Defense After 7 Games Is Really Good

[mgteich]

KUDOS TO PATRICIA ON GAME SEVEN
The defense gave up 20 points in regulation and scored 7. That is AWESOME, especially given the fact that they were playing without Wilfork, Mayo, Talib and Kelly.

GOING FORWARD

Hopefully we can get Talib and Kelly back soon. Cole was our #2 CB after Arrington was benched.

The Jones boys are a potent sack combination.

Amazingly, this is still a top 10 defense, certainly after Talib is back.

The defense will have a bad game or two (none yet). However, I don't think that defense is a liability. Instead they are a major plus for the team.

I am surprised that Fletcher cannot get reps. We just don't have any linebackers who can defend well over the middle.

 

[manxman2601]

After every game, Doug Kyed of NESN releases his breakdown of how the DBs fared in coverage. I can imagine in previous years such a report would have been unpleasant to read but I look forward to it this year.

Check out the season coverage stats below.

Dennard: 19-43, 334 yards, TD, INT

Arrington: 22-39, 280 yards, 2 TDs, INT, holding penalty

Mayo: 14-27, 146 yards

Gregory: 10-19, 139 yards, TD, pass interference penalty

Talib: 9-29, 139 yards, 4 INTs, pass interference penalty

Ryan: 8-15, 120 yards, TD

Hightower: 13-21, 113 yards

McCourty: 6-9, 86 yards, TD

Spikes: 3-6, 49 yards, INT

Collins: 4-5, 42 yards

Cole: 2-3, 19 yards

Harmon: 1-2, 3 yards

Ninkovich: 1-2, 2 yards

Read more at: Alfonzo Dennard, Devin McCourty Shine in Pass Coverage in Patriots-Jets Week 7 Matchup | New England Patriots | NESN.com

 

[everlong]

Somebody called up Felger and Maz and said compare the 16 game projected production of these two WRs.

A: 48 catches, 668 yards, 0 TDs
B: 132 catches, 1745 yards, 28 TDs

They both guessed Welker vs Amendola but the answer was receiver A was the 16 game average of Vincent Jackson, Julio Jones, AJ Green and Jimmy Graham when Talib is covering them and receiver B is games where Talib isn't. My total recall of the numbers presented are by memory so I might be slightly off but I'm pretty close. Those are simply amazing.

 

[manxman2601]

What impresses me most of all is that our secondary are doing it without any real boost in our pass rush (18 sacks this year, 37 total sacks last). They're getting it done purely on their respective abilities in coverage.

 

[supafly]

KUDOS TO PATRICIA ON GAME SEVEN
The defense gave up 20 points in regulation and scored 7. That is AWESOME, especially given the fact that they were playing without Wilfork, Mayo, Talib and Kelly.

GOING FORWARD

Hopefully we can get Talib and Kelly back soon. Cole was our #2 CB after Arrington was benched.

The Jones boys are a potent sack combination.

Amazingly, this is still a top 10 defense, certainly after Talib is back.

The defense will have a bad game or two (none yet). However, I don't think that defense is a liability. Instead they are a major plus for the team.

I am surprised that Fletcher cannot get reps. We just don't have any linebackers who can defend well over the middle.

Not sure I can fully buy what you're trying to sell as much as I would have last week.

Geno Smith and the Jets are a rookie QB with ZERO weapons. There is nobody...as a matter of fact, everyone was making fun of their lack of talent at the skill positions all week long. I don't honestly know if we'll face a worse offense all year.

Giving up 400+ yds doesn't sit as well with me as it seems to be doing with you. They moved the ball at will and jammed it down their throats plenty of times yesterday too. Let's not go overboard. At one point the Jets had converted their first 6 third down attempts.

We can stop with the "without Mayo and Wilfork" talk now because that is our 2013 defense moving forward. We don't get bonus points for once having them in our starting lineup. The fact is that our current defense may not be anywhere near what our defense had the potential to be, or was in the 5-6 games. That is a question to be answered moving forward.

I still think they are much better than anything in the recent years, just with some better secondary play. I'm sure they'll be better down the stretch run just like most seasons. They're definitely better, much better. The losses have also hurt tremendously though.

 

[mgteich]

The jets are what they are, a 4-3 team with a top 5 defense. Their offense will be better as Geno plays more game and Holmes returns.

This week the teams were about equal. I hope that our returning players will have us better by the playoffs.

Not sure I can fully buy what you're trying to sell as much as I would have last week.

Geno Smith and the Jets are a rookie QB with ZERO weapons. There is nobody...as a matter of fact, everyone was making fun of their lack of talent at the skill positions all week long. I don't honestly know if we'll face a worse offense all year.

Giving up 400+ yds doesn't sit as well with me as it seems to be doing with you. They moved the ball at will and jammed it down their throats plenty of times yesterday too. Let's not go overboard. At one point the Jets had converted their first 6 third down attempts.

We can stop with the "without Mayo and Wilfork" talk now because that is our 2013 defense moving forward. We don't get bonus points for once having them in our starting lineup. The fact is that our current defense may not be anywhere near what our defense had the potential to be, or was in the 5-6 games. That is a question to be answered moving forward.

