How the Pats Should Handle the Samuel Negotiations

[zippo59]

A couple of points:

1. Forget about anthing but the GUARANTEED money. That is all that matters. When you do that the situation clears up nicely. Here are the options with all money mentioned beign GUARANTEED.

a. He takes the $8MM and becomes a FA next season
b, He take the $12MM on the LT deal the Pats offerred at $6MM/yr average
c. He holds out for the $20MM Clement deal at about $8/MM/yr average.

Thats it, guy.....and btw, I'm tired about hearing about the freakin' "Market" being set. Because if it has, it has told us nothing that we don't already know. The high end of the elite market is Clement, the Low end is Bly, and the Pats offerred him a somewhat better Bly deal. He wants the Clement deal, and I don't think the Pats will give it to him. NOR do I believe anyone else will either, despite what the media is trying to leak, especially since the KNOW that the Pats will need significant compensation to let him go.

Did they really offer a deal that is better than the one Dre Bly got?

If that is true, Samuel can kiss my ass.

 

[Va_Pats_Fan]

Did they really offer a deal that is better than the one Dre Bly got?

If that is true, Samuel can kiss my ass.

the media also said that the Jets were interested. We don't know what he was offered.

 

[BTTA]

The issue isn't just about Samuel's worth. The Pats have budget money assigned to positions on the field, which they use as guidelines. If Samuel was the best corner to ever play the game, and demanded to be paid like it, they wouldn't do it, because it would throw their entire CAP allocation system off.

They can give $12M guranteed to a CB, but not $20, regardless of who it is.

 

[mgcolby]

the media also said that the Jets were interested. We don't know what he was offered.

They can offer him Manning money and it won't matter unless they are willing to give up the required compensation outlined in the CBA.

 

[Va_Pats_Fan]

They can offer him Manning money and it won't matter unless they are willing to give up the required compensation outlined in the CBA.

No, you missed my point. The jets did not contact him. The media said he did, but it (apparently) never happened. This is the same media that reported that he was offered Bly $$$$$.

My point is, we don't ~really~ know what has transpired.

 

[mgcolby]

No, you missed my point. The jets did not contact him. The media said he did, but it (apparently) never happened. This is the same media that reported that he was offered Bly $$$$$.

My point is, we don't ~really~ know what has transpired.

Gotchya.

Does anyone remember who reported the salary range he was offered? Was it Reiss?

 

[spacecrime]

Why is this Samuels fault? The market has been set by demand from other teams for quality CB's.

It's not his fault for wanting money, just like it wasn't Branch's "fault."

The problem was that Branch signed a contract and refused to honor it.

The problem for Samuel is that he is not honoring the franchise tag. Back when the players were pushing for free agency, they agreed if they got it, each team could protect one player a year from being a free agent, but that player would get a lot of money, the average of the top five players at his position.

Now that free agency has been around awhile, the players don't like the franchise tag. Well, tough. Do they want to undo the agreement tehy made to get free agency? No, they want that. They jsut don't want to live up to their end of the bargain.

Imagine if the NFL decided that players were no longer free agents after 4 years. Ha! The player would be screaming and go to court and make the NFL honor the agreement.

Well, it works both ways. Stop saying you will only honor the part of the agreement that benefits you.

That's why Samuel is at fault, but NOT until he misses a game.

As long as he stays out of training camp, but shows up for game one, all is cool. That's what some of us are forgetting. He hasn't missed anything yet. All he has done is "say" he won't play.

That means nothing.

Think of it like Aqua4Ever. He says he will donate money to the food pantry if he loses a bet. He loses the bet. How much money did the food pantry get?

Nothing, because SAYING you will do something, and DOING it, are not the same.

Aqua4Ever is a lying scum, we all know that. But Samuel isn't. He is doing nothing wrong and can skip all the practices he wants, just as long as he shows up for game one.

We ought to cut Samuel a little slack until then he actually does something for us to be upset about.

My 2 cents.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Unless Asante has been cloned into an exact copy of Champ Bailey he is NOT worth what he wants.

Besides last years breakout he showed N-O-T-H-I-N-G to write home about.

What he wants is Champ Bailey money

 

[Va_Pats_Fan]

It's not his fault for wanting money, just like it wasn't Branch's "fault."

The problem was that Branch signed a contract and refused to honor it.

The problem for Samuel is that he is not honoring the franchise tag. Back when the players were pushing for free agency, they agreed if they got it, each team could protect one player a year from being a free agent, but that player would get a lot of money, the average of the top five players at his position.

Now that free agency has been around awhile, the players don't like the franchise tag. Well, tough. Do they want to undo the agreement tehy made to get free agency? No, they want that. They jsut don't want to live up to their end of the bargain.

