BB Contract.....

[jgb95]

How is it possible that we can not find out if he's under contract for 2008?????

I know it's the PATS but this is rediculos that we don't know if our teams coach will be around for 2008.

PFT is pushing the notion that we're loading up for one more run at the Bowl as BB sails off into the sunset.

I don't buy it but I'd love to know if BB will be around for the future. I think Kraft will pay BB what ever he'd ask for for a new contract extension at the very least.

 

[naclone]

Let me ask you something.

can you name 1 reason that it is in kraft's best interest to not give BB anything he wants, to stay as long as he wants? i can't.

can you name 1 reason BB would rather coach another team, given what we know about what his organizational philosophy is (i.e. sustaining a contending team for the long-term)? i can't.

can you name 1 good reason that BB isn't under contract for 2008 (hint: breathless media speculation that he is not doesn't count)?

can you name 1 reason this offseason's "Splash" (consisting of 1-guy who's deal takes up less cap % than rosie colvin at the time of his deal, 2 role-player signings that nobody would think twice about if they happened in June, and below market deals for two WR) is at all out of character with the Patriots philosophy (hint: it's not)?

can you name 1 reason that it is in BB or Kraft's best interest to let you know anything about their business dealings?

i think the answer to your question lies in the answers to those questions.

lemme know what you work out.

 

[smg93]

Wow naclone. Tell us how you really feel.

 

[Fixit]

i think the answer to your question lies in the answers to those questions.

There is no spoon.

 

[naclone]

a little logic goes a long way

 

[ironwasp]

BB's contract is really none of our business.

Sure, we'd all like to know, but if the team has no obligation to reveal it, and BB doesn't want to talk about it, that's fine by me.

All I know is this: the guy is going to be on our sideline through this season and is so far making all the right moves for making it a successful season.

What comes next, comes next and we can worry about that then.

 

[solman]

How can anyone think that BB, with his strong sense of history, would walk away from the situation he has right now?

This is the guy who brought in Flutie to try ther last drop kick extra point ever.

This is the guy who brought in Testaverde to extend the consecutive seasons with a TD record to a level where it may stay for decades.

BB has an accute sense of history, and he knows that this Patriots team may eclipse the Steelers as the best dynasty ever.

You'd better believe that he gets a kick out of the NFL intro sequences where they show BB, Lombardi and Walsh as the coaching trinity.

BB isn't going anywhere until the run is over.

100 years from now they'll still be telling stories about BB and his Patriots (enhanced by decades of baseless exaggeration), and that's just the way he wants it.

 

[BelichickFan]

PFT is pushing the notion that we're loading up for one more run at the Bowl as BB sails off into the sunset.

Two reactions :

- Right now I want the Patriots to win another SB. If I could make a deal right now that the Patriots win the SB in 2007 but that guarantees Belichick leaves after the season, I"m making the deal.

- I don't think there's many jobs he'd leave for and the fact that the new Giants GM isn't impressing anyone with his start is a good thing because that's one of Belichick's potential destinations but he's not leaving to work for a bad GM.

 

[patchick]

Naclone, all of your "can you name 1 reason" points are perfectly valid reasons why BB should continue as the Patriots' coach as long as he wants. None of them address whether he actually does have a long-term deal. And none of them address this:

can you name 1 reason why the Patriots wouldn't come out and say that yes, their coach is under contract for 2008, if in fact he is?

I can think of plenty of reasons why they wouldn't disclose any details of a contract. But what on Earth would be the downside of reassuring your fan base that the big guy is planning to stick around for a little while? It wouldn't give away any competitive advantage, it could only help in negotiations with players, it wouldn't be an invasion of privacy...and it's public knowledge for every other head coach in the entire NFL. Under those circumstances, it's only natural that fans are getting a little nervous.

 

[naclone]

Naclone, all of your "can you name 1 reason" points are perfectly valid reasons why BB should continue as the Patriots' coach as long as he wants. None of them address whether he actually does have a long-term deal. And none of them address this:

can you name 1 reason why the Patriots wouldn't come out and say that yes, their coach is under contract for 2008, if in fact he is?

I can think of plenty of reasons why they wouldn't disclose any details of a contract. But what on Earth would be the downside of reassuring your fan base that the big guy is planning to stick around for a little while? It wouldn't give away any competitive advantage, it could only help in negotiations with players, it wouldn't be an invasion of privacy...and it's public knowledge for every other head coach in the entire NFL. Under those circumstances, it's only natural that fans are getting a little nervous.

