OT: BRADY or PAPI....

[Zeus]

Bill Russell over Wilt even though Wilt would torch him every time out there?

Well, this may be a bit off topic here but you have touched on a pet peeve of mine. I could not possibly disagree with this statement more strongly.

Bill Russell and Wilt Chamberlain were great rivals (and even better friends). If offense were all that mattered (a commonly held view), then Chamberlain would have the edge. That of course ignores the fact that Russell is the greatest defender and rebounder in the history of basketball and the most successful athlete in the history of team sports. Two NCAA championships, an Olympic gold medal and 11 NBA championships in 13 years. (In one of the two years that Russell failed to win an NBA championship, he missed the last two games of the finals with a severe anke injury.)

Chamberlain was a legitimately great player, but Russell absolutely owned him in the final score department and has the jewelry to prove it.

 

[AzorianPats]

Did you miss my first post?

Yes..yes I did

 

[sb1]

I don't know. People/fans/writers act like spygate was the biggest blackeye the sport has ever faced.

Perhaps that will resonate with a few uninformed voters, but it won't be nearly enough to keep them out.

 

[sb1]

What will sting more... seeing Ortiz in a NYY uniform, or seeing Brady in a Jets uniform.

That might help answer the question.

 

[TyronePoole]

It's impossible to compare the two. One is arguably up for discussion as one of the GOATS in his respective sport, while the other one is up for discussion just to make the Hall of Fame.

Now if we're talking about being clutch in the biggest stage, I can see how people would argue Ortiz is more clutch.

I guess the best way to compare the two is to put them in critical situations in the biggest game and which one would you feel more confidence in.

For example, who would you bet more on:

Brady in the SB, down 4 with 2 minutes to go?

Or

Ortiz bottom of the ninth 2 outs bases loaded down by 1 in the WS?

One can argue that Ortiz just needs to get a hit, but conversely he also just has one chance to get a hit. Brady in that 2 minute drive has 4 downs, ways to stop the clock, etc. It really does come down to which one makes the plays.

So who do you have confidence in to be clutch?

good post except that it's not even comparable on that level. You can't avoid the QB, you can avoid the DH. the Team cannot overcome a deficit without Brady, it can without Ortiz (and usually does) etc. It's an absurd positional comparison made even more absurd by the differences between the NFL and MLB.

 

[condon84]

good post except that it's not even comparable on that level. You can't avoid the QB, you can avoid the DH. the Team cannot overcome a deficit without Brady, it can without Ortiz (and usually does) etc. It's an absurd positional comparison made even more absurd by the differences between the NFL and MLB.

In that situation, how can you avoid Ortiz? You walk him, you tie the game?

 

[coolguy]

good post except that it's not even comparable on that level. You can't avoid the QB, you can avoid the DH. the Team cannot overcome a deficit without Brady, it can without Ortiz (and usually does) etc. It's an absurd positional comparison made even more absurd by the differences between the NFL and MLB.

what about about down 1 score with the baeses loaded? you can't avoid papi there as proven in alcs championship.

 

[coolguy]

In that situation, how can you avoid Ortiz? You walk him, you tie the game?

or give the red sox the lead in a tied game.

 

[IcyPatriot]

what about about down 1 score with the baeses loaded? you can't avoid papi there as proven in alcs championship.

You said you were done ...

 

[coolguy]

You said you were done ...

i'm done comparing the two

 

[Ring 6]

I don't know. People/fans/writers act like spygate was the biggest blackeye the sport has ever faced.

What people? I have not heard, seen or been told that by anyone.

 

[Ring 6]

lol at your entire post but particularly this. Are you joking?

Umm, he is right.

 

[Ring 6]

Sorry, but IMO you're wrong. The 3rd World Series title and the MVP will put Ortiz as the first DH into Cooperstown. Maybe not on the first ballot, but he will get in eventually. The fact that he HASN'T been linked directly to the "list" with the likes of Bonds and A-Hole will be to his benefit.

Baseball HOF voters have never been known to value being part of a championship as an important criteria. Its all numbers, and in the era he played in his are not HOF level. He could still get there but age isn't his friend. Jim Rice put up much better numbers, era adjusted, and almost never got in.
Like it or not he did test positive and admits it. That is the list that matters, and so far voters have shown they have no intention of allowing anyone associated with PEDs in.

 

[TyronePoole]

Umm, he is right.

there's literally zero objective metric by which this is the case but by all means, homer on

 

[Brady6]

Re: Re: OT: BRADY or PAPI....

what about about down 1 score with the baeses loaded? you can't avoid papi there as proven in alcs championship.

The best players in baseball succeed 30% of the time, so even if you can't avoid him the odds are in your favor.

 

[Ring 6]

there's literally zero objective metric by which this is the case but by all means, homer on

Of course there is. He wins more. He wins more in the playoffs. He has a better passer rating (efficiency) indoors and a better passer rating outdoors.
To call a statement that Brady is better than Manning homerish is to admit you either are uninformed or bias.

 

[RayClay]

Bill Russell. Not even close.

 

[Brady6]

Re: Re: OT: BRADY or PAPI....

I don't know. People/fans/writers act like spygate was the biggest blackeye the sport has ever faced.

Do you think Ortiz has never watched the catchers signs when he was on second? The Hernandez murder is more of a black eye in my opinion, watching extra video not so much.

 

[Brady6]

Re: Re: OT: BRADY or PAPI....

It's impossible to compare the two. One is arguably up for discussion as one of the GOATS in his respective sport, while the other one is up for discussion just to make the Hall of Fame.

The best comparison for Ortiz on a football level would be to Adam Vinatieri during our Super Bowl season.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

brady...without him the franchise may still be in the gutter today