I still think they are much better than anything in the recent years, just with some better secondary play. I'm sure they'll be better down the stretch run just like most seasons. They're definitely better, much better. The losses have also hurt tremendously though.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

Without Talib and Mayo...this D is just like last year. And it showed yesterday. Arrington was lost half the time out there.

Just goes to show how important Talib is to this team...sign him

 

[manxman2601]

Not sure I can fully buy what you're trying to sell as much as I would have last week.

Geno Smith and the Jets are a rookie QB with ZERO weapons. There is nobody...as a matter of fact, everyone was making fun of their lack of talent at the skill positions all week long. I don't honestly know if we'll face a worse offense all year.

Giving up 400+ yds doesn't sit as well with me as it seems to be doing with you. They moved the ball at will and jammed it down their throats plenty of times yesterday too. Let's not go overboard. At one point the Jets had converted their first 6 third down attempts.

We can stop with the "without Mayo and Wilfork" talk now because that is our 2013 defense moving forward. We don't get bonus points for once having them in our starting lineup. The fact is that our current defense may not be anywhere near what our defense had the potential to be, or was in the 5-6 games. That is a question to be answered moving forward.

I still think they are much better than anything in the recent years, just with some better secondary play. I'm sure they'll be better down the stretch run just like most seasons. They're definitely better, much better. The losses have also hurt tremendously though.

With respect, you must have been watching a different game. There were plenty of stops and without Geno's runs, which were a weakness, their run game would have been limited to 3.1 ypc. And without Mayo, Wilfork and Kelly, that's not just commendable, that's outstanding.

 

[Mack Herron]

Pass defense has been surprisingly good, but it is not all the secondary. Chandler Jones has stepped up his rush from last year, and we are getting better penetration up the middle from the rookies as well as Kelly. In addition, Mayo was having a great year. That highlights the fact that moving forward the defense will not be not the same defense that has played so well. Yesterday without Mayo, Talib and Kelly, the pass defense struggled mightily, especially with the slot and TE. Hightower is a coverage liability, while Arrington and Gregory were beaten repeatedly. Ryan and Harmon seem to be coming along, and Cole replaced Arrington, while Collins and Fletcher were not seen as ready to take on major roles. Stretched pretty thin now.

 

[supafly]

Without Talib and Mayo...this D is just like last year. And it showed yesterday. Arrington was lost half the time out there.

Just goes to show how important Talib is to this team...sign him

The setback of Arrington was tough to watch, especially after a 4m AAV contract in the offseason where Belichick viewed him as a potential starter on the outside yet again.

Hightower is limited, especially in coverage. He'll be eaten alive by any team capable of taking advantage of those matchups.

Talib is great, but those 2 reoccurring and chronically nagging injuries can pop up at any time between now and January. He's yet to finish out a whole season in his 5+ yr career. He's the wildcard of course.

Collins/Fletcher stepping up would be huge.

 

[supafly]

With respect, you must have been watching a different game. There were plenty of stops and without Geno's runs, which were a weakness, their run game would have been limited to 3.1 ypc. And without Mayo, Wilfork and Kelly, that's not just commendable, that's outstanding.

Again---the Jets did exactly what they set out to do, which was control the clock and run the ball down our throats. I saw a game where they converted 6 consecutive 3rd down attempts with zero real talent. Are we supposed to be impressed? I saw a team that looked good at times, while struggling to try and overcome their losses at other times. They are what they are, which is decent and improved, but far off what they should have been due to the injuries.

And once again, we don't get artificial bonus points because we had better players who are now injured. Is that what is going to be relied upon all season? "They are holding up pretty well considering the loss of Wilfork and Mayo?" Those guys are gone now....

I'm not saying that I'm not impressed by the defense a lot this year, but Talib and the inability/ability to avoid any new injuries (almost impossible) are obviously going to be the 2 biggest factors moving forward. At this point they are improved, but it also appears that those losses are going to be tough to overcome.

 

[Kontradiction]

It was really good up until yesterday. They played WAYYYY too much zone. If that's what we're looking at without Talib, then the team needs to get him locked up after the season. Either that, or find a more than suitable replacement.

 

[JackBauer]

especially after a 4m AAV contract in the offseason where Belichick viewed him as a potential starter on the outside yet again.

You're saying based on...?

 

[supafly]

You're saying based on...?

Not sure what the question is, but if you're asking about Belichick's comments about Arrington being able to play both inside and outside, he said as much. Bill Belichick made those comments describing Arrington's versatility and knowledge of our system.

Not only that we could use:

1) common sense based on the 4 m AAV since the top tiered contracts were around 5m

2) the fact that Arrington was holding down all of the outside reps in training camp too

 

[Mack Herron]

Again---the Jets did exactly what they set out to do, which was control the clock and run the ball down our throats. I saw a game where they converted 6 consecutive 3rd down attempts with zero real talent. Are we supposed to be impressed?