I'm not a bit nervous. it's extremely clear to me that BB and Pioli have their dream jobs and have no intention of not seeing out the plan they hatched out with Kraft 7 years ago -- i.e. to sustain a successful team for the long-term. go back and read the articles covering why kraft hired BB.

ask yourself this: why would BB make such painstaking cap friendly moves each and every year when he could have a much easier go of things and just whip money around on stupid contracts for guys? just maybe it's because he's not going anywhere. BB's system is fundamentally about being competitive both this year and in 5 years. why would you have a system like that if you didn't plan on sticking around in one place any less than 10 or 15 years?

as for 1 reason not to disclose the contract status, it's none of my business. as for free agents, i'm sure part of the pitch they get makes it very clear what BBs role is with the team moving forward. And maybe, just maybe, BB and Kraft think that it could be a distraction if it were common knowledge that BB is being paid what he is for as long as he is. you know as well as i do the story then would be whether or not BB was earning his keep at such big dollars or for so many years or whatever. it's a tenuous media situation no matter what. the bottom line is, revealing the details of BB's contract will not help win football games. and maybe, just maybe, the details could be a distraction. seems clear to me everyone who needs to know knows what they need to.

 

[patchick]

I can think of plenty of reasons why they wouldn't disclose any details of a contract. But what on Earth would be the downside of reassuring your fan base that the big guy is planning to stick around for a little while?

as for 1 reason not to disclose the contract status, it's none of my business. as for free agents, i'm sure part of the pitch they get makes it very clear what BBs role is with the team moving forward. And maybe, just maybe, BB and Kraft think that it could be a distraction if it were common knowledge that BB is being paid what he is for as long as he is. you know as well as i do the story then would be whether or not BB was earning his keep at such big dollars or for so many years or whatever. it's a tenuous media situation no matter what. the bottom line is, revealing the details of BB's contract will not help win football games. and maybe, just maybe, the details could be a distraction. seems clear to me everyone who needs to know knows what they need to.

Naclone, I tried to make it very clear that I'm not talking about contract details. Nobody's asking to know how much money Belichick makes. And nobody's doubting that this is a good situation that he'd presumably want to stay in. There is only one question in play: is he under contract for 2008? "It's none of my business" doesn't strike me as a real business reason for the franchise not to tamp down negative speculation and make the fan base happy by saying BB's here for 2008, when there's no downside to doing so.

Maybe he's already signed an extension and he's just playing with us.

Maybe he's already signed an extension and he's just playing with the media.

Maybe he doesn't see any benefit to negotiating the extension until he's actually a "free agent."

Maybe he's leaving his options open.

Aren't you curious?

 

[Patriotic Fervor]

It's only natural? Hey, I know some people don't feel comfortable unless they're worrying about something, and this appears to be one of those cases.

This is the most successful coach in Patriot history (we'll worry - ahem! - about NFL history later). You don't think this guy can write his own ticket every time out? I'm certain he does.

Further, I'm pretty confident that they do these contracts on a handshake basis. Kraft says to BB, "Tell us what you want, and I'll have my people do this with your people. Then we'll get it finalized over lunch at the Cafe Escadrille (or some such place)."

I mean, there is the contract to actually be signed and everything, but it's really just a formality. In essence, it's all done over a handshake.

Why would he go anywhere else? This is his stamp on life. He doesn't appear to possess the wanderlust of Bill Parcells, for example. There's nothing else out there that approaches the situation he's in now. Nothing.

While the reasons you've enumerated for telling the world about his contract status sound innocent and innocuous, they are your reasons. Not his. Not Kraft's. Yours. Important to remember that.

Bob Kraft is an excellent, exciting and successful world-class businessman. He reveals only what he must (in accordance with law) or otherwise what he thinks he must. I believe this is one of the principle reasons the Kraft/Belichick relationship is so strong and works so well. BB respects Kraft for this trait.

Should you ask, "Why not just tell us if he's signed or not?", think back to the last time there was a public contractual brouhaha concerning a coach's status with this team, and I think you'll see why there is very little, if any, benefit to any party, fans included, in handling a coach's contract status this way.

