One Nuts prospective on this situation

[PATSNUTme]

I've tried posting several football related threads and they have died so I might as well join the party. Here are my thoughts on the situation.

First let's make it clear, the Patiots did violate NFL policy. From what I know now, it was more that a comparable speeding violation but less that a comparable running a red light volation. There should be penalties laid down by the NFL. However, the NFL should be very careful not to be too harsh for reasons that I will explain later. I think the maximum penalty should be no higher than a loss of a 4th round pick in 2008 and a 6th in 2009 and maybe a fine.

Now if the NFL over reaches with the penalties, then this could come back and hit them between the eyes. BB has been in this league for 30 years. I'm sure he knows where the NFL bodies ar buried and the NFL's skeletons in the closet are. If they are too harsh, I think BB in his own way will make them pay a high price for it.

This has given an opportunity for the BB haters in the media and NFL to come out swinging. It's too bad but it happened. If the NFL does not get excessive with their penalties, it will all die down in a couple of weeks.

Patriots haters and fans from other teams will call the Patriots Dynasty "tarnished". Don't buy it, in fact ignore the stupid bastards. Nothing this team has done in the past or will do in the future has been tarnished. Just because some jerks say so, doesn't mean it's true.

Now if the NFL does come down with overly harsh penalties, I'll be royally pissed and will voice my anger in no uncertan terms ( for all the good it will do). But until then, I rather think about beating the San Diego SUPER Chargers this Sunday.

Just one Nuts opinion.

 

[LoveDemPats]

Yeah, as far as not listening to the Lynch mob, here is a great read.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/070912

 

[PATSNUTme]

Yeah, as far as not listening to the Lynch mob, here is a great read.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/070912

"Everyone outside of NE has been looking for a reason the hate them"

I would say that applies to 95% of the media in and out of NE. But the truth is they weren't looking for a reason, they already had one, BB.

 

[bradmahn]

Patsnut, it's hard for me to see this as a gross inequity in sports, or that the Pats are "cheaters" more than anyone else who steals signs. If the end result is the same, something that is legal in the NFL, why is what the Pats did cheating? They broke the rules, yes, but breaking the rules is not synonymous with cheating. If the Pats are cheaters for this, the Dolphins are cheaters as well.

I think a third round pick and fines would be steep, but probably what will happen.

 

[PATSNUTme]

Patsnut, it's hard for me to see this as a gross inequity in sports, or that the Pats are "cheaters" more than anyone else who steals signs. If the end result is the same, something that is legal in the NFL, why is what the Pats did cheating? They broke the rules, yes, but breaking the rules is not synonymous with cheating. If the Pats are cheaters for this, the Dolphins are cheaters as well.

I think a third round pick and fines would be steep, but probably what will happen.

The only ones that call this cheating are the media, who want drama, and the Patriots haters (some of the same).

Violation of NFL rules? Yes, it appears that's the case. Penalties? There should be some now. Cheating? Absolutely not, as much as ayone knows the facts at this time.

 

[PromisedLand]

Patsnut, it's hard for me to see this as a gross inequity in sports, or that the Pats are "cheaters" more than anyone else who steals signs. If the end result is the same, something that is legal in the NFL, why is what the Pats did cheating? They broke the rules, yes, but breaking the rules is not synonymous with cheating. If the Pats are cheaters for this, the Dolphins are cheaters as well.

I think a third round pick and fines would be steep, but probably what will happen.

I would define cheating as "breaking the rules in order to gain a competitive advantage". If it turns out that's what BB did then yes, we cheated.

It is my understanding that what the Dolphins did was not against the rules, in which case it wasn't cheating. But if they did break a rule then they cheated also. However, two wrongs don't make a right. If on the other hand, EVERYBODY cheats and and the league does nothing about it, then one could argue that NOT cheating leaves one at a competitive DIS-advantage. However, that assumes a fact not in evidence.

 

[PATSNUTme]

I would define cheating as "breaking the rules in order to gain a competitive advantage". If it turns out that's what BB did then yes, we cheated.

It is my understanding that what the Dolphins did was not against the rules, in which case it wasn't cheating. But if they did break a rule then they cheated also. However, two wrongs don't make a right. If on the other hand, EVERYBODY cheats and and the league does nothing about it, then one could argue that NOT cheating leaves one at a competitive DIS-advantage. However, that assumes a fact not in evidence.