I think you are being too harsh. Any time you hold a team to 3.4 yards per attempt you are doing something right. In crunch time when the Jets tried to run it down our throats, they were stopped cold for an unsuccessful 57 yard FGA. The run defense did its job.

 

[supafly]

I think you are being too harsh. Any time you hold a team to 3.4 yards per attempt you are doing something right. In crunch time when the Jets tried to run it down our throats, they were stopped cold for an unsuccessful 57 yard FGA. The run defense did its job.

I think that you could be right. I wouldn't dispute that.

Sometimes we see the glass half full/half empty, depending upon the situation.

I certainly don't think the defense played "badly" yesterday at all, but I also don't think that they played as well as some others seem to feel.

I saw a team who played tough, but let's be honest---the NYJ offense shouldn't be posing us problems, converting 3rd and 20, converting 6 straight third down attempts, if they are anywhere near as good as some posters are stating either.

I think those injuries are going to pose more of a problem than I initially felt, or possibly than some are seeing it today. We'll have to see.

 

[Froob]

Not sure I can fully buy what you're trying to sell as much as I would have last week.

Geno Smith and the Jets are a rookie QB with ZERO weapons. There is nobody...as a matter of fact, everyone was making fun of their lack of talent at the skill positions all week long. I don't honestly know if we'll face a worse offense all year.

Giving up 400+ yds doesn't sit as well with me as it seems to be doing with you. They moved the ball at will and jammed it down their throats plenty of times yesterday too. Let's not go overboard. At one point the Jets had converted their first 6 third down attempts.

We can stop with the "without Mayo and Wilfork" talk now because that is our 2013 defense moving forward. We don't get bonus points for once having them in our starting lineup. The fact is that our current defense may not be anywhere near what our defense had the potential to be, or was in the 5-6 games. That is a question to be answered moving forward.

I still think they are much better than anything in the recent years, just with some better secondary play. I'm sure they'll be better down the stretch run just like most seasons. They're definitely better, much better. The losses have also hurt tremendously though.

If you take away the bogus field goal and the pick six they only gave up a net total of 13 pts(subtract 7 for the pick six). That's pretty damn good. And that was with them being on the field all day because the offense was going 3 and out the whole second half. Can only imagine if Chris Jones and Joe Vellano were rotating in and out with Wilfork and Kelly. But, such is life. With this d we can beat anyone. Unfortunately with this offense, we'll going to be in a lot of close games.

 

[manxman2601]

Not sure what the question is, but if you're asking about Belichick's comments about Arrington being able to play both inside and outside, he said as much. Bill Belichick made those comments describing Arrington's versatility and knowledge of our system.

Not only that we could use:

1) common sense based on the 4 m AAV since the top tiered contracts were around 5m

2) the fact that Arrington was holding down all of the outside reps in training camp too

And started there at the beginning of the season when we were in a base D.

 

[supafly]

I think you are being too harsh. Any time you hold a team to 3.4 yards per attempt you are doing something right. In crunch time when the Jets tried to run it down our throats, they were stopped cold for an unsuccessful 57 yard FGA. The run defense did its job.

I think that you could be right. I wouldn't dispute that.

Sometimes we see the glass half full/half empty, depending upon the situation.

I certainly don't think the defense played "badly" yesterday at all, but I also don't think that they played as well as some others seem to feel.

I saw a team who played tough, but let's be honest---the NYJ offense shouldn't be posing us problems, converting 3rd and 20, converting 6 straight third down attempts, if they are anywhere near as good as some posters are stating either.

I think those injuries are going to pose more of a problem than I initially felt, or possibly than some are seeing it today. We'll have to see.

One thing I don't want to hear anymore, is that they played "well, considering the losses of Wilfork and Mayo." Those replacements are what we'll have for the rest of the year, so that attempt at spreading good vibes isn't going to hold an ounce of water anymore.

In the world of heartfelt Hallmark cards etc--yes, I do think they played well despite those losses, but it just doesn't matter anymore. They aren't coming back, and the depth behind them is supposed to be sufficient. This is the NFL.

Again, maybe I am being too harsh? I just don't see how we can look at things realistically by continuing to bring up those losses and comparing the fact that "we didn't do as badly as some other teams would do" in that situation. The fact remains that those losses are likely to hurt, and were definitely noticeable at times (in my opinion).

 

[Mack Herron]

I think that you could be right. I wouldn't dispute that.

Sometimes we see the glass half full/half empty, depending upon the situation.

I certainly don't think the defense played "badly" yesterday at all, but I also don't think that they played as well as some others seem to feel.

I saw a team who played tough, but let's be honest---the NYJ offense shouldn't be posing us problems, converting 3rd and 20, converting 6 straight third down attempts, if they are anywhere near as good as some posters are stating either.

I think those injuries are going to pose more of a problem than I initially felt, or possibly than some are seeing it today. We'll have to see.

I just think it was not all bad. The offense put our defense on the field all day and the run defense still held up. I was impressed by our DTs. Third and 20 is inexcusable, however, and the pass defense reminded us of the stench from last year.