As for PFT's notions about "one last push" from Belichick and the Patriots before "sailing off into the sunset" (he'd have to be on the West Coast to do that!), maybe PFT is getting ready to ramp up to write an actual story some time before the end of the decade! Man, I'd pay some cheap money to see that!

Relax. When BB gets tired of coaching, he'll move on to something else (who knows what that might be). Not a moment before.

And house money says in that interim, he stays right here.

 

[Pat the Pats Fan]

Bill is his father's son. Bill's family is important to him, as was his father Steve. Steve could have gone anywhere he wanted as a head coach, but chose stability and setting a legacy at Navy for himself and his family. Bill is doing the same with his family and the Patriots. He has roots here. His children are in school here. And like his father, he is an extremely private individual. Contract details aren't available because, maybe he doesn't want them to be. He's not going anywhere, IMHO.

 

[patchick]

Bob Kraft is an excellent, exciting and successful world-class businessman. He reveals only what he must (in accordance with law) or otherwise what he thinks he must. I believe this is one of the principle reasons the Kraft/Belichick relationship is so strong and works so well. BB respects Kraft for this trait.

Should you ask, "Why not just tell us if he's signed or not?", think back to the last time there was a public contractual brouhaha concerning a coach's status with this team, and I think you'll see why there is very little, if any, benefit to any party, fans included, in handling a coach's contract status this way.

Look, I'm not losing any sleep over this. I fully expect BB to stay. I didn't even start the thread. I just think the whole thing's a little peculiar.

Secrecy is not a virtue unto itself. It's only valuable insofar as it gives you a competitive advantage which outweighs any negative consequences. So far, nobody has been able to suggest any advantage whatsoever to keeping BB's contract status a secret...if he's actually under contract beyond 2007. The "public contractual brouhaha" only comes into play if he's not under contract. Which is why reasonable people suspect that he's not. Which wouldn't mean the sky is falling, but would be interesting, no? Surely a fair topic for discussion, just as we'd discuss the contract status of a player.

 

[naclone]

Naclone, I tried to make it very clear that I'm not talking about contract details. Nobody's asking to know how much money Belichick makes. And nobody's doubting that this is a good situation that he'd presumably want to stay in. There is only one question in play: is he under contract for 2008? "It's none of my business" doesn't strike me as a real business reason for the franchise not to tamp down negative speculation and make the fan base happy by saying BB's here for 2008, when there's no downside to doing so.

Maybe he's already signed an extension and he's just playing with us.

Maybe he's already signed an extension and he's just playing with the media.

Maybe he doesn't see any benefit to negotiating the extension until he's actually a "free agent."

Maybe he's leaving his options open.

Aren't you curious?

you're right. you did make that clear. my apologies for not picking it up.

and i really don't have an answer as to why they wouldn't confirm whether he is under contract for 2008 other than they seem to have a policy about not discussing it at all.

as for my curiosity, it's never occurred to me even once that BB would not be coaching the Patriots in 2008. seriously. I have an extremely strong belief that BB and Kraft and Pioli set out in 2000 to see exactly how long they could keep this team competitive. that goal has been the foundation of every move they have made since. Maybe I'm completely out of touch with reality but I'll be shocked if BB and Pioli aren't still running this team ten years from now. Shocked. anything could happen of course. Theo Epstien did walk away from his dream job. but he came back afterall.

Pioli said just last week on weei with regard to his supposed "dream job" with the NYG -- "No disrespect to any other job opportunities that may have been out there or may come in the future, but you know what my dream job is? My dream job is being with people I care about, people that I want to work with, people that I enjoy coming to work with every day, whether it's coaches or ownership or the players. We've built something here that is pretty special. Quality of life has more to do with being happy, coming to work every day, and winning. The other thing that's paramount is we're winning here. It's a great situation, with a lot of great people, and I enjoy being here."

maybe i'm reading too much into it, and as i said, anything can happen, but there isn't a shred of doubt in my mind that BB and Pioli want to be here and you'll never convince there will be a reason Kraft wont do anything and everything to make them happy.

so unless BB starts shagging Myra on the side or something, I just don't see it as an issue.