Would that be a "competitive advatage" in a game presently being played or a "competitive advantage" in a future game? I am not trying to split hairs here.

If BB is doing the taping for reference in preparation in a future game, that is not cheating, IMO. Hell, a team could (and maybe should) change their signals before the next time that they meet. If the Patriots are using that
tape during a game in progress against NFL rules, then that would be cheating.

Once again, we will have to wait for more information before making final judgements.

 

[PromisedLand]

Would that be a "competitive advatage" in a game presently being played or a "competitive advantage" in a future game? I am not trying to split hairs here.

If BB is doing the taping for reference in preparation in a future game, that is not cheating, IMO. Hell, a team could (and maybe should) change their signals before the next time that they meet. If the Patriots are using that
tape during a game in progress against NFL rules, then that would be cheating.

Once again, we will have to wait for more information before making final judgements.

It depends on what the rule says. If it just says "no videotaping on the field", then IMO it is cheating if by videotaping you gain a competitive advantage now or in the future.

But if (as someone here said was stated on WEEI) the rule says, "no videotaping on the field to gain a competitive advantage in the game being played" then it is not cheating to videotape if the information is not used to gain an advantage in the current game, it is just breaking a rule. You do, however, leave yourself open to the APPEARANCE of impropriety which BB should know can be damaging too (as I said in the other thread).

 

[Bill's Girl]

I've tried posting several football related threads and they have died so I might as well join the party. Here are my thoughts on the situation.

First let's make it clear, the Patiots did violate NFL policy. From what I know now, it was more that a comparable speeding violation but less that a comparable running a red light volation. There should be penalties laid down by the NFL. However, the NFL should be very careful not to be too harsh for reasons that I will explain later. I think the maximum penalty should be no higher than a loss of a 4th round pick in 2008 and a 6th in 2009 and maybe a fine.

Now if the NFL over reaches with the penalties, then this could come back and hit them between the eyes. BB has been in this league for 30 years. I'm sure he knows where the NFL bodies ar buried and the NFL's skeletons in the closet are. If they are too harsh, I think BB in his own way will make them pay a high price for it.

This has given an opportunity for the BB haters in the media and NFL to come out swinging. It's too bad but it happened. If the NFL does not get excessive with their penalties, it will all die down in a couple of weeks.

Patriots haters and fans from other teams will call the Patriots Dynasty "tarnished". Don't buy it, in fact ignore the stupid bastards. Nothing this team has done in the past or will do in the future has been tarnished. Just because some jerks say so, doesn't mean it's true.

Now if the NFL does come down with overly harsh penalties, I'll be royally pissed and will voice my anger in no uncertan terms ( for all the good it will do). But until then, I rather think about beating the San Diego SUPER Chargers this Sunday.

Just one Nuts opinion.

This whole thing is making me feel like a Nut... I was out and about today and didn't have any time to look at the Boston Globe or Boston Herald. I was walking into a store that had a Herald news stand and seeing the headline, "Beli-Cheat" really hit me hard. I know that a mistake was made and a rule was broken, but does BB really deserve that kind of treatment? My answer to this is no.

What you wrote about BB knowing where the "NFL bodies" are buried is an interesting observation. Everyone here has been upset with Mangini because he ratted BB out on this thing. Do you think BB would turn around and do the same thing?

The whole thing with the way the NFL has configured itself now has to with parity. They did not want anymore dynasties like Pittsburgh or Dallas, and one man, ONE MAN with a plan beat the system. One man with the brains and creativity to use his players created a dynasty! This is what set the hounds on BB, his own success.

Now granted BB is not the most media savvy guy UNLESS he is talking football. Reporters don't want to hear about the Xs and Os of how to keep LT from racking up 200 yards against our defense, they want controversy, because controversy sells!

Having had the opportunity to meet the man and sit and listen to him lecture I got to see a unique side of BB that not a lot of media guys take the time to appreciate. I know when the Tuna was here, he had his media darlings whom he treated very well. When BB came here there was none of that, just like with his players, all of the members of the media were treated the same and that ticked a lot of veteran reporters off! Plus hearing "horror" stories from thier Cleveland contemporaries pushed them even farther away from BB. From his first day on the job here the Boston media has been smearing his name and Bill shut up, took it and went out and won and won and won again.

Here's to you Bill, do it again, go out and win the whole damn thing for a fourth time! No one like Lombardi much either, so just win baby.....