 230 but he tiptoed like a Ballerina much like Kevin Faulks style, which is also great (lightfooted, smooth striding) for catching passes.

The difference is Franco could tuck the shoulder when needed and apply some force, but that definitely wasn't his preference.

 

[RayClay]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

As for Maroney, he definitely needs to hit the hole immediately. His game is questionable right now for that reason.

 

[Wotan_the_Wanderer]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

Well, we're picking nits now. A good running back has to be able to go inside and outside, or just go inside (Bettis Csonka etc.)

The curtis martins, Payton's etc. could do both and so could Sayer or M. Allen, though elusiveness was their strong point.

Naw, I wasn't nitpicking. Rather I was making a case that there really isn't one proven approach to building a winning running game and I'm pretty sure I made this point in my first post here. Your Curtis, Payton, Sayer and Macus Allen examples are exactly what I'm referring to, and Terrell Davis also fits this bill. So we seem to be in agreement over this. But again, I personally prefer a powerback system and one name you didn't bring up was Ottis. I prefer Ottis, Dillon and obviously, Campbell to the shifty backs or the in-between backs. And it's probably best for me to leave it at that considering I don't want to run the risk of hijacking your thread.

Finally, I agree also that Maroney needs to hit the line faster, but I think this in part has something to do with the blocking schemes. He's reading which holes to hit when the OLine is zoning and waiting for the holes to develop. In the man blocking scheme, he for the most part hits them fast and hard.

 

[Armen Da Pats Fan]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

Maybe so, but that movie was so sad.....

Thanks, now I've got that crappy song in my head!

James Caan was so much better as Sonny Corleone!

I play softball every week @ Brian Piccolo Park in Cooper City, FL.

I guess he was from down here or something.

If Gale Sayers is in the Hall, than Sam Bam Cunningham should be, too!

 

[RayClay]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

Naw, I wasn't nitpicking. Rather I was making a case that there really isn't one proven approach to building a winning running game and I'm pretty sure I made this point in my first post here. Your Curtis, Payton, Sayer and Macus Allen examples are exactly what I'm referring to, and Terrell Davis also fits this bill. So we seem to be in agreement over this. But again, I personally prefer a powerback system and one name you didn't bring up was Ottis. I prefer Ottis, Dillon and obviously, Campbell to the shifty backs or the in-between backs. And it's probably best for me to leave it at that considering I don't want to run the risk of hijacking your thread.

Finally, I agree also that Maroney needs to hit the line faster, but I think this in part has something to do with the blocking schemes. He's reading which holes to hit when the OLine is zoning and waiting for the holes to develop. In the man blocking scheme, he for the most part hits them fast and hard.

Didn't really mean you were picking nits, just that a talented running back is always welcome. Just that it's rare for a running back to almost always count on elusiveness (Sanders) and be successful. All the smaller running backs we mentioned had to get it done inside to be effective, even if it was just using a great line and quickness to work the middle and force the D to respect it.

I guess what I meant is we really probably don't disagree much.

Hijack!? That's a laugh. Probably one of a handful not about spy cameras which I think is welcome.

 

[Fanfrom1960]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

Sayers made the football HOF for the same reason Sandy Koufax did the baseball HOF...being stupefyingly good, albeit for a very short career. One case you can make for Koufax, though, is his world series record. Sayers teams, concurrent with **** Butkus, had only one winning season. I saw Sayers play, and I'm just fine with him being in the hall of fame. Call it quality, not quantity if you want. Fabulous quality. Sayers, as far as great shifty running backs go, had only one peer, Barry Sanders, of course. As far as 1000 yard seasons, he played in the 14 game season era.

 

[patsfan13]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

James Caan was so much better as Sonny Corleone!

I play softball every week @ Brian Piccolo Park in Cooper City, FL.

I guess he was from down here or something.

If Gale Sayers is in the Hall, than Sam Bam Cunningham should be, too!

I loved Sam Bam and L Nance for that matter, but having watched all these guys they weren't close to G Sayers who is second to J Brown in terms of RB's I have seen play.

Sayers is the football equivalent to S Koufax. Who during the short prime of his career was the best.

You also have to measure Sayers stats relative to his peers. They played a 12 game schedule and the stats of his era weren't comparable to todays players.

 

[40yrpatsfan]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

Sayers was a cross between OJ and Barry Sanders. Simpson was athletic and graceful and fast, Sanders could change directon on a dime. Sayers was both.
An athlete along the lines of Mike Haynes. They just could never catch Sayers and get him on the ground. He would commonly run 40 yards to gain 15.

Tie between Earl Campbell and Larry Csonka for pure power, though Campbell was the more talented of the two.

Jim Brown was the best combination of power, moves, and speed, and therefore the best ever.

 

[DonBlackmon55]

Re: OT How the hell did Gale Sayers get into the hall of fame?

Probably because he was the best running back the game had ever seen.

You're right. He didn't do it over a long career. But there may be a place in Canton for the guy who is the answer to this question: If you had to choose a RB for one game, jut one game, who would it be?

Gale Sayers
.....
.....
.....
.....
Then Jim Brown, Earl Campbell, OJ Simpson, Eric ****erson.

I'd say that Emmitt Smith and Walter Payton are a little bit below these top 5.

ummmmm Barry Sanders says Hello from above Gayle. Case Closed