O yee of Little Faith (or Analysis)

[AzPatsFan]

Many Pats Fans seem to have subscribed to a form of Depression that we can't field a complete game breaking Pass Offense, so we have no chance.

You are spoiled. You never had that in the Superbowl winning years... Nor a #1 Defense either!

I think he Pats are much stronger today the then, or even the day the Broncos fell earlier this year.

A true NT, Siliga has entered the situation, and the Bronks won't be as productive in the run-a-dope. Siliga wasn't there in the last game. Undersized Verano and Jones were blown off the LOS, while Spikes was limping about. Neither Hightower nor Collins had found themselves back then, either.

The Bronks may even ignore the run invitation, being suspicious, making the Pass Defense even better, at no cost. Manning may be afraid to look a gift horse in the mouth, after the last trap game, offering the run.

The Pats secondary is both now deep and more important, now healthy. That wasn't true last time.

This is looking to me, more and more like a replay of the "The Greatest Show on Turf" game, of some fame. The Pats can actually match up with competent DBs against ALL of Manning's weapons, just like they did to Warner's. Bob Kraft even remarked that he felt that way, too.

Most teams don't have a prayer of doing so, before they have to employ DB scrubs, which then get toasted. Most teams simply don't have the secondary depth, That is Belichick's secret weapon, his 40-53 roster quality, and always has been.

Our present WR corps of Edelman, Amendola, Collie and Vereen (and probably Tompkins and possibly Dobson) is bigger and better than the tiny Brown, Branch, Patten, and Faulk. I'll take Blount, Ridley, Vareen over Antowain, Redmond, and Faulk too, by a country mile.

Today's Pats lines, both the Offensive and the Defensive are much better too.

We fondly remember Seymour and Willie, but it's this DL, that has accumulated more sacks than any in Belichick's history or Petey's, or Tuna's regimes, going all the way back to Raymond Berry's "Squish the Phish" season, 34 years ago.

You don't need a #1 Offense to win a Superbowl or three.
The Patriots were no where near such rarified stature then. Our #3 Offense this year, is better than any we had back then.

The Patriots dominated for several years with a dink and dunk passing game in combination with a fairly good running game. We are much better than that now, as the power run game is much better.

It's going to be delicious and delightful to Upend all the mediot analyst's prognostications, once more. Jump back on the Bandwagon...

 

[Archeryaddict12]

I am ready to win another SB, or 2 or 3

I love this team. And if we win it all, I think I will move it more than a perfect season.

 

[hwc]

There's no way we can beat The Greatest Show on Turf (tm).

 

[PYPER]

Today's Pats lines, both the Offensive and the Defensive are much better too.

We fondly remember Seymour and Willie, but it's this DL, that has accumulated more sacks than any in Belichick's history or Petey's, or Tuna's regimes, going all the way back to Raymond Berry's "Squish the Phish" season, 34 years ago.

Nice post but I think you're out of your mind if you believe this DLine is better than the groups who won back-to-back Super Bowls. Not even close.

 

[ATippett56]

Our present WR corps of Edelman, Amendola, Collie and Vereen (and probably Tompkins and possibly Dobson) is bigger and better than the tiny Brown, Branch, Patten, and Faulk.

You are completely insane. Nice of you to forget about wide receivers David Givens and Bethel Johnson, by the way.

 

[AzPatsFan]

You are completely insane. Nice of you to forget about wide receivers David Givens and Bethel Johnson, by the way.

Bethel was a good KR who wasn't much as a failed WR. Givens was good WR, but he came later, and he was only a possesion 7th rounder, wo speed from Notre Dame.

Nice try that only underlines your over romanticized memory.

 

[supafly]

I always enjoy your thoughts, AZ.

I do feel that you may be a bit on the highly optimistic side here, but it's better than being pessimistic

 

[PATRlOT]

Vareen? Verano?

:bricks:

 

[supafly]

Nice post but I think you're out of your mind if you believe this DLine is better than the groups who won back-to-back Super Bowls. Not even close.

Our defense overall was definitely better in 2001, 2003, 2004, 2006, and 2007, and yes--I believe that we were #1 in several categories in the back to back years. There are some years in there where we gave up 13-14 pts per game on average. In the 2001 season, we gave up 17 pts or less in 11/12 last games, including the postseason and stretch run.

It's also quite possible that our defense was better in other past years lately too, but I'm just naming the more obvious ones that immediately come to mind.

 

[supafly]

Vareen? Verano?

:bricks:

He's a bit on the elderly side. Give him a break

 

[Deus Irae]

Many Pats Fans seem to have subscribed to a form of Depression that we can't field a complete game breaking Pass Offense, so we have no chance.

You are spoiled. You never had that in the Superbowl winning years... Nor a #1 Defense either!

You don't need a #1 Offense to win a Superbowl or three. The Patriots were no where near such rarified stature then. Our #3 Offense this year, is better than any we had back then.

In 2001, the Patriots were #6 in points scored and #6 in points allowed
In 2003, the Patriots were #12 in points scored and #1 in points allowed
In 2004, the Patriots were #4 in points scored and #2 in points allowed

 

[AzPatsFan]

Nice post but I think you're out of your mind if you believe this DLine is better than the groups who won back-to-back Super Bowls. Not even close.

Who exactly was on that D line besides Seymour & Willie? OTH Pleasant? Forgetable Miller? We were so desperate for some beef and had to import/rent Mt. Washington in 2004 for a year, before importing Traylor in 2005.

Sorry about your over romanticized faulty memory. When did we finally draft Ty Warren and get a competent strong side DE?