 

[patchick]

Pioli said just last week on weei with regard to his supposed "dream job" with the NYG -- "No disrespect to any other job opportunities that may have been out there or may come in the future, but you know what my dream job is? My dream job is being with people I care about, people that I want to work with, people that I enjoy coming to work with every day, whether it's coaches or ownership or the players. We've built something here that is pretty special. Quality of life has more to do with being happy, coming to work every day, and winning. The other thing that's paramount is we're winning here. It's a great situation, with a lot of great people, and I enjoy being here."

maybe i'm reading too much into it, and as i said, anything can happen, but there isn't a shred of doubt in my mind that BB and Pioli want to be here and you'll never convince there will be a reason Kraft wont do anything and everything to make them happy.

You know something? I completely agree. I guess I'm just more curious than you.

 

[Patriotic Fervor]

Look, I'm not losing any sleep over this. I fully expect BB to stay. I didn't even start the thread. I just think the whole thing's a little peculiar.

Secrecy is not a virtue unto itself. It's only valuable insofar as it gives you a competitive advantage which outweighs any negative consequences. So far, nobody has been able to suggest any advantage whatsoever to keeping BB's contract status a secret...if he's actually under contract beyond 2007. The "public contractual brouhaha" only comes into play if he's not under contract. Which is why reasonable people suspect that he's not. Which wouldn't mean the sky is falling, but would be interesting, no? Surely a fair topic for discussion, just as we'd discuss the contract status of a player.

No, the only reason extant is because you want to know. Why is that important? It might be nice for you, restful sleeping nights notwithstanding. But does any one else out there, Bob Kraft and Bill Belichick included, really care?

You're missing the point entirely. It's not important! If he decides to move on, then it becomes a matter of import. Not before.

Teams don't, as a rule, reveal this stuff because they're part of the organization's management. If the league thought a benefit might accrue, to the fans or otherwise, then it would become public knowledge, in much the same way as players' contracts are.

But it's not.

And as for the idea that secrecy in this instance has no value, it does - for the very reason you stated. Competitive advantage. If opposing teams think, rightly or wrongly, there might be trouble in paradise, might this attitude affect how they approach us?

This is a totally manufactured "debate", with no basis in reality.

A waste of time, as it were.

And brought out by the worry warts right after a truly spectacular week.

Like I say - a waste of time.

 

[Kdo5]

Yeah and PFT is copying the rumors that other people are SPECULATING.

 

[patchick]

Man, I was going to let this die. As I've said, I fully expect BB to stay. I'm mostly piqued that so many people treat this reasonable question as an outrageous thing to even discuss, as if we were demanding a public analysis of a Tom Brady sperm sample. But...

No, the only reason extant is because you want to know. Why is that important? It might be nice for you, restful sleeping nights notwithstanding.

Hold on...go back and look at the quote of mine you highlighted. I believe that in your eagerness to scoff at me you've answered precisely the opposite of the question I asked. For good derision, you need precision.

Teams don't, as a rule, reveal this stuff because they're part of the organization's management.

Huh...I was under the impression that the coach's yes/no contract status for 2008 was public knowledge for every other team in the entire league. Which is what makes this situation stand out. Am I wrong?

 

[Patriotic Fervor]

Man, I was going to let this die. As I've said, I fully expect BB to stay. I'm mostly piqued that so many people treat this reasonable question as an outrageous thing to even discuss, as if we were demanding a public analysis of a Tom Brady sperm sample. But...

We can let it die...but before we do that, please work on your analogies. That was an absolutely terrible one.

Hold on...go back and look at the quote of mine you highlighted. I believe that in your eagerness to scoff at me you've answered precisely the opposite of the question I asked. For good derision, you need precision.

I don't see what your point is here. From the very get-go, you're the one railing about the "secrecy" involved in the non-disclosure of BB's contract status. Really, no one cares, and it's not important.

Huh...I was under the impression that the coach's yes/no contract status for 2008 was public knowledge for every other team in the entire league. Which is what makes this situation stand out. Am I wrong?

I can see that for the Green Bay Packers, since they are a publicly-owned corporation. If other teams choose to do it, that is their business, and it would indeed be a business decision. One made by a private corporation.

By the same token, if the Pats don't want to reveal that part of their business publicly, that is their right and their business for the very same reason.

As a curious aside, is there a Web site that reveals the answer to this question about NFL coaches' contract status (i.e., "yes/no"), or is it available on individual teams' official Website, or on NFL.com, or what? Can you steer me to a source?

I thank you in advance.

Just for the record, PC, I like you, I invariably like your posts, and want you to know this is not at all personal. The subject matter is just inane. That's why it gets me off.