Just to play the devils advocate, the CBA also defines what must happen if the player decides to sit out. How that effects salary cap, accrued time, if the tag counts once towards the 2 total..etc. If looking @ it strictly from that point of view, AS is well within his rights as defined by the CBA. The tag does not force a franchise player to play, how is AS not honoring it?

 

[zippo59]

Just to play the devils advocate, the CBA also defines what must happen if the player decides to sit out. How that effects salary cap, accrued time, if the tag counts once towards the 2 total..etc. If looking @ it strictly from that point of view, AS is well within his rights as defined by the CBA. The tag does not force a franchise player to play, how is AS not honoring it?

Samuel is within his rights to hold out, but the Patriotd are also within their rights to not give him a new contract, so he shouldn't be *****ing that they are doing something unfair.

 

[Va_Pats_Fan]

Samuel is within his rights to hold out, but the Patriotd are also within their rights to not give him a new contract, so he shouldn't be *****ing that they are doing something unfair.

correct, but you need to separate the process from the posturing. The process is being followed. The posturing has just begun.

 

[dhamz]

The problem for Samuel is that he is not honoring the franchise tag.

Is there somewhere it says that a player must sign the tender in May and must go to minicamp? If not, then how is he not "honoring the franchise tag?"

 

[DaBruinz]

The problem with the tagged players and the agents is that MANY of them think that the TAG salary is the STARTING point for negotiations. Its not. Its the number for a single year and its what the player and agent should shoot for as the AVG salary of the next contract. If you want more, put in incentives.

Personally, the Pats should tell Asante that if he has the offers, sign one of them and let them start working out a compensation package. That puts the onus on the team signing Samuel to step up or lose the 2 1st rounders. I think the Pats would be willing to take a player if they felt it would help the team. Like an Andra Davis from Cleveland or an Antoine Winfield from Minnesota.

 

[Warren94]

Winfield for Samuel straight up!

 

[solman]

This is such a waste of time. If Asante isn't traded, and the Franchise tag is still being offered by the Patriots, it is absolutely certain that Asante will sign before the first game.

Not only is he certain of this, but the Patriots are certain as well.

To do otherwise would cost Asante money, and he cares WAY too much about money to ever do such a thing.

The only negotiating that will happen here is over a possible trade of Asante to another team.

Let's all stop paying attention to empty rhetoric.

 

[solman]

The problem with the tagged players and the agents is that MANY of them think that the TAG salary is the STARTING point for negotiations. Its not. Its the number for a single year and its what the player and agent should shoot for as the AVG salary of the next contract. If you want more, put in incentives.

Any agent that doesn't already understand this is incompetent. Asante's agent may be inexperienced, but its unlikely he is so stupid that he doesn't realize this.

Personally, the Pats should tell Asante that if he has the offers, sign one of them and let them start working out a compensation package. That puts the onus on the team signing Samuel to step up or lose the 2 1st rounders. I think the Pats would be willing to take a player if they felt it would help the team. Like an Andra Davis from Cleveland or an Antoine Winfield from Minnesota.

The Patriots shouldn't have to tell Asante's agent anything. He should already have figured this out on his own. If he hasn't, then he's not likely to have a very successful career.

 

[Pats726]

Why is this Samuels fault? The market has been set by demand from other teams for quality CB's.

If he is worth a number 1 AND a "quality" player, isn't he then worth what he is asking for?

No he isn't...

 

[jct]

My suggestion for the Pats FO is to stand pat.
They made 2 great offers both of which should compliment and reward his performance to date.
If he doesnt like it he can find a team to bring acceptable compensation or sit till week 10 or agree to terms.
I just hope we don't cave to him in negotiations.
He was a Great Player for 1 year. If he doesn't want our money thats OK.

 

[Pats726]

My suggestion for the Pats FO is to stand pat.
They made 2 great offers both of which should compliment and reward his performance to date.
If he doesnt like it he can find a team to bring acceptable compensation or sit till week 10 or agree to terms.
I just hope we don't cave to him in negotiations.
He was a Great Player for 1 year. If he doesn't want our money thats OK.

Actually half a season...but I agree they need to remain pat..and I do think they have given him fair offers for what he has done to this point. I'm really a bit leery of a player that wants top dollar for such little time PLAYING at that TOP Level. To me it's a red flag that THAT is the best his play will be...and that he has little faith in his own future play....so give me the money now!! Buyer beware.

 

[LaBrady]

I just had a thought... what if Pats let Samuel sit out. Now I am sure that we are not gonna lose every game because of this, well maybe 1 or 2. So now Samuel comes back week 10 AND the rest of the season, into the playoffs which we should make with or without him. Though the best part is that Samuel will have to play well, maybe as well as he did in 06 in order to get that big contract he wants! He has no choice really, because if everyone sees that he was a one year wonder he isnt going to get the big contract. So Samuel I am sure will be ready and will play good right at the time we need him! The playoffs!