I'll take DEs Chandler Jones, Rob Ninkovitch, Andre Carter, and Sealver Siliga at NT, and Chris Jones at penetrating tackle, along with their 33+ sacks. Too bad Vince Wilfork and Tommy Kelly are hurt though, as this would be a spectacular DL, otherwise.

 

[ATippett56]

Bethel was a good KR who wasn't much as a failed WR.

I guess you missed the 2003 AFC Divisional Playoff Game versus the Tennessee Titans.

Givens was good WR, but he came later, and he was only a possesion 7th rounder, wo speed from Notre Dame.

David Givens was part to two Super Bowl winning teams.

Nice try that only underlines your over romanticized memory.

Keep spewing your nonsense.

 

[supafly]

In 2001, the Patriots were #6 in points scored and #6 in points allowed
In 2003, the Patriots were #12 in points scored and #1 in points allowed
In 2004, the Patriots were #4 in points scored and #2 in points allowed

And just to top that thought off, even the 2001 defense, who some argued wasn't as good as our current defense, had one hell of a streak down the stretch where they didn't allow more than 17 points, and 11/12 of the last games total.

And they were probably the "weakest" of the bunch...

I'm very impressed with how our defense has been able to buckle down and make some improvements lately, and it's probably the difference between gaining that first round bye and making a viable run vs possibly losing in the 1st/2nd round, but the thought that the 2013 defense is better than any of these just isn't true...at all. Not even close.

 

[AzPatsFan]

In 2001, the Patriots were #6 in points scored and #6 in points allowed
In 2003, the Patriots were #12 in points scored and #1 in points allowed
In 2004, the Patriots were #4 in points scored and #2 in points allowed

Only proves my point. Thanks, Deus.

Now with our depleted Offense we are still 3rd in Points Scored,
And 9th in Points Allowed even with our terrible, injury racked, Defense.

It is actually much better than that now, that it's getting healthier, despite missing all the guys on IR. But as Tuna says: "You are what you are..."

 

[supafly]

David Givens was part to two Super Bowl winning teams.

Apparently someone thought he was better than a 7th round slow, possession only receiver, or he wouldn't have been offered a 5/25 deal way back in 2005 or 2006.

 

[supafly]

Only proves my point. Thanks, Deus.

Now with our depleted Offense we are still 3rd in Points Scored,
And 9th in Points Allowed even with our terrible, injury racked, Defense.

It is actually much better than that now, that it's getting healthier, despite missing all the guys on IR. But as Tuna says: "You are what you are..."

This current 2013 defense really stepped up down the stretch, and it made an enormous difference, but up until the MIA loss in week 15, they looked downright pitiful (aside from the obvious good play in SEPT).

Hopefully the past 3-4 games are more of what they really are, and they'll continue to play tough in certain areas.

It's hard to complain about the great progress they have recently made, but they'll have to continue to play over their heads to put us in any position on Sunday vs a very potent DEN offense. Hopefully they can get the job done.

 

[ATippett56]

Apparently someone thought he was better than a 7th round slow, possession only receiver, or he wouldn't have been offered a 5/25 deal way back in 2005 or 2006.

I would not call David Givens exactly slow:

David Givens | Notre Dame, WR : 2002 NFL Draft Scout Player Profile

 

[Deus Irae]

A true NT, Siliga has entered the situation, and the Bronks won't be as productive in the run-a-dope. Siliga wasn't there in the last game. Undersized Verano and Jones were blown off the LOS, while Spikes was limping about. Neither Hightower nor Collins had found themselves back then, either.

Jones is still undersized
Spikes is no longer available at all
Collins blows against the run

The Pats secondary is both now deep and more important, now healthy. That wasn't true last time.

This is looking to me, more and more like a replay of the "The Greatest Show on Turf" game, of some fame. The Pats can actually match up with competent DBs against ALL of Manning's weapons, just like they did to Warner's. Bob Kraft even remarked that he felt that way, too.

It depends on how you define "competent", I guess.

Our present WR corps of Edelman, Amendola, Collie and Vereen (and probably Tompkins and possibly Dobson) is bigger and better than the tiny Brown, Branch, Patten, and Faulk.

You're mixing up your years here, since Branch and Givens weren't even on the 2001 team but

2001 Brown was much better than 2013 Edelman
2001 Patten was much better than any 2013 WR not named Edelman

I'll take Blount, Ridley, Vareen over Antowain, Redmond, and Faulk too, by a country mile.

Yup

Today's Pats lines, both the Offensive and the Defensive are much better too.

Stop. Just stop.

2001 had Light. 2001 Light => 2013 Solder
2001 had Woody. 2001 Woody > 2013 Wendell
2001 had Andruzzi. 2001 Andruzzi > 2013 Connolly
2001 had Robinson-Randall. 2001 Robinson Randall = 2001 Marcus Cannon

2001 D-line was playing the 3-4, but Seymour >>>>>>>>>>>> all 2013 tackles, and Hamilton and Pleasant were still capable players.

 

[Deus Irae]

Only proves my point. Thanks, Deus.

Now with our depleted Offense we are still 3rd in Points Scored,
And 9th in Points Allowed even with our terrible, injury racked, Defense.

It is actually much better than that now, that it's getting healthier, despite missing all the guys on IR. But as Tuna says: "You are what you are..."

No, it doesn't. It completely blows your point out of the water, since it puts the lie to your claims. Your O.P. was terrible, and you're embarrassing yourself with your attempted defenses of it. You didn't think your post through, and